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Magick - Helping someone astral project
Zaden - May 17, 2008 - 05:04 AM
Post subject: Helping someone astral project
In either (or both?) Book 4 or Magick without Tears Crowley speaks of it being advantageous to learn to astral project with someone experienced at it. Do any of you have experience with astral projecting with someone? As in, they walk you through it?
Arianwen - May 17, 2008 - 05:54 AM
Post subject: RE: Helping someone astral project
It's funny, I just finished replying to a similar question on another site.
Keep in mind that in Crowley's lifetime; astral projection was a very new concept in the western world. I think he was trying to prevent someone new to the techniques from having a bad experience-like a safety net. You can probably get enough info beforehand in this day and age to where you're comfortable trying it alone.
I myself have not experienced astral projection 'with someone'; nor do I have enough experience that I feel qualified to teach another. I can, however, suggest a site which may be able to assist you in learning some techniques:
http://www.astralweb.org/
They offer a free online course-while I have not taken it- it appears they are in international organinzation-for whatever that's worth. And usually non-profits aren't out to scam people-at least from my experience, anyway, lol. Good Luck-you're about to enter a whole new way of seeing things!
annolumina - May 17, 2008 - 10:45 AM
Post subject: RE: Helping someone astral project
A handy site. And this seems like a good thread to re-post a question I asked a while back but which didn't get an answer:
Forgive if this is a dumb question. I have been trying to project - in the out of body Muldoon sense rather than the astral plane sense - for a while, and decided to make a Spare type sigil to help. But to make such sigils work I understand it is necessary to erase the aim of the sigil from consciousness, so should I stop all my bedtime relaxation and visualisation excercises for aiding projection on the grounds that doing so puts the aim into my conscious intention. ( I haven't had much verifiable success with any sigils, frankly ).
On the few occasions on which I have experienced a Muldoonish OOBE projection, it has followed the Muldoonish pattern. Wake up, out of body, with the 'silver cord' from the back of the OOB head to the sleeping-in-bed physical head. All of these projections have been brief, and I get dragged back into sleep after just a few minutes.
Hell, should I even be asking this question?? Asking the question puts the aim of the sigil in my conscious mind! Help!
Nataraj418 - May 17, 2008 - 03:00 PM
Post subject: Re: Helping someone astral project
Zaden wrote: › Do any of you have experience with astral projecting with someone? As in, they walk you through it?
1. Yes.
2. One can "try" to "walk" you through it, but that may or may-not work.
3. As AC said, the difficult part is probably going to be separating from the physical body.
4. Here is a technique that has always worked for almost anyone:
(a) You must start with a person who is able to easily slip out of their body (it's called "Astral Projection," and the person is called a "guru" or a "teacher" or an "adept" or an "accomplished projector," etc.).
(b) Then, of course, there must be a second person (the "student") who has not yet gotten out (or has, but is having difficulty doing it again).
(c) Give the "student" a liberal dosage of the power plant (or libation extract) of your choice. The "teacher" may or may-not require this, depending on his or her skill.
(d) After banishing and invocation, the teacher simply yanks the student out of his or her body. Repeatedly, if necessary, until the student can do it alone.
(e) Afterward, the student should find that he or she can do this without the support of a libation, although sometimes a few additional "supported" sessions might be necessary.
5. People can go "out" together, but both parties need to have the ability to get "out" on their own. In some cases, entire groups (composed of experienced individual members) can go to the same place. I am reminded of a group trip to the Wesak Valley in Tibet on the full moon in Taurus wherein 6 people all went to the same place and saw the same thing, and even interacted with each other while in that place.
Zaden - May 17, 2008 - 05:13 PM
Post subject: RE: Re: Helping someone astral project
Thank you all for the answers thus far. This is the line (from Liber O) that spurred this question:
"It may be added that this apparently complicated experiment is perfectly easy to perform. It is best to learn by "travelling" with a person already experienced in the matter. Two or three experiments will suffice to render the student confident and even expert. "-Liber O Section V.
So, for those of us with at least some astral experience, how would one "travel" with a less experienced student or companion? Any ideas?
Anno, perhaps your question would garner more response in a thread of it's own. It is a good question (sorry, no personal experience to advise you from here), but those who are not interested enough in this particular thread to open it, may be the very ones who could answer your question.
Tiger - May 18, 2008 - 06:30 PM
Post subject:
OOBE Topic
Well dare I announce I've had experiences stranger than a Muggle?
If you believe it or not "In This Dream we call the Living" (K.Grant)
I lay on my back during my bedtime relaxation and visualization exercises with open eyes see the red yellow green and blue dots between the dark spaces I would close my eyes and stay in that Asana until sleep half crept in. My eye lids would be closed but I could see I had to touch them to make sure they were closed. Then I learned how to slip out turning around looking at my body below, confusion set in wondering which is doing the looking.
After that stranger things ensued of which I keep silent and which made me stop my OOBE experiments. I still do my bedtime relaxation and some visualization exercises I tend more to get pulled or follow a magical thread when it occurs so to speak.
learn to astral project with someone experienced
What is safe ground ?
Once you begin to witness the strange and unbelievable the rational mind denies it or seeks to explain it on its own terms. Was it Hypnotism ? A ruse ? Dr Delgado, Mengele, CIA, KGB mind alteration techniques? Be careful.
If you are fortunate enough to meet an experienced Adept it definitely helps.
I've had Three though brief and fortunately or unfortunately survived.
Right Now out on the limb of Leng I've got some of Grants Grimoire to help me surf the astro etheric and happen chance on threads and vectors where several “orders” of reality converge and just witness the emanations and Refractions.
And of course the potency of Crowley manifesting here on Lashtal to give thanks for.
There's something to be said for winging it and doing your own work.
knowing what day and time it is, can be conducive but can be distractive, suspending it takes you out.
so much for my HookAhMaJookuM.
interesting questions.
Joseph486 - Jul 01, 2008 - 12:11 AM
Post subject:
I know a ceremony which can help awaken second sight and astral projection. If you wanted it I could mail it to you or simply express the desire to know it and ill post it on this forum.
93/93
annolumina - Jul 02, 2008 - 10:48 AM
Post subject:
Well, I haven't yet succeeded in a successful, intended OBE. But since no one has responded to my question in all the weeks since I posted it maybe I have succeeded in becoming invisible. Success is my proof.
Now I go away to sulk petulantly...
Lysenergy - Jul 23, 2009 - 02:52 AM
Post subject:
Joseph486 wrote: › I know a ceremony which can help awaken second sight and astral projection. If you wanted it I could mail it to you or simply express the desire to know it and ill post it on this forum.
93/93
Tell us! And to the poster above me, don't be sad! If you made a sigil to astral project you most likely will succeed doing so right when you give up on it. This seems to be the way sigils work, at least in my experience.
heartkore - Jul 23, 2009 - 03:39 PM
Post subject:
93,
When I was about 15 I tried for almost a year to astral project. I was using a technique where you basically go from toes to head tensing then releasing your muscles and "forgetting about them. Each night I would get to the point where all that I was aware of was my breathing. Then at the last moment, when I was about to not have connection with my physical body at all I would have a sort of "strobe light", jarring sensation (for lack of better words) and would immediately be back at the drawing board and in cold sweat.
I believe it was just my body's natural reaction to my mind being losing its awareness of my lungs breathing. Very uncomfortable.
Then I read something online somewhere that helped me and the next night I projected. I went up and out of the Earth's atmosphere with great speed, then I became scared and jolted back into my body. It was physically painful, but nonetheless I was excited.
I hope this very simple technique helps someone:
After you have quieted your mind and body, lay on your back with loose or no garments on. Try not to have a fan on or distracting noise. This next part may seem odd but it makes sense to me more now.
Imagine you are a child or your opposite sex. Imagine you are on a swing in the warm sun, swinging slowly. Make your environment around you as "real" as possible. Notice the birds, and the type of tree your swing is attached to. Feel the air on your face as you go back and forth. At the right moment when you have gained momentum, jump out of your swing and FLY
Just thinking about it makes me happy. It sounds strange, but taking yourself out of your element (hence the child of opposite sex) really worked for me. Hope someone likes this technique.
93 93/93
przm28 - Jul 24, 2009 - 07:45 AM
Post subject:
When I first got interested in projection, this niffty little book gave me some good insight.
OPHIEL: the art and practice of astral projection:
[url]http://thesilvercord.com/hu/books/ophiel.html[/url]
The DREAM METHOD chapter years ago was what I carried out orginally.
Had quite some experiences with that, which dont have patience to go into detail.
Also I suggest reading/studying some concepts/contemplating these books and creating techique for yourself. A positive aspect to this, would be that would soak like sponge some of the mental/fear issue's ect ect.
Cosmic Meditation by Micheal Bertiaux
[url]http://www.fulgur.co.uk/books/uk/cosmic-meditation/ [/url]
Nagualism by frank ripel
[url]http://www.frankripel.org/frankripel_nagualism.html
[/url]
The Goddess Sekhmet: Psycho-Spiritual Exercises of the Fifth Way by Robert Masters
[url]http://www.robertmasters.org/sekhmet/[/url]
For a year or so and sometimes regularly I would touch doors when walk through them, open windows and conciously get adjusted to the idea passing of worlds, realitys while in waking consciousness. What helped was perfecting a "vehicle" to travel in, that's basically what has became of my own method. As far as someone helping, I feel also that this is not needed.
Anyways hope this help's who-ever.
cheers
christibrany - Jul 28, 2009 - 04:20 AM
Post subject: yes joseph
please tell us your method of projecting
i have astral projected once fully but then was blind. and once half way and could see half way out but since then i have been unable to . mostly cuz of busyness and tiredness. but the succesfull one the full one was about a month or two ago. so im hoping to do it again soon. and not be blind hopefully.
wbwarnerb - Jul 31, 2009 - 04:24 PM
Post subject: RE: yes joseph
I was taught (whether true or not) that there are Objective OBE, and Subjective... one being fully consciously aware outside the body and the other having a portion of their mind aware outside, and relaying information via imagination to the mind in body.
A few years ago I had what I'd call an objective obe, and it scared me so much I've never gone back to it. I just do subjcetive obe now. Fear is failure, and I hate the fact it scares the hell otu of me, because it was amazing.
I got an objective OBE when I was reading a lot of Monroe's books on the subject and tried several techniques and fell asleep doing some of his exercises. I was asleep and remembered "walking up" consciously to a weird vibration on me... like a cat purring... (this was before I heard of Chakras)... and the vibration seemed to come from my groin area... it was distrubing. I still had my eyes closed and I moved to push away what was causing the vibration... (thinking my at was on my groin and purring!) only to realize nothing was there... and my hand feld "odd", so i opened my eyes and saw from my vantage point, my room, but from above... and the light in the room was more of a bluish hue. My "vantage point" appeared to be up high, near the ceiling.
My first thought was, "good one Brian, you died..." in that split second, I snapped back - Happy that i didn't actually die, but scared of the sensation.
I've been blocked on this every sense. I've been able to project part of my attention out... but the min i feel this "pull" out of body, my heart races in panic and i stop. It's pretty frustrating.
christibrany - Aug 07, 2009 - 04:00 PM
Post subject: RE: yes joseph
i have astral projected sucfessuly once, a few months ago and have been trying since then but not as seriously. my methods were lying on my back getting progressively more relaxed, sometimes i listened to monroes astral journey cd, the last one with just the binaural beats, and then projected once i was in the right frame of body asleep mind awake. it is possible without the cds too but they help as most people myself included are not ALWAYS able to relax the proper depth on their own.
i picture and more importantly FEEL myself standing up and see and feel how everything does and then the dichotmy is such that you will project into the mode that you are FEELING. so i would imagine if you used your tactile etc imaginations to feel you were a cat and saw as such you would become an astral cat.
it is a great and important activity, i just wish i had more time to practice it again when i was not so tired. because falling asleep is no good.