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Anticredos
Post subject:   PostPosted: Jul 03, 2008 - 07:57 PM



Joined: Aug 11, 2007
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I've recently become obsessed with a piece by Panufnik - the beautiful, elegiac Autumn Music. From what little I've read it seems he too was obsessed with mystical proportions, yoga and so on. I really must explore his work further.

I've never been able to get into Scriabin... or most work for large forces... the impersonal sound of massed instruments doesn't really do it for me. I find myself with too much mental baggage relating to film music and the pomp and circumstance of late 19C music to give myself to the actual music. The Panufnik piece (for chamber orchestra without violins) is probably the first piece for a larger ensemble that I have truly enjoyed.
 
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BlueKephraOffline
Post subject: Re: musick  PostPosted: Jul 03, 2008 - 09:25 PM



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Oberon wrote: › Scriabin's, 'Poem of Ecstasy' and 'Prometheus. The Poem of Fire.'

If only Scriabin hadn't died so young, having completed only a few works in his mature style. The other pieces are an attempt to fill the gap left by this loss.


Just thinking about that, have you ever heard of the English composer John Foulds (1880-1939)? Can do no better than quote from the description in the CD booklet of the piece "Three Mantras From Avatara, op61b Of Action And Vision of Terrestrial Avatars. Of Bliss and Vision Of Celestial Avatars. Of Will and Vision of Cosmic Avatars"

"The 'cosmic' Mantra III(of Will) is marked Inesorabile (inexorable) and is some of the most barbaric and elemental music Foulds ever composed.It's also a strict modal study on a South Indian Raga, using only seven pitches (at various octave transpositions) throughout and rigorously composed in a kind of chaconne on a seven-beat subject that is present, yet always changing shape, in virtually every bar.This balefull music generates a gigantic cumulative kinetic energy, over which Foulds constructs some hair-raising polyrhythmic complexities.The culmination is a shattering explosion of controlled orchestral power."
That was composed in 1930, but was first played in 1997. Someone else ahead of his time?
 
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andrewriuttaOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Jul 04, 2008 - 03:30 AM



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Dead Can Dance
Acid Bath: "The sound of the ocean is dead, it's just the echo of the blood
in your head."
Tori Amos: " . . . and all the angels; and all the wizards black and white
are lighting candles in our hands."
Black Tape for a Blue Girl
Loveliescrushing
Tool
Philip Glass
Erick Satie
Henryk Goreki, specifically "Goreki Miserere"
Cradle of Filth
The Biggies: Bach, Beethoven and Wagner
Jocelyn Montgomery
Peter Gabriel: The Temptation of Christ soundtrack
(This one goes
particularly well with The Book of Lies, I've noticed)


Andrew
 
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OberonOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Jul 04, 2008 - 08:25 PM



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Anticredos wrote: ›
I've never been able to get into Scriabin... or most work for large forces... the impersonal sound of massed instruments doesn't really do it for me. I find myself with too much mental baggage relating to film music and the pomp and circumstance of late 19C music to give myself to the actual music. The Panufnik piece (for chamber orchestra without violins) is probably the first piece for a larger ensemble that I have truly enjoyed.


If you find Scriabin too lurid and overwrought I would recommend Debussy. According to the English composer and occultist Cyril Scott - who claimed contact with one of Madame Blavatsky's Masters - Debussy was the first modern musician to employ modes last used by the black magicians who caused the downfall of Atlantis, no less. Whether you believe that colourful story or not Debussy's music does radiate an atmosphere of magick and the numinous; several of his works having been inspired by the Great God Pan, among who's devotees will be found one Aleister Crowley.
 
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OberonOffline
Post subject: Re: musick  PostPosted: Jul 04, 2008 - 08:35 PM



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BlueKephra wrote: ›
Oberon wrote: › Scriabin's, 'Poem of Ecstasy' and 'Prometheus. The Poem of Fire.'

If only Scriabin hadn't died so young, having completed only a few works in his mature style. The other pieces are an attempt to fill the gap left by this loss.


Just thinking about that, have you ever heard of the English composer John Foulds (1880-1939)? Can do no better than quote from the description in the CD booklet of the piece "Three Mantras From Avatara, op61b Of Action And Vision of Terrestrial Avatars. Of Bliss and Vision Of Celestial Avatars. Of Will and Vision of Cosmic Avatars"

"The 'cosmic' Mantra III(of Will) is marked Inesorabile (inexorable) and is some of the most barbaric and elemental music Foulds ever composed.It's also a strict modal study on a South Indian Raga, using only seven pitches (at various octave transpositions) throughout and rigorously composed in a kind of chaconne on a seven-beat subject that is present, yet always changing shape, in virtually every bar.This balefull music generates a gigantic cumulative kinetic energy, over which Foulds constructs some hair-raising polyrhythmic complexities.The culmination is a shattering explosion of controlled orchestral power."
That was composed in 1930, but was first played in 1997. Someone else ahead of his time?


Thanks for the recommendation. Foulds has been on my list for a while now. There is so much great music out there. I will definitely investigate the works you mention.
 
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Anticredos
Post subject:   PostPosted: Jul 04, 2008 - 09:47 PM



Joined: Aug 11, 2007
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Oberon wrote: › If you find Scriabin too lurid and overwrought I would recommend Debussy. According to the English composer and occultist Cyril Scott - who claimed contact with one of Madame Blavatsky's Masters - Debussy was the first modern musician to employ modes last used by the black magicians who caused the downfall of Atlantis, no less. Whether you believe that colourful story or not Debussy's music does radiate an atmosphere of magick and the numinous; several of his works having been inspired by the Great God Pan, among who's devotees will be found one Aleister Crowley.


Yeah, I can handle Debussy - although again I prefer small groups of instruments. I heard his piano (4 hands) reduction of La Mer last year - amazing!

The book Debussy in Proportion: A Musical Analysis by Roy Howat has some interesting info on Debussy's readings of Eliphas Levi, use of magic squares and so on. Intersting to hear Scot's interpretation of the downfall of Atlantis as being due to music - reminds me of those Chinese and Greek notions popularised by Hesse about the health of a nation being audible in its music...
 
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fugazi32Offline
Post subject: RE: musick  PostPosted: Jul 04, 2008 - 10:02 PM



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No way! Rock & Roll doesn't make sense on entheogens, it's all about rave music: Jungle Tekno, Darkside Hardcore, etc............takes you OUT THERE! Opinion of course... 93.

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OscillateOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Jul 04, 2008 - 10:53 PM



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My 'playlist' is constantly changing, but it has recently centred on:

Astrobotnia (a Rephlex-signed techno outfit)

Cran (trad Irish/Celtic)

Napalm Death

Electric Six

Killing Joke (Tabazan from the 'Night Time' album is a particular favourite).

Until finding Lashtal I never knew that Jaz Coleman had an interest in esoteric knowledge but it certainly makes sense. Can any Killing Joke fans (Paul?) direct me to any 'must hear' albums as I only have 'Night Time' at the moment?

Regards,

XO
 
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DogstarOffline
Post subject: RE: musick  PostPosted: Jul 04, 2008 - 11:13 PM



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Popol Vuh and early Marcos Valle

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JohnSOffline
Post subject: RE: musick  PostPosted: Jul 04, 2008 - 11:56 PM



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Well, with regard to the original post and 'mood enhancers', in my opinion, Crowley would have embraced Lysergic acid, without a doubt.
Don;t get me wrong, I am not endorsing the use of this chemical. Undoubtably though, AC would have tripped the dark, fantastic.
But we will never know.
The veil was torn asunder in many different ways by the Master with his consorts.
The seers were mainly female (except for dear Victor), energised by alchohol, prolonged sex, sleep deprivation etc.
10 mikes may have made all that redundant.
The veil is thin but first you have to find it.
 
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lashtalOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Jul 05, 2008 - 11:36 AM
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Oscillate wrote: › Can any Killing Joke fans (Paul?) direct me to any 'must hear' albums as I only have 'Night Time' at the moment?

I'd start with the relatively recent Democracy and Pandemonium...

Once you've become addicted to their glorious ceremonies, you'll be pleased to hear that they're performing Pandemonium at The Forum, London, on Saturday 4 October 2008. I'll certainly be there.

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OscillateOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Jul 05, 2008 - 11:58 AM



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Thanks for that Paul. I think they would be an awesome band live so will see about getting tickets.

Regards,

XO
 
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Fr-NoctisOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Jul 05, 2008 - 02:10 PM



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Coph Nia
 
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rzkOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Jul 05, 2008 - 02:15 PM



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Ulver, especially albums such as Shadows of the Sun, Blinded by Blood and Perdition City.

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nashimironOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Jul 07, 2008 - 01:55 PM



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Chaoticum have recently produced a trailer for their latest album which is released by a Czechoslovakian record label called Horus Cyclic Daemon who also release lots of stuff folks here might find quite appealing. It's worth checking out and can be viewed here:

http://www.horus.cz/www_hcd/presentation.htm.

Horus CD are also about to release an album by Silence and Strength which is a tribute to Gustav Meyrink who wrote "The Golem".

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przm28Offline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Jul 07, 2008 - 04:22 PM



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Fredrik Thordendal's Special Defects


http://www.myspace.com/fredrikthordendalsspecialdefects
Twisted Evil
 
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rzkOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Jul 07, 2008 - 05:56 PM



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Lapis Niger - At the Throne of Melek Taus.
Highly recommended!

Lapis Niger symbolises the black diamond of Draconian Alchemy, the eternal star of Thaumiel of the Qliphotic Qabalah. Thus following a magician“s inner journey, this musical expression opens up the gate to the world of Samael, averse counterpart of the Sephirah Hod in the Qabalah. At The Throne of Melek Taus draws inspiration from the world of the Yezidis, the small Kurdish sect that still worships Melek Taus, the peacock god, also known as Shaitan.

http://www.arsregia.org/release_page.php?IDitem=36





One song available on myspace:
www.myspace.com/lapisniger616

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RobCurley
Post subject: Re: musick  PostPosted: Jul 10, 2008 - 08:02 PM



Joined: May 26, 2008
Posts: 21
Location: Central London
seajay wrote: › just curious-what age are some of the posters here and what musickal interests??do you think crowley would like donovan??ive read that crowley would have hated "hippie"culture-is that true?ac being fond of,well,recreational pharmeceutical research i wonder what his take on lsd would be-imagine crowleys commentary after taking 200 mics of owsley acid and seeing jefferson airplane!!just kidding-please list a couple of your musickal interests-ill start
3 aforementioned bands
ravi shankar-bill monroe-miles davis-bob marleyetc etcj-28-phx,az



ps-is this too off topic??


Hi Seajay,

To go back to the question about Ol' Crow - well he admitted himself he didn't have a musical bone in his body. He had no feeling for it. This is no critisicm - with the vast talents he had something else had to go. As William Burroughs said of himself, his own talent for writing necessarily implied a deficit in other areas. To develop one part of yourself in one life means you cannot do so in another area unsympathetic at the same time. So artists are rarely practical.

Also it's absurd (I mean this generally, as it's a common question) when people say this about A.C. re. music - it amounts to a time-travel idea: placing an early 1900's gentleman in a festival field in "the swinging sixties". The only equivalent I can think of is Vivian Stanshall (although this wasn't his background) - of whom Stephen Fry said: 'He was one of the most talented, profligate, absurd, infuriating, unfathomable and magnificent Englishmen ever to have drawn breath." So very Crowleyan.

A.C. said of himself: "It is sure without question that I have always been insane." So the disciplined 'Mountaineer' side of him would have utterly despised and dismissed the "Hippie" ethos - destined to submerge and die in some friend's sofa because they wanted to "do their own thing, man." But the drug devotee and general "tryer of all things" side of A.C. would have jumped in & indulged, of course.

But he would have been the person in the corner of the 'drug room' freaking everyone out because of his natural 'all encompassing' presence. There's an amusing idea about this at the end of Robert Anton Wilson's "Masks of the Illuminati".

It'd be fun to try and show Crowley how to play a guitar chord sometime. A more interesting question (I think) is what music would Crowley make himself..? (Page comes to mind..! It's no coincidence that the most influential guitarist of our times - no, I will not argue - is a Thelemite.) But if Crowley was a musician, he would have been in the "Bonzo Dog Doo-Dah Band".

On that tack, what do you think about Dylan Moran's idea, that if a vagina could sing it would sound like 'Enya'?

In LVX,

Rob.

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WalterfiveOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Jul 10, 2008 - 10:27 PM



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Well, muskically I'm very diverse. I have over 3000 CDs, and another 1500 or so LP records, and hundreds of music performance DVDs, Laserdiscs, and videotapes.

I like classical music like Mozart, Beethoven and Wagner, of course. I still play dozens of Showtunes from Musicals that I have done with various theatre companies in the pre-Army days of my youth like "Hair" and "Pippin" and "West Side Story". Musical comedy like Spike Jones, the Goons, Monty Python, Mick Conway, and all that Doctor Demento comedy pop stuff of the 20's, 30's, 40's, 50's, 60's and 70's.

I *adore* old jazz like Bix Beiderbecke, Louis Armstrong's Hot Five and Jelly Roll Morton's Red Hot Peppers, 20's & 30's Jugband and Whoopee Music, Delta blues like Robert Johnson and Son House but also Piedmont Blues like Blind Boy Fuller and Barbecue Bob Hicks...

I like 50's/60's Lounge with the Rat Pack and Bobby Darin, and 50's Rockabilly and Rock & Roll, Eddie Cochran, Buddy Holly, pre-Army Elvis, Jerry Lee Lewis, Little Richard, Bo Diddley, etc. but I also like classic rock like Pink Floyd, Led Zeppelin, Jimi Hendrix, the New York Dolls, and the MC5, appreciate so-called "Heavy Metal" like Sabbath, BOC, Rainbow, Judas Priest, Metallica until about 1990 or so, and even find some insight and value in specific Hip-hoppers like Matis Yahu and Immortal Technique (don't knock either of 'em if you haven't heard 'em).

Most other music in the last 30 years other than Punk leaves me cold. Disco, Rap, Techno, House, Hiphop, Triphop, Emo, Seattle Sound, etc... it's all product. There's little artistry to be found (with the rare exceptions like Prince, En Vouge, TLC, Divine).

I also like Hank Sr., Willie Nelson, Johnny Cash, David Allan Coe and Robert Earl Keen.

I've often wondered what Crowley thought (if he thought of it at all) of composers contemporary to him like Edgar Varese...

When I sing, (and I do, at the constant request of my friends, occasionally for audiences up to 1000 and more as an opening act or guest on-stage with my *real* musician friends,) I sing dirty blues, bawdy songs, back-room ballads, salty shantys, and what you lot in the U.K. call "Rugby Songs" often variously accompanying myself on washboard, jaw harp, foot-cymbal and jazz horn (a 20's style of kazoo); I'm a proud amateur; I never had the eye-hand-finger-coordination as a kid to learn to play anything more than a bit of piano, but since I've had friends and family who are professional musicians all my life, I understand musical composition, some music theory, chord structure, could read and write music (once upon a time) and appreciate the various incarnations of the Terpsichorian muse, but I'm unable to learn how to play more than 8 chords on a Ukelele or Tenor Banjo, so I pretty much leave it alone.
 
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tsardanielOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Jul 11, 2008 - 08:36 PM



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Nice diversity...the spice of musickal lfe.

I have one that stands above all the rest:
Music(k) is the Best: ZAPPA is king.

Walterfive wrote: › Well, muskically I'm very diverse. I have over 3000 CDs, and another 1500 or so LP records, and hundreds of music performance DVDs, Laserdiscs, and videotapes.

I like classical music like Mozart, Beethoven and Wagner, of course. I still play dozens of Showtunes from Musicals that I have done with various theatre companies in the pre-Army days of my youth like "Hair" and "Pippin" and "West Side Story". Musical comedy like Spike Jones, the Goons, Monty Python, Mick Conway, and all that Doctor Demento comedy pop stuff of the 20's, 30's, 40's, 50's, 60's and 70's.

I *adore* old jazz like Bix Beiderbecke, Louis Armstrong's Hot Five and Jelly Roll Morton's Red Hot Peppers, 20's & 30's Jugband and Whoopee Music, Delta blues like Robert Johnson and Son House but also Piedmont Blues like Blind Boy Fuller and Barbecue Bob Hicks...

I like 50's/60's Lounge with the Rat Pack and Bobby Darin, and 50's Rockabilly and Rock & Roll, Eddie Cochran, Buddy Holly, pre-Army Elvis, Jerry Lee Lewis, Little Richard, Bo Diddley, etc. but I also like classic rock like Pink Floyd, Led Zeppelin, Jimi Hendrix, the New York Dolls, and the MC5, appreciate so-called "Heavy Metal" like Sabbath, BOC, Rainbow, Judas Priest, Metallica until about 1990 or so, and even find some insight and value in specific Hip-hoppers like Matis Yahu and Immortal Technique (don't knock either of 'em if you haven't heard 'em).

Most other music in the last 30 years other than Punk leaves me cold. Disco, Rap, Techno, House, Hiphop, Triphop, Emo, Seattle Sound, etc... it's all product. There's little artistry to be found (with the rare exceptions like Prince, En Vouge, TLC, Divine).

I also like Hank Sr., Willie Nelson, Johnny Cash, David Allan Coe and Robert Earl Keen.

I've often wondered what Crowley thought (if he thought of it at all) of composers contemporary to him like Edgar Varese...

When I sing, (and I do, at the constant request of my friends, occasionally for audiences up to 1000 and more as an opening act or guest on-stage with my *real* musician friends,) I sing dirty blues, bawdy songs, back-room ballads, salty shantys, and what you lot in the U.K. call "Rugby Songs" often variously accompanying myself on washboard, jaw harp, foot-cymbal and jazz horn (a 20's style of kazoo); I'm a proud amateur; I never had the eye-hand-finger-coordination as a kid to learn to play anything more than a bit of piano, but since I've had friends and family who are professional musicians all my life, I understand musical composition, some music theory, chord structure, could read and write music (once upon a time) and appreciate the various incarnations of the Terpsichorian muse, but I'm unable to learn how to play more than 8 chords on a Ukelele or Tenor Banjo, so I pretty much leave it alone.
 
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tsardanielOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Jul 11, 2008 - 08:37 PM



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and the age is 41, BTX

Do What thou Wilt, and Nothing More
tsardaniel wrote: › Nice diversity...the spice of musickal lfe.

I have one that stands above all the rest:
Music(k) is the Best: ZAPPA is king.

Walterfive wrote: › Well, muskically I'm very diverse. I have over 3000 CDs, and another 1500 or so LP records, and hundreds of music performance DVDs, Laserdiscs, and videotapes.

I like classical music like Mozart, Beethoven and Wagner, of course. I still play dozens of Showtunes from Musicals that I have done with various theatre companies in the pre-Army days of my youth like "Hair" and "Pippin" and "West Side Story". Musical comedy like Spike Jones, the Goons, Monty Python, Mick Conway, and all that Doctor Demento comedy pop stuff of the 20's, 30's, 40's, 50's, 60's and 70's.

I *adore* old jazz like Bix Beiderbecke, Louis Armstrong's Hot Five and Jelly Roll Morton's Red Hot Peppers, 20's & 30's Jugband and Whoopee Music, Delta blues like Robert Johnson and Son House but also Piedmont Blues like Blind Boy Fuller and Barbecue Bob Hicks...

I like 50's/60's Lounge with the Rat Pack and Bobby Darin, and 50's Rockabilly and Rock & Roll, Eddie Cochran, Buddy Holly, pre-Army Elvis, Jerry Lee Lewis, Little Richard, Bo Diddley, etc. but I also like classic rock like Pink Floyd, Led Zeppelin, Jimi Hendrix, the New York Dolls, and the MC5, appreciate so-called "Heavy Metal" like Sabbath, BOC, Rainbow, Judas Priest, Metallica until about 1990 or so, and even find some insight and value in specific Hip-hoppers like Matis Yahu and Immortal Technique (don't knock either of 'em if you haven't heard 'em).

Most other music in the last 30 years other than Punk leaves me cold. Disco, Rap, Techno, House, Hiphop, Triphop, Emo, Seattle Sound, etc... it's all product. There's little artistry to be found (with the rare exceptions like Prince, En Vouge, TLC, Divine).

I also like Hank Sr., Willie Nelson, Johnny Cash, David Allan Coe and Robert Earl Keen.

I've often wondered what Crowley thought (if he thought of it at all) of composers contemporary to him like Edgar Varese...

When I sing, (and I do, at the constant request of my friends, occasionally for audiences up to 1000 and more as an opening act or guest on-stage with my *real* musician friends,) I sing dirty blues, bawdy songs, back-room ballads, salty shantys, and what you lot in the U.K. call "Rugby Songs" often variously accompanying myself on washboard, jaw harp, foot-cymbal and jazz horn (a 20's style of kazoo); I'm a proud amateur; I never had the eye-hand-finger-coordination as a kid to learn to play anything more than a bit of piano, but since I've had friends and family who are professional musicians all my life, I understand musical composition, some music theory, chord structure, could read and write music (once upon a time) and appreciate the various incarnations of the Terpsichorian muse, but I'm unable to learn how to play more than 8 chords on a Ukelele or Tenor Banjo, so I pretty much leave it alone.
 
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BlueKephraOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Jul 11, 2008 - 10:29 PM



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Scriabin's "Poem Of Ecstacy" is on the First Night Of The Proms next Friday, bbc2
 
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RavenOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Jul 12, 2008 - 08:07 AM



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If Crowley were still alive today I believe that he would loudly play and endorse Celine Dion, David Hasselhof and Chris de Burgh. But his particular favourite would have to be Cliff Richard.
Perhaps Liber Jugorum would be particularly effective if Agadoo or the Birdy Song were used to yoke the Will.
 
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Etu_MalkuOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Jul 13, 2008 - 04:40 PM



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Isn't everyone here really discussing just music?
Musick is more of the metaphysical aspects of sound and vibration.
 
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WalterfiveOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Jul 14, 2008 - 05:42 PM



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tsardaniel wrote: › Nice diversity...the spice of musickal lfe.

I have one that stands above all the rest:
Music(k) is the Best: ZAPPA is king.


I saw Zappa three times, once in Frankfurt Germany in 1984, and twice in Boston in 1989 (IIRC) on his "Broadway The Hard Way" Tour (I shook Ike Willis' hand the second night, during the break, he signed my ticket too!).

Frank was amazing. Not only could he play beyond the ability of all but a handful of jazz & rock guitarists, but he could *compose* exactly what he heard in his head and communicate it to other musicians through writing a musical score, or to a computer through a computer/musical instrument known as a Synclavier. But Frank didn't buy into all this Kozmic Debris...
 
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ChrischibnallOffline
Post subject: musick: sex and drugs and r-r-ragtime?  PostPosted: Jul 16, 2008 - 10:32 AM



Joined: May 31, 2006
Posts: 27

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I used to be very interested in classical music and was especially keen on Wagner, Bruckner, Elgar and Scriabin. However, on a lighter note, I also liked Gilbert and Sullivan, as I suspect did Crowley, since there are occasional quotations from their operettas in his works. Nowadays my tastes are decidedly more middle-to-low-brow. A few years ago, I got into 20s and 30s dance band and swing. The Savoy Orpheans, Jack Payne, Henry Hall, Al Bowlly, etc. Nowadays my tastes are a bit more modern... 50s and 60s lounge, the Rat Pack, exotica. My favourites at the moment are Martin Denny, Robert Drasnin, Les Baxter and Yma Sumac. I would imagine that Yma Sumac would interest a lot of people here. Possessed of an amazing five-octave vocal range, she's been described as "the singer with a nightingale and a jaguar in her throat": I think she would have interested Crowley in a "scarlet woman" kind of way, and in my experience it is women who tend not to like her... perhaps jealous of her feminine power? A poster over at Tiki Central (recommended) once said something along the lines of "my wife won't let me play Yma Sumac because she's convinced she is a Peruvian witch and her music is evil... I won't be letting her smoke that stuff again".
If you get just one of her albums, get "Voice of the Xtabay": it contains her hit "Virgin of the Sun God", AND the music is by Les Baxter... definitely a two-genius production!!
 
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