Crowley wrote about her changes in The Equinox of the Gods too, if I recall correctly. I'm not sure her alterations would make a difference, as we've always known them that way. Or if anything would've happened differently as a result of different wording, that is unknown
And after her time with Crowley, what happened to "Leah Sublime?"
And her view of "Thelema?"
And after her time with Crowley, what happened to "Leah Sublime?"
And her view of "Thelema?"
I remember reading in one of tthe recensions of The Great Beast that eventually she went back her home country (Switzerland, I think it was), became a school teacher again, and embraced Catholicism. Perhaps her views on Thelema were coloured by her ill-treatment by Crowley.
I had said that I had forgotten where I had read about Leah attempt to change Liber Legis, when in fact my answer was found only a few post back with this post I posted in response to Katrice.
Proximal Authority
The Changing Role of Leah Hirsig in Aleister Crowley’s Thelema, 1919–1930
In: Aries
An footnoted discussion of the erudite calibre and so presents what might be countenance of the crumbling and now roofless Abbey...AndOpen to the celestial canopy!
I had forgotten
It's great that you found The Lost Manuscript - I missed it the first time around. Very interesting indeed.
Aspiring Authors, Authorities, and Prophets should note how proper tales are told, in a clear manner, with references for almost everything.
I think I shall just sit quietly on what I have read, for now.
What had caught my attention was this:
"Crowley believed she was in direct contact with the Secret Chiefs, and she conversed with Aiwass about passages in Liber AL.66 Nevertheless, it is clear that Crowley had decisive authority in terms of interpreting the visions. For example, one of Leah’s communications suggested an alteration to the original text of Liber AL, which was never incorporated.67" --White, Proximal Authority: The Changing Role of Leah Hirsig in Aleister Crowley's Thelema, 1919-1930
Where Footnote 67 concerns: "November 3, 1923, in Hirsig, ‘Alostrael’s Visions’; cf. Liber AL I:45."
So from missing manuscript to not reading the footnotes correctly, it would seem that Leah wanted to change~
If anyone might know the details, then sharing would be appreciated! Thanks~
@hadgigegenraum Yes. Go and read RTC's book Liber al vel Bogus. By the way, I thought this was the AI thread.
@toadstoolwe
No fungi this is the Abbey of Thelema thread, and the topic brought up something concerning Aloastrael.
For those interested, look up past mushrooms, or here below, as quoted
What had caught my attention was this:
"Crowley believed she was in direct contact with the Secret Chiefs, and she conversed with Aiwass about passages in Liber AL.66 Nevertheless, it is clear that Crowley had decisive authority in terms of interpreting the visions. For example, one of Leah’s communications suggested an alteration to the original text of Liber AL, which was never incorporated.67" --White, Proximal Authority: The Changing Role of Leah Hirsig in Aleister Crowley's Thelema, 1919-1930
Where Footnote 67 concerns: "November 3, 1923, in Hirsig, ‘Alostrael’s Visions’; cf. Liber AL I:45."
So from missing manuscript to not reading the footnotes correctly, it would seem that Leah wanted to change~
I v. 45 "The Perfect and the Perfect are one Perfect and not two; nay, are none!"For those who can traipse on over to the Warburg, then what the change that she envisioned, as Scarlet Woman, is said to be found at:October 20–November 11, 1923, in Aleister Crowley, ‘Typescript Diaries’, OSH4: 44, Gerald J. Yorke Collection, Warburg Institute, London; Hirsig, ‘Alostrael’s Visions’. footnote 66.If anyone might know the details, then sharing would be appreciated! Thanks~
@hadgigegenraum I cannot remember any proposed change by Alostrael in her "Visions". What I remember is that she wanted to stop CCXX being used and circulated before III:39 was fulfilled (that's the "All this and a book to say how thou didst come hither... etc." verse). What I also remember is that you will find another pro-fill argument in it and that she dated the Liber L dictation on April 7-9, 1904. It would really be cool to see a well researched edition of her diaries.
Go and read RTC's book Liber al vel Bogus.
Your conversion to the dark side is now apparently complete. It has been and absolutely mind-blowing experience to watch you, with your eyes wide shut, walk into the web and get ensnared. I send you hope and help from other spells, but there is a slight chance that the spider will eat you.
I thought this was the AI thread.
No. Some people tried to turn it into the AI thread. It is an AI Interpretation of AL thread. Obscure portions of AL are now being dissected. Since AL = AL, it's close enough to fit.
HG, that whole story is a rather long and drawn out, shining example of cult withdrawal.
The concept that "officers" are in-place on the inner planes, ready to "overshadow" or "inhabit" a willing vehicle is not lost on me, for I have described this phenomenon, long ago, in my first book.
The question is, what level of the "inner planes" is involved - in any particular case ? Because the levels vary. The most superficial is astral, and this is most common. Astral means "bad news" - no Inner Order to back it up, and it's all glamour and illusion..
At the other extreme end of the spectrum, we can sometimes find archetypal images that can back up this "overshadowing" process, making it cosmic in scope - or at least "more real" than the astral crap that is rather prevalent.
Anyway, it sure took a long time for her to detach. I am concerned (but not deeply) with her 8=3 oath and its implications. Lots'a people take that oath. A similar version is taken in the Orient ... and taking that oath makes one, by definition, a Bodhisattva. [cue laughter - what a joke]
From the impress of the report, Leah wanted to retain independent charismatic authority, or perhaps the transferred or granted authority for a charismatic figure. But waite! If she was an 8=3, fulfilled not just an oath, she would either have no need for charisma or it would have surfaced of its own accord.
Where Footnote 67 concerns: "November 3, 1923, in Hirsig, ‘Alostrael’s Visions’; cf. Liber AL I:45."
Ah, I see my "Alostraels Visions" begin January 1924, though it says October 1923 on the cover. Have to search a little, these are all old-school xeroxes I obtained decades ago, I think from Syracuse University.
Your conversion to the dark side is now apparently complete. It has been and absolutely mind-blowing experience to watch you, with your eyes wide shut, walk into the web and get ensnared. I send you hope and help from other spells, but there is a slight chance that the spider will eat you.
There is a possibility that your hopes and spells are efficacious. I am currently constructing Tibetan Tantric Mandalas, and One can't help but be exposed to mantras that are designed to both enlighten, and protect from illusions, demons, or black magic. "Adhi-sha-ta-hum-hum-hum-hum-phat" "or Sha-ta-Swaha-Adhi-sha-ta-hum-hum-hum-phat". However, I see no harm in getting another perspective.
I am currently constructing Tibetan Tantric Mandalas
This is good.
Note: The deepest (oldest, pre-Buddha) Tibetan concepts can be found to override Thelema. AL itself, and AC in a few places, pays homage to the core Oriental concepts ... perhaps I should do extracts to illustrate this point - but Thelema is essentially a Chokmah (Will) deal, while the Orientalists are playing around in Ain Soph Aur - maybe without the Aur.
However, I see no harm in getting another perspective.
If you were to ask me, which you haven't, where to look for a 1st, 2nd, or 3rd opinion, I would point my finger at the Moon, then laugh, and point toward Tibet. I can only recommend those things (elements, emblems, concepts) that are drawn from before EB (era buddhii).
If you were to ask, "But what about this other Shinola?" pointing your finger at some religion, or philosophy, or liber-ary..
I would reply, "No way Hose-say." Because they don't work.
Work?
Yes, they pacify (some) people's dependent needs. It is like welfare, but the parishoners actually, usually, pay the church, temple, synagog, or Abbey
But ... the Eastern approach exposes the aspirant to the Void at the beginning. Then follows the curriculum for re-getting their without the teacher's help. This is where Western folk get shut out. The curriculum is described, but not in Libers and not readily available from Amazon, eBay, or the local Spirit Book Store. So what does one do?
Well, first they need to have the initial encounter ... either with the Light (HGA) or the Void. After that, I only recommend the A.'.A.'. curriculum, although I've picked up a few tricks from outside that line, and there are a few things inside that line (curriculum) that are not essential, and may be subject to overlooking or by-passing.
That's it. The ultimate, not-yet-to-be-surpassed, most practical "How to do It" system of liberation (from the mind) available in the West.
I have not received money, sex, candy, or other favors for endorsing this system. Except for bibliophiles (hard-copy hard-cases), I recommend the purchase of one (1) copy of Gems from the Equinox. Used copies in good condition, without scribbling or food particles are cheap. This one complete collection of the curriculum, after The Book of Lies, is the only book one needs.
"Wants" is not needs.
After anyone has done all that, I recommend sticking ones proboscis into Tibet.
I am fond of reading autobiographies of (obviously) advanced Tibetan initiates ... seeing how they handled the CCP invasion and their getting out. This is good to study, as we can see how their "attainments" hold up under what is probably the extremist challenge on the physical plane - evading the enemy ... and the bandits, too.
@shiva Thank you again for your razor-sharp insights. Tibetan Buddhism and Bonpo, the original metaphysical philosophy of Tibet, have a rich canon of Magical (K) texts, and talismans and charms that are in and of themselves infused with cosmic energy. I am reading and using as a reference for my own mandalas an amazing book both from a textual perspective, and visual. You may already be acquainted with it. It is "Tibetan Tantric Charms and Amulets, 230 Examples reproduced from original woodblocks by Nik Douglas. Dover pub., 1978 Also the classic Tibetan Buddhism by L. Austine Waddel, 1898, 1972, Dover pub. according to the text (TB) there five ways by which magic(K) power can be realized. The types of powers can be realized according to mode of acquisition.
1) Jammiaja-acquired through birth and past Karma, and the influence of the stars. 2) Ausadhija-Due to the influence of a drug. 3) Mantrija-Recitation of magic syllables (seed syllables) and Mantras.4). Intense austerity 5) Samadhija-Living through an intense state of meditation.
There are also instructions for using the gaze of your eyes to conjure, or overthrow by using your eyes to gaze in prescribed positions. For example, "For overthrowing" the eyes should be level with the gaze directed upwards towards the forehead... while chanting the mantra appropriate to the operation. (Truely a "Secret Doctrine" hidden in plain sight.)
Fun fact: among AC's possessions in Paris (as catalogued by Leah Hirsig) was a "Tibetan Banner".
Thanks for the fun fact....perhaps a prayer flag or a tanka from the Himalayan Expeditions... one wonders if Gerald Yorke knew what that was and ever came into his possession.
I have always been interested in the "Wanderer of the Waste's" carrying of his possessions around the world, and how he kept things for so long, such as Liber Legis?
I am assuming that he had a steamer trunk of some kind.
Maybe a separate thread of Crowley's Trunk might be up or could be started...unfortunately or fortunately starting threads is beyond my technical abilities....
Thanks for the fun fact....perhaps a prayer flag or a tanka from the Himalayan Expeditions... one wonders if Gerald Yorke knew what that was and ever came into his possession.
I'm not surprised if Crowley did have a Tibetan banner. By the way, the word is "Thangka" not tanka. tanka is a Japanese poem. Since we are sort of discussing Tibetan Buddhism, (To a limited degree) There is a pretty cool photograph of the researchers of the Nazi German Ahnenerbe expedition to Tibet sitting at a table with Buddhist monks with both the Nazi swastika flag, and the Tibetan prayer flag also adorned with a swastika behind them on a wall. The Dalai Lama was about five or six years old at the time, and had already been recognized as the 14th incarnation of the previous DL.
Tibetan Tantric Charms and Amulets
This is your Guide to Liberation? How interesting. I did a tour of the Thangkas. To the point of building my own. They are all built up on the same cookie-cutter matrix, which has precise Hodish rules for every stroke. Essentially, one makes their own unpainted Paint-by-Numbers canvas or silk. Then fill in the colors - which undoubtedly have color rules. I didn't get that far.
Tantric Charms and Amulets fall into a similar (Hod-type) category, but they are specifically attributed to Atu XIII, the scary card.
there five ways by which magic(K) power can be realized.
(K)? Overemphasis on something already unique is like waving a red flag in front of Apis the Bull-gorer. I see these old-timers pretty much had their list of practices (1-5) in order.
Save the Abbey ... please mention the thread so as to keep it alive in your (anyone's) back-room consciousness - in case some new idea for saving arises.
Of course, this is very interesting, but it is not the core of Bon. [wiki quote] "Followers of Bon, known as "Bonpos" [end wiki quote] - these things (magic, talismans), like our western ladder, are part of the curriculum for getting from here to there.
AC made a study of Buddhism, then rejected it (while remaining a sensitive Buddhist inside), but he never mentioned Tibet. That was Mme Blavatsky's territory. It was said she traveled to Tibet to meet the Masters. In fact, she went to Kashmir, in the foothills of the Himalayas, and met with her mentors/sponsors, who were influential bankers and newspaper owners on the physical plane, who were members of The Golden Temple, which means they were Sikhs.
We should keep our eye out for two things in Tibet that will link it's concepts to Thelema: One is the HGA, usually absent in Buddhist circles, but I have found this intermediary heresy in the Yidam, which you may look up. The other is Will. Where is Chokmah in Tibet? I dunno that one ... yet. I will settle for a higher (supernal) self, for openers.
"For overthrowing" the eyes should be level with the gaze directed upwards towards the forehead... while chanting the mantra ...
My first inquest would be, Does this Work?
"Overhrowing" sounds exactly like the endless battles the shamans of the Amazon (and elsewhere, universally) are always involved in. Typical outer order, king of the hill mentality, with curses and breaking of curses stuff ... astral stuff.
The part that leads to a philosophical comparison with AL, and especially Bogus, is found in the 9th vehicle of Bon.
mong AC's possessions in Paris (as catalogued by Leah Hirsig) was a "Tibetan Banner".
Aha! A closet
perhaps a prayer flag or a tanka from the Himalayan Expeditions...
Crowley, like Blavatsky, never made it into Tibet. She got deeper into the foothills. Crowley "walked across China," which is true, but he only cut across a small portion of that nation. While he claimed to have "walked," a careful study of his notes reveals horses were involved.
Gerald Yorke knew what that was and ever came into his possession.
There are a few things that came into Yorke's possession ... that were supposed to be sent to Germer - sfs.
"sticky fingers syndrome"
Maybe a separate thread of Crowley's Trunk might be up or could be
Are you looking for other people to do this deed, or just thinking wishfully, acausally, out loud?
.
This is your Guide to Liberation? How interesting. I did a tour of the Thangkas. To the point of building my own. They are all built up on the same cookie-cutter matrix, which has precise Hodish rules for every stroke. Essentially, one makes their own unpainted Paint-by-Numbers canvas or silk. Then fill in the colors - which undoubtedly have color rules. I didn't get that far.
I am also creating my own Thangkas and Madalas. I am not a bad artist, and I am really enjoying and getting the mystic connections required. Starting with the circle, and adding geometric shapes, it builds almost magically into a physical structure. (That is physical on the visual side) Inscribing the Mantras, either in Sanskrit (I try to copy as accurately as possible, or in English.) infuse the Thangkas. The variations of design are limitless.
Tantric Charms and Amulets fall into a similar (Hod-type) category, but they are specifically attributed to Atu XIII, the scary card.
The "Death" card is my favorite, it so replete with symbols of destruction and creation. It is the "Illusion" of death and the reality of re birth.
My first inquest would be, Does this Work?
That is the Title of the first chapter of Robert Anton Wilson's book, Aleister Crowley, the Nature of the Beast. "Does magic work?" As it says in A.A. Not your A.A. but Alcoholics Anonymous, "it works if you work it."
Save the Abbey ... please mention the thread so as to keep it alive in your (anyone's) back-room consciousness - in case some new idea for saving arises.
Save it? I think it should be ceremonially burned to the ground, and the ashes cast into the four cardinal directions. A suitable funeral for a run-down eye sore.
I am really enjoying and getting the mystic connections required.
This is generally understandable, but rather vague in detail. Which mystic connections are required ?
The "Death" card is my favorite
Eeek!
the ashes cast into the four cardinal directions.
I propose the four cardinal markets. The ashes, in one dram vials, can be marketed as magical exploitives, historic souvenirs, aphrodisiacs, and cancer cures no, the would be illegal, at least in California, and homeopathic philosopher's stone, 93X.
A suitable funeral for a run-down eye sore.
At only $93/dram.
This is generally understandable, but rather vague in detail. Which mystic connections are required ?
The mystic connection between the mandala (Circle) and the mantra ((Magic formula).
I propose the four cardinal markets. The ashes, in one dram vials, can be marketed as magical exploitives, historic souvenirs, aphrodisiacs, and cancer cures no, the would be illegal, at least in California, and homeopathic philosopher's stone, 93X.
Yes, that will work. Maybe put the ashes in little glass vials to be worn as protective talismans, with a certificate of Authenticity.
Are you looking for other people to do this deed, or just thinking wishfully, acausally, out loud?
Well this sent me off into a brief pleasant state.......I suppose could be called a non-dual reverie, without thought, that I am now thinking about...but I don't want to look through trunks right now....but the question does come up from time to time....
I did like your Gems and Lies suggestion for bare to the bones library that would be portable, but packed!
with a certificate of Authenticity.
Certificates, printed on Dragon's Scale parchment, always involve a modest, but extra, fee.
I did like your Gems and Lies suggestion for bare to the bones library that would be portable, but packed!
I think Gems includes AL and 418, so the basic box only has two books in it. One could add Thoth to complete the Great Book Triad.
Certificates, printed on Dragon's Scale parchment, always involve a modest, but extra, fee.
I am fresh out of Dragon's Scale Parchment. Would genuine Egyptian Papyrus be okay?
@hadgigegenraum You might be interested in this: https://www.amazon.com/Leah-Hirsigs-Three-Chapters-Life/dp/B0B86VPZD5 I don't know if her "Visions" are included, but still.
Who is/are your favourite Bon/Dzogchen and maybe even Zen chap/s?
Well, there's this Chugdud guy, a recent reincarnation (recently departed), who was the recognized replay of the military general (or something like that) to the King, in the 13th century.
There is also Norbu. He gives great insight into difficult concepts.
Both of these guys fled the CCP and deflected bandits with magic. My favorite story involves the refugee camp in India. T=It was so high the airport was fogged in almost daily. One monk, a real wiz apparently, went out and cleared the fog for some flights. The gov, after observation and consideration, hired the monk to perform daily fog-clearing.