Cairo 1904: Looking For Information  

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RTC
 RTC
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13/12/2019 5:01 pm  

@ignant666 - "I wish someone would just spell it out for us dolts."  I am now well into my doltage and would also appreciate a taste of the delicious solution in a low-fat, easily digestible form.

Since the three keys required to solve this riddle (described as "not rocket science,") are available, and the general intent of the riddle is reasonably predictable, surely it is within the capacity of LAShTAL members to collectively solve it... Surely.  Maybe our enlightened Webmaster will guide this quest? 


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Jamie J Barter
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13/12/2019 8:23 pm  
Posted by: @shiva

I thought this was not an occult site. Secret messages, refusal to reveal. ...

What was that AC said about unnecessary secrets and mystery being an "enemy"? 

Looks like the metaphorical thumbscrews may be in danger of being broken oot here on Lashtal (the forum)!  So then, who's going to be shown to have the Biggest Secret and/or is the Biggest Bluffer in terms of a/the big reveal?

1) Paul

2) Faustian

3) RTC

4) herupakraath

5) ozzzz666

6) elitemachinery

Any more for any more?

NormaN Joy Conquest

 


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Shiva
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14/12/2019 12:05 am  
Posted by: @jamiejbarter

What was that AC said about unnecessary secrets and mystery being an "enemy"? 

He said the IX* was secret because he took oaths of secrecy, and you couldn't get the secret unless you paid the fees and dues or caught his fancy.

Posted by: @jamiejbarter

who's going to be shown to have the Biggest Secret

Me. You may be a co-revealer (reveler) if you have some (anything will do) small, unknown, or unrelated, data ... with some form (anything will do) of proof. Please do not offer a treasure map of Al Kahira.

And just who was "Anonymous" in this thread? I suspect it was Aiwass.

 


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wellreadwellbred
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15/12/2019 9:45 am  

lashtal (Owner and Editor): "'The Riddle' was discussed on this site and I pointed out that the solution wasn't exactly rocket science and was certainly no secret. "

2 yes or no questions to you lashtal (Owner and Editor):

1) Is it in this the tread that "'The Riddle' was discussed on this site and I [= you] pointed out that the solution wasn't exactly rocket science and was certainly no secret. "?

2) (If no, is your answer to said question 1), can said discussion mentioned by you, where "'The Riddle' was discussed on this site and I pointed out that the solution wasn't exactly rocket science and was certainly no secret. ", still be found on this site?


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Shiva
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15/12/2019 5:14 pm  
Posted by: @wellreadwellbred

2 yes or no questions to you lashtal (Owner and Editor):

I believe you will find said Lashtal to be exercising the fourth power of the Sphinx. He has made it clear that has folded his Atu cards and doesn't want to go there.

Regardless of whether (or not) any of our Cheshire cats has a realistic, practical answer to any riddle, cipher, or code, what is interesting is that each one has implied that they know the solution/answer, but (for some reason) will not reveal it, instead employing a serial game of hints.

This should be the next occult/sci-fi blockbuster on TV ...

The Game of Hints

&f=1&nofb=1

Behold, it is revealed by Aiwass ... Not me!


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Tiger
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15/12/2019 10:07 pm  

Shift from the place of not getting it.
Then possibly,
it might be revealed,
that behind seemingly settled matters;
nuanced interpretations might glimmer,
something
more
than a resolution.

So if you want to abide
in the place where in the future
loose ends will be tied up;

all right

there


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RTC
 RTC
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16/12/2019 12:38 am  

@tiger - ... and your above helps, how?

 

 


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Shiva
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16/12/2019 1:48 am  
Posted by: @therealrtc

tiger - ... and your above helps, how?

Tiger is advising patience ... or time travel. Maybe both.


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Jamie J Barter
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16/12/2019 9:40 am  

Do you almost always have to speak up for Tiger, Shiva?  Do you think he is not capable of explaining his  generally bullshitty posts for himself? 

"No offence",

N Joy

 


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Tiger
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16/12/2019 10:52 am  

It’s right there.

Connect with that.

Moxie the instance
unlimited.

Transpose the gridlock.

Replace the A with an o and the I with a le add a space to get the tong.

tOng LEn

It’s right in front of you don’t you see ?

ok
secuse the jazz palaver


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ignant666
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16/12/2019 2:58 pm  

Well, that's you told, Jamie B.

Or perhaps not, Tiger being the "riddle wrapped in an enigma hidden in a koan"-style poster that he has become.

I think he is at worst harmless, and sometimes useful. Perhaps Jamie and others would care to chip in to pay for a series of typing lessons for him? Or maybe just a new keyboard not afflicted with a "hair trigger" return key?


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Shiva
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16/12/2019 4:13 pm  
Posted by: @jamiejbarter

Do you almost always have to speak up for Tiger, Shiva?

Whenever the word always (or never) is used, it is a "red flag" indicating someone is probably exaggerating or otherwise bending the truth to make a big deal out of something. There are exceptions, i.e. "I always wake up in the morning." Which is true ... until I don't. Then it's no longer an exception. I'm sure you can find some Tiger posts where I didn't translate his word art.

Posted by: @jamiejbarter

Do you think he is not capable of explaining his  generally bullshitty posts for himself? 

"No offence",

If I were him, and I'm not, I would take offense, as you start in on the personality attacks while derailing the thread.

I think we were wandering around the dark alleys of Cairo in 1904 ...


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Tiger
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16/12/2019 5:00 pm  

@jamiejbarter
What makes you on about
Shiva putting his input on my art ?
and my your mind in my posts;
nice to know my posts have an air about em.


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Jamie J Barter
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16/12/2019 11:05 pm  
Posted by: @shiva

Whenever the word always (or never) is used [etc etc etc blah blah blah]

Who's nit-pickin' now?

As you didn't appear to notice, that's why I put "almost" in  - coz it seemed as if it was (near enough) always even if it wasn't - certainly more often than not.

Posted by: @shiva

If I were him, and I'm not,

But you just like speaking (up) for him though, don't you!  Like a ventriloquist - or an older brother coming to the rescue afraid his sibling can't fend for himself...

Posted by: @shiva

I would take offense,

Which is why I put "no offence".  You know what that means? (=not actually wishing to cause offence despite appearances). 'sides, again : who asked you!?

Posted by: @shiva

as you start in on the personality attacks

No - I was criticising the posts, as in their style & content, not the individual (whom I do not know)

Posted by: @shiva

while derailing the thread.

If you look carefully you'll see it wasn't me who started doing that, your honour!...

Posted by: @tiger

What makes you

Just think you could do so much better, going by <the minority  of> your posts which are unpretentious & quite intelligible tiger, is all.

What fun ?!  Back to topic everyone !?

A Noy

 

 


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Shiva
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17/12/2019 5:40 am  

Nity-nity ("No - Not this!)


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christibrany
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17/12/2019 7:12 pm  

@ptoner

Are these AC posts on your blog available still and how would one find them?

I checked your personal blog and arts and culture and couldnt find.

 

thanks!


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ptoner
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ptoner
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17/12/2019 8:16 pm  

I had made some posts private, mainly AC related, due to work reasons. It should be public now. 


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christibrany
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17/12/2019 9:17 pm  

Awesome; thank you sir. 

🤡


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herupakraath
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19/12/2019 3:28 am  
Posted by: @shiva

 

This announcement (by hpk) was three years ago ... and this timely thread started in what? 2007? Twelve years ago. The codes of the gods grind slowly.

What I thought was a rabbit hole ended up leading to other side of the galaxy and back--who knew? I just got back, but I just left: blame it on Einstein and Rosen.

III Page16

The image above demonstrates the grid was not added to page 60 of the Liber L  manuscript until years after it was written.

E = 1   T = 2   O = 3   H = 5   S = 6   I = 7   N = 8   R = 9  L = 10   D = 11   U = 12   F = 13   M = 14   Y = 15   W = 16    
B = 17   C = 18   G = 19   P = 20   K = 21   V = 22   J = 23   X = 24   Q = 25   Z = 26

The gematria system above is derived from the letter counts of the Book of the Law. I started working with it 10 years ago, and when I tried to post some of my work with it here, I was mocked by the folk folly: consequently, my detractors have sacrificed the possibility of learning the secrets of the Universe much sooner than they could have.

There is an obvious paradox in using a gematria system derived from the letter counts of a book to encrypt secrets within it; the book needed to be completed before the gematria system could be created, while the book could not have been completed without the gematria system if it were used to encrypt ciphers and secrets within the text: the Secret Chiefs call it the Paradox of the Letters.

Grid line

In the image above, the line started off being drawn across page 60 in what was more or less a straight trajectory; after it passes through the word Beast, it veers measurably to the right, causing it to miss the letter Y in Try. The deviation also causes the line to pass across the corner of grid E5, where it then veers downward slightly causing it to pass through the letter A at the end of the line, and stops precisely on a grid boundary, despite the evidence there was no grid present when the line was drawn.

The line passes through the letters STBETISAYFA. The grid squares the line passes through have been marked with the letter coordinates that represent them: C,C,C,D,D,E,E,E. Enumerating the letters STBETISAYFA with the gematria system above, produces the value 79; enumerating the grid coordinates with gematria also produces the value 79, which serves as evidence the correct gematria system has been applied to the intersected letters. The other two keys must also be assigned values using the gematria system exampled. If someone can apply the gematria system to the second key correctly, I'll explain what both of the keys mean, and in doing so, demonstrate the author of the verse had knowledge of one of most remarkable discoveries of 20th century before any human being did.


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wellreadwellbred
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19/12/2019 2:39 pm  

lashtal: "For the avoidance of doubt, and in order to prevent further distraction: I will not be responding to further calls for publication of the 'solution'. There are far more interesting topics that merit further research around the Cairo Working..." (Source: An analysis of the watermarks on the sheets of Liber L vel Legis - - - https://www.lashtal.com/forums/thelema-2/an-analysis-of-the-watermarks-on-the-sheets-of-liber-l-vel-legis/paged/2/#post-101888)

Not publishing the 'solution', will at least not get in the way of herupakraath being a gift that keeps on giving with respect to 'solutions' to the Deus ex Machinas and McGuffins that AC included in The Book of the Law that he authored.

A style of writing similarly peppered with Deus ex Machinas and McGuffins, is now rising a shitstorm and causing bad reviews with respect to the the last installment of the Star Wars saga, The Rise of Skywalker.


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wellreadwellbred
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20/12/2019 1:39 am  

RTC: "I am now well into my doltage and would also appreciate a taste of the delicious solution [...] Since the three keys required to solve this riddle [...] are available, and the general intent of the riddle is reasonably predictable, surely it is within the capacity of LAShTAL members to collectively solve it... Surely. Maybe our enlightened Webmaster will guide this quest?"

RTC, on the first page of a thread on this site titled 'The Inauguration of Aleister Crowley’s New Aeon of Horus' (source: https://www.lashtal.com/forums/thelema/the-inauguration-of-aleister-crowleys-new-aeon-of-horus/#post-101426 ), you state that "... had Crowley seen the [Horus-]toy prior to 1902, I’d bet that the Cairo literature wouldn’t exist. The toy would have functioned, as intended. Crowley would have realised that it, essentially, renders all other materials obsolete (including his own stuff) ..."

This implies that your Horus toy renders AC's The Book of the Law obsolete, so to what possible gain would you appreciate the solution of a riddle within such an obsolete book??


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kidneyhawk
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20/12/2019 2:51 am  

wellread-

I will guess that you've not yet read RTC's booklet?

You write "This implies your Horus toy...." i.e RTC's item/object/technique/revelation.

Inauguration does not employ the term "Horus Toy" nor does it suggest that IT belongs to RTC.

RTC sees Crowley as encountering this Reality without having a hope in hell to grasp the Totality. He then devotes his life to trying to grok its Fullness  while proclaiming the liberating aspects of the Current as The Law of Thelema. 

I am only adding these comments as RTC is pointing at a "something" in his most recent book which he understands Crowley as having encountered long before HE did.

Liber AL and our studies into its CREATION have a lot to say about Crowley's "contact" and Crowley, himself, is, of course, a fascinating "case study" in our line of work here.  In fact, for many of us, Crowley has paved the way and led us, to some degree or another, to where we presently stand. 

I would agree that AC, AL and all this Thelema business is neither compulsory or necessary. 

But it's wonderfully fascinating...and poetic.

I don't think THAT equates the "obsolete."

  


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Shiva
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20/12/2019 3:00 am  
Posted by: @wellreadwellbred

AC included in The Book of the Law that he authored.

"Scribbled," not authored. Aiwass is proclaimed everywhere as the author. AC was just the scribe.

I have considerable experience in "channeling" (what they used to call "automatic writing." It seems, to the scribbling scribe, that it is a separate entity who is either dictating or moving one's fingers. Decades of research and practice have shown me that it's not any separate entity, or praeterhuman whatnot, that is doing this dictating or writing.

I guess it's like the Re-pubic-ans and the demon-crats, or the Tories and the Labour-ers, but here at LAShTAL we have the believers in praeterhumanity and the naysayers who know it to be that Jungian deal called the anima (soul). To each, his or her own belief system.

Posted by: @RTC

Maybe our enlightened Webmaster will guide this quest?

I guess you missed it ... see below ...

Posted by: @lastal

lashtal: "For the avoidance of doubt, and in order to prevent further distraction: I will not be responding to further calls for publication of the 'solution'.

Posted by: @wellreadwellbred
... renders AC's The Book of the Law obsolete
 
Yeah, that's what Mr. White said in 1984: "All prophecies, including The Book of the Law, are obsolete." This is because we have entered a period where time is moving so fast that prophecies simply get entangled, and can no longer be relied upon.

 


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kidneyhawk
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20/12/2019 3:31 am  

Shiva-

I think most of us caught Paul's clear statement.

My question is WHY NOT give the solution? And I seriously doubt that it is because there are "far more interesting" aspects to the Cairo Working.

There seems to be the suggestion that 2:76 describes a map of Egypt.

 

Beyond this, there is no comment on how this is of any significant import.

 

So...what is the profound conclusion to the line drawn, circle squared etc.

 

Crowley wrote that this verse “appears to be a Qabalistic test” for the “Heir to the Beast.”

 

SO....no map of Egypt...and the number noodling resumes....

 

UNLESS we focus in on the word “appears.”

 

Crowley does say the solution will manifest “sublime simplicity and carry immediate conviction” (it's a nice thought but HOW would HE know?).

 

Now, apparently, Jones delivered it all to AC.

 

AC declared ALL SOLVED with Achad's revelations...including 2:76. But I have found no further comment from Crowley on just how Achad's AL/31 revelation unlocks 2:76.

 

According to Paul, the matter isn't “rocket science.”

 

According to Crowley, it was opened “like a flower” with Jones.

 

And yet here we are still puzzled by the cryptic verse and awaiting that “sublime simplicity” which we are not convinced of by Crowley/Jones and of which our Webmaster will not comment upon further.

 

I have my own speculations as to why Paul would declare his knowing and then retreat into reticence. It's rather ironic as folks have all tried to take RTC to task for his teasing of a revelation. Why state you're “in the know” and then go all coy on Team Lashtal when asked to explain?

 

Yes, there is a reason and “all is not aught.”


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Shiva
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20/12/2019 7:10 am  
Posted by: @kidneyhawk

AC declared ALL SOLVED with Achad's revelations...including 2:76. But I have found no further comment from Crowley on just how Achad's AL/31 revelation unlocks 2:76.

I have found nothing further, as well.

Posted by: @kidneyhawk

Yes, there is a reason and “all is not aught.”

That's because "all is naught," as I often like to say.


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RTC
 RTC
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20/12/2019 2:36 pm  

@wellreadwellbredThis implies that your Horus toy renders AC's The Book of the Law obsolete, so to what possible gain would you appreciate the solution of a riddle within such an obsolete book??” – The Horus Toy® (available from all good stockists, soon) is a hugely-upgraded means of generating ‘Magickal punch’ comparable with its predecessor, Sex Magick (The Osiris Toy).  Crowley ‘lucked’ into it just once (the experience changed his life, forever).  However, he failed to comprehend what actually ‘got him there’.  Harking back to my earlier puberty simile - The Cairo literature is perhaps akin to an inaugural wet dream.  There are hazy flashes, physical evidence, and an inkling that another piece of the great mystery has frothed into place... but much remains veiled.

My interest in the riddle ignited only a few weeks ago and has now assumed great significance not because of what the solution reveals.  Rather, because of its impact on the bigger picture.

@kidneyhawkMy question is WHY NOT give the solution? And I seriously doubt that it is because there are "far more interesting" aspects to the Cairo Working. I echo this.

It's rather ironic as folks have all tried to take RTC to task for his teasing of a revelation. Why state you're “in the know” and then go all coy on Team Lashtal when asked to explain? – and sign-up for that one! 

Over the last few days, I’ve chased various lines of thought and have made considerable progress towards a solution which @lashtal described as ‘acceptable to Crowley/Aiwass(or words to that effect, without digging-out the exact quote).  In the near future I will post this research here in hope that other members nurture it to fruition.

With reference to the solution, I note the following: Crowley incorporated this riddle into the AL manuscript during the formative period of his evolving construct.  During this early phase, Crowley is to receive the AL manuscript from an Egyptian Adept, therefore he (Crowley) is the “one who comes after.”  Later, Crowley changed his plan and went directly to Aiwass (no Egyptian Adept middle-man), therefore, he (Crowley) became ‘the one(not ‘the one who comes after’).  Crowley originally included the riddle to subsequently self-validate his claims, but from his then perspective of ‘the one who comes after.’  Its solution may conflict with his major revision (i.e. the published version we know today).  The clash may be quite ugly.

My research thus far strongly supports the above.  I do wonder if Paul’s reticence is a manifestation of his desire not to be the one who sunk Crowley’s AL boat, with his own riddle.  If so, I certainly appreciate the dilemma, but...

@kidneyhawk - Yup!  Crowley ‘inspires,’ and that’s the trick.  Inspiration leads to True Will, which leads to the manifestation of genius (which inspires, etc.) – An ever-expanding mesh of synchronised resonance.  Crowley glimpsed the power source, claimed it as his own and erected a toll-booth around something that’s freely accessible to all.  Bad, Crowley... Tut, tut, tut...

 


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