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Interpreting, dissecting and analysing Spare parts


Karlir_Johanarnt
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What's the purpose with the Thanatos part of the forum?
I know that writers have their own style of writing. Grant writes for example pretty vague, seen from the exoteric public. At least to follow Grants thought one need to do a hell of a lot of research to fill the gaps (maybe a part of his educational system?). For instance he's written a lot of stuff about sigils and atavism, but avoids analyses of specific illustration or Spare's kundalini yoga. Andrew Chumbley condemned everyone who tries to collaborate dissecting and analysing the Azoetia, trying to keep the secret within the esoteric spheres. Who do you Austin Osman Spare wrote to but humanity? Do you encourage or condemn a collaboration, dissecting and analysing AOS work outside of the O.T.O? Surely a lot of collaboration can may be done on his alphabet. I've actually tried do make it a project for the norwegian Mensa, the brightest people in Norway. What about that?


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Karlir_Johanarnt
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Who do you think Austin Osman wrote to but humanity?


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Michael Staley
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"Karlir_Johanarnt" wrote:
What's the purpose with the Thanatos part of the forum?
I know that writers have their own style of writing. Grant writes for example pretty vague, seen from the exoteric public. At least to follow Grants thought one need to do a hell of a lot of research to fill the gaps (maybe a part of his educational system?). For instance he's written a lot of stuff about sigils and atavism, but avoids analyses of specific illustration or Spare's kundalini yoga. Andrew Chumbley condemned everyone who tries to collaborate dissecting and analysing the Azoetia, trying to keep the secret within the esoteric spheres. Who do you Austin Osman Spare wrote to but humanity? Do you encourage or condemn a collaboration, dissecting and analysing AOS work outside of the O.T.O? Surely a lot of collaboration can may be done on his alphabet. I've actually tried do make it a project for the norwegian Mensa, the brightest people in Norway. What about that?

There's no purpose to the Thanatos forum, beyond it being a forum where people can discuss Spare's work and life.

I don't think that Spare was writing specifically for humanity. Like many artists, writers, etc he had a drive to create, which he expressed.

Spare's work has nothing whatever to do with the O.T.O. He had a brief association with Crowley, but was never a member of the O.T.O. An insight into Spare's work is there for anyone who saturates themselves in it, whether they are in the "esoteric spheres" or not.

What on earth makes you think that members of Mensa are more likely to understand it? Join Densa and fight back.

Best wishes,

Michael.


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Karlir_Johanarnt
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One definition of intelligens is the ability to recognize patterns, and that is exactly whats needed to solve the jigsaw.
For instance in the illustration " The Eye of ecstasy" there is two Hexagrams the first Hexagram theres one T on top of, the other one theres tre T on top of.
Where is the second hexagram with two taps on? It's in the realization of karma image. What are the 8 eyes in The eye of ecstasy? The star one sees in the second position picture, and the table in the frontispiece (karmawheel). What are the Tre black boxes in the realization of karma picture? well the same three boxes is the front on the table of the table karma wheel. What about the signs below the W containing two O's. Actually one finds them in the picture in the preface to selflove picture. At the end of the sentence: And i Alone in the dominion of (three glyphs) Never again shall I Become ....a realization of karma (?) The fishy figure in the realization of karma is symetrical and oposite to the figure in obsessions incarnatin


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Karlir_Johanarnt
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The X and + signs also appears in some images one above the other, these illustrations are related.
Letters is as the illustrations a mystical design, but it is possible to make a meaning out of it if you interpret them in context, as all AOS's knowledge is relational
The pattern in obsessions incarnating illustration A dot Omega and a five glyph below suggests the meaning is related to the trinity of belief, will, and desire. It might be a personal language, but as stated in symbolism: any symbolic language can be transcribed with INTELIGENCE


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Michael Staley
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In my opinion, intelligence is of little help here. Intuition is of more use.


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Karlir_Johanarnt
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Intuition? Does it really help if its all about aligning complex patterns, recognise analogies? Intuition belongs to the right brain hemisphere, the same as the space feeling/geometry, surely one needs analytical skills too.


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Michael Staley
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"Karlir_Johanarnt" wrote:
Intuition? Does it really help if its all about aligning complex patterns, recognise analogies? Intuition belongs to the right brain hemisphere, the same as the space feeling/geometry, surely one needs analytical skills too.

Again in my opinion, it's not a matter of "aligning complex patterns". In The Book of Pleasure many of the small drawings and marginalia are what he calls "exteriorisation of sensation" or something similar. These drawings were done quickly, in order to glyph sensation. I do not believe that there is more encoded in them than that, and I do not believe that they yield to intellectual study, analysis, pattern recognition, etc.

Best wishes,

Michael.


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michaelclarke18
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One definition of intelligens is the ability to recognize patterns, and that is exactly whats needed to solve the jigsaw.

Then, I wonder what looking at the pattern of the whole of the artistic output of Spare, would would tell us? I'm probably not the biggest fan of Spare, but it is interesting how his use of materials differed throughout his life; I wonder how they relate to anything occult that he may have experienced or perhaps rather more mundane factors relating to their reproduction.

for example, initially much of


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Karlir_Johanarnt
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MichaelStaley: Some parts might be scribbles (semi-automatic) but overall the book is a giant construction. Even the text indicates that they're serial/jigzaw. One finds the text vision through the sense of touch both as a title of one illustration and in the illustration death posture:second position. Nothing is coincidental in this book.

michaelclarke18: thats the point, one can find many references to for instance The Book of pleasure, and in many cases one has to know the Book of pleasure to understand the underlying meaning, as in the paintings Sorcery where the same table (karma wheel) as in frontispiece from (BOP) occurs and where a fish karma is being burned away by the kundalini. Pictures in Focus of life I'm quite sure is painted chakra dreams. And whats fascinates me about Spare is that his teachings are real, Kundalini is real, no matter what religion one belongs to, whether its practised by Christians or Satanists.


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Michael Staley
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"Karlir_Johanarnt" wrote:
MichaelStaley: Some parts might be scribbles (semi-automatic) but overall the book is a giant construction. Even the text indicates that they're serial/jigzaw. One finds the text vision through the sense of touch both as a title of one illustration and in the illustration death posture:second position. Nothing is coincidental in this book.

Nonetheless, I have found that intuition is of more use than intellectual analysis in understanding this book. You seem to have a problem in accepting that we can have different understandings of and approaches to Spare, depending on differences in outlook, experiences, etc. My own approach has been primarily an intuitive one focusing through his artwork, and only secondarily via intellectual analysis.

Best wishes,

Michael.


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Karlir_Johanarnt
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No I don't have a problem with your approach, I'm just say that different approaches spawn different results, and it seems like everyone regards his letters as a intuitive language. When applied in practice that may be the truth, but as illustrations they may also serve other purposes.


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Karlir_Johanarnt
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If the language is symbolic it also conveys meaning (from the consciousness), there are some sigils spread around also, though.


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Karlir_Johanarnt
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I think I reconsider some of my above statement. I found a webpage regarding Intuition in Math: Sensible Intuition and Praxis
in the Philosophy of Mathematics of Descartes and Frege: http://www.hf.ntnu.no/fil/ansatte/olavg/descfreg.htm
My conceptual understanding and use of the intuition concept was too narrow :=)


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lashtal
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Again, I have to ask you to stop serial-posting or 'bumping' the threads in which you participate.

Owner and Editor
LAShTAL


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Karlir_Johanarnt
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Yes, I shall stop posting serial posting immediately. I just really think The eye of ecstasy illustration serves as a good example on the multi directional (hypertextual) nature of The Book of pleasure document. Where everybody actually would have expected the second hexagonal, one finds instead a five figure up and left, the exact direction of the eye in The Deathposture: Second position. And the letters below is written in a style common to just one other illustration, the untitled illustration in Sigils the psychology of believing. And I really think it would be futile to utilize some of the methodology presented in symbolism (economisation) on the book itself, to re-cloth the symbols in pure geometric forms to unobscure the book.


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Karlir_Johanarnt
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correction: five figure pointing up and left. sorry


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 Anonymous
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I rally don't think that your approach is really going to lead to any useful or definitive insights. Staley is quite right by stating the importance of the intuitive faculty here. Spares artwork wasn't meant to be a series of cryptic and occult statements meant to be cracked by some decoder ring.


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Karlir_Johanarnt
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Stomach feelin alone won't help you! It's to big and complex, spread through out the whole book. Without pen and paper or photographic memory you won't success. Spare got a silver medal in geometry, so his intellectual powers was second to none (actually he was, he got silver).
The Book of pleasure isn't cryptic in the sense of a code (at least that I know of, even though many ask them selves what purpose the O,L.C.O'CS has), but it is broken up, encrypted by the author himself to allow just the self appointed devotee to grasp it all.
The Book of Pleasure - pure, crystalised intellect (Austin Osman Spare's IQ-test) - which only the worthy and cunning will pass.


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Karlir_Johanarnt
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"I will make common sense the foundation of my teaching. Otherwise, how can I convey my meaning to the deaf, vision to the blind, and my emotion to the dead? In a labyrinth of metaphor and words, intuition is lost, therefore without their effort must be learned the truth about one's self from him who alone know the truth ... yourself" (The Book Of Pleasure page 43)


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Michael Staley
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So your own intellectual approach is the only valid way into Spare, eh? Clearly, I've been wasting my time all these years . . .

"Weary, weary, saith the scribe . . . "


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Karlir_Johanarnt
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Don't shoot the messenger! Blame K.Grant πŸ™‚ I'm sure he knows though (and don't ask me why he hasn't written about that aspect, as it would give eye sight to many people fumbling in the dark, and collaborations would be taken on to another level) Paradigms are hard to break. I'm sure your previous experiences will assist you and others in the further work on BOP


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Michael Staley
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"Karlir_Johanarnt" wrote:
Don't shoot the messenger! Blame K.Grant πŸ™‚ I'm sure he knows though (and don't ask me why he hasn't written about that aspect, as it would give eye sight to many people fumbling in the dark, and collaborations would be taken on to another level) Paradigms are hard to break. I'm sure your previous experiences will assist you and others in the further work on BOP

And what should we blaming Kenneth Grant for?


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Karlir_Johanarnt
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I know you've written some articles/essays on similar topic. It would be nice if you could spread the word further to the masses, upload it to scribd and other knowledge databases.


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Karlir_Johanarnt
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He could do more to initiate others into the book, as he is one of the greatest experts on the field (I'm not saying that it is his duty though), as a works composition is quite essential. And I meant it in a humourous way, of course! Clownish me πŸ™‚


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