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[Closed] The chamber of nightmares: inside Aleister Crowley's Sicilian abbey

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(@ptoner)
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The chamber of nightmares: inside Aleister Crowley's Sicilian abbey

 

Little remains of the Abbey of Thelema. When Aleister Crowley and the isolated community he’d formed on the small fishing island of Cefalù were sent packing by Mussolini in 1923, the villagers whitewashed the walls and boarded up the doors and windows, leaving the satanic monastery to fade into obscurity. But, in its heydey, Thelema was Crowley’s sanctuary, a place where the famed occultist and his followers attempted to live by The Book of the Law, the esoteric religious text dictated to him by a non-corporeal being known as Aiwass.

 

https://faroutmagazine.co.uk/inside-aleister-crowley-sicilian-abbey/

 


   
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Posted by: @ptoner

The chamber of nightmares: inside Aleister Crowley's Sicilian abbey

 

Little remains of the Abbey of Thelema. When Aleister Crowley and the isolated community he’d formed on the small fishing island of Cefalù were sent packing by Mussolini in 1923, the villagers whitewashed the walls and boarded up the doors and windows, leaving the satanic monastery to fade into obscurity. But, in its heydey, Thelema was Crowley’s sanctuary, a place where the famed occultist and his followers attempted to live by The Book of the Law, the esoteric religious text dictated to him by a non-corporeal being known as Aiwass.

 

https://faroutmagazine.co.uk/inside-aleister-crowley-sicilian-abbey/

 

 

Still sensationalized but I'll give them credit for actually attributing Loveday's death to the spring water, instead of the popular drinking cat blood or human sacrifice explanation.


   
Shiva
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Posted by: @katrice

I'll give them credit for actually attributing Loveday's death to the spring wate

Yeah. Aleister even warned Raul against drinking the "bad water."


William Thirteen
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though Loveday wasn't cremated.  He was buried in the local cemetery until he was exhumed by his family and returned to England.  Somewhere around here i posted the photos i made of the cemetery register.


   
fraterihsan
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Typical sensationalism about the Abbey, "let these asses be set to grind corn".

The Abbey of Thelema was not a nightmare or criminal advent. It wasn't a success, granted, but the pop culture image is so uncalled for (I even occasionally see some Thelemites believing some of it themselves, which is hilarious). 

Oh yeah, poor Loveday, he was a promising man, could've been something great (he seemed a level ahead of Frater Achad) if he listened to what people were warning him about with the water. That is truly one of our big tragedies, as he seemed to be the light at the end of the tunnel after the previous failures in the Abbey.

"There is none that shall be cast down or lifted up: all is ever as it was." - Liber Legis 2:58
"To Me do ye reverence! to me come ye through tribulation of ordeal, which is bliss." - Liber Legis 3:62


   
(@Anonymous 51639)
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At the risk of being labeled a "Resurrectionist" Wasn't Kenneth Anger working to restore the murals painted by Aleister Crowley on the walls of the Cefalu "Abbey"? 


   
Shiva
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Posted by: @toadstoolwe

At the risk of being labeled a "Resurrectionist" Wasn't Kenneth Anger working to restore the murals painted by Aleister Crowley on the walls of the Cefalu "Abbey"? 

I seem to remember such a scenario. There is a video of him at the Abbey, showing the art. But then one can't just walk in to a place and start (re)painting. I think they call it vandalism.

The place is apparently cursed ... at least from purchase at a reasonable price for a piece of junk by well-intentioned (but not properly Willed) Thelemites. The place is being held by an absentee owner who wants big bucks for rubble. Then I guess the "council" came up against even further red tape that I can't really remember the color of.

Kenneth better get moving if he's going to get permission to enter and paint. I see that he was born in '27, but is apparently still with us. Good grief and the wailers!  He is 12 years older than me/I.


   
(@katrice)
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Posted by: @toadstoolwe

At the risk of being labeled a "Resurrectionist" Wasn't Kenneth Anger working to restore the murals painted by Aleister Crowley on the walls of the Cefalu "Abbey"? 

I know he filmed them, and I remember reading somewhere that there might have been some work to try to restore them when he did that. 


   
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@shiva Sounds like it is a situation of costing too much to initiate the project.  Too bad, because Aleister Crowley's artwork is pretty interesting, and would from a therapeutic perspective be very revealing into his psyche.  As you are aware, his home in Boleskine, burned to the ground.  Personally, I think it was arson. I assume that it was insured. 


   
(@Anonymous 51639)
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@katrice You are right.  By the way, did you look up the article about Leila Waddell?  I think you would enjoy her composition, "Thelema: A Sound Testament" Assuming you were not already aware of it.


   
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the_real_simon_iff
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Posted by: @ptoner

Anyone recall this? 

I do and I often wondered if the project ever was finished.


   
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Been on hold indefinitely, just do not have the time, to sit down and work it all out. Also, never got much feedback on older mural/fresco photographs, for use on the walls, of an interactive, 3D model.  


   
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@ptoner That is too bad.  From whom were you going to obtain the original mural photographs?   Was it Kenneth Anger, or another source?  I am sure you thought of this, but there a few period photographs of a few of the rooms, and both floor and wall images are fairly distinct.  I seem to recall a rather large cyclopean portrait with a demented smile and a tongue sticking out.  Very Crowely like in style.  Also, perhaps by studying Crowley's artwork, you could commission someone to "recreate" the murals based on existing artwork.  I am sure certain themes were repeatedly used by Crowley in his work.    Just brainstorming.  Don't mind me.  Good luck to you.


   
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Good news!  I found one of the photographs from Crowley Cefalu "Monastery"   It is on page 104, with other period photos in Francis X. Kings:  "The Magical World of Aleister Crowley" I knew I had seen somewhere.  Hope that helps a little.


   
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Shiva
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Posted by: @toadstoolwe

Sounds like it is a situation of costing too much to initiate the project.

All kinds of people tried to "initiate" something (paintings' restoration, Abbey restoration, patching the hole in the roof - it grows bigger each rain). In the end, it was not the cost (which was exorbitant), but some form of law/red tape/restrictions.

Posted by: @ptoner

Anyone recall this?

Yes, of course. Personally, I'm still waiting for the interior virtual walk-through, with paintings. Maybe some music would be nice.

I thought you did a great job. Yet somehow I have the memory that there was/is still more coming. I think it had to do with paintings, which is the topic of this thread. Anyway, I imagine that reconstruction of the paintings (digitally) might be one of the "impossible" tasks.

Posted by: @ptoner

Been on hold indefinitely, just do not have the time, to sit down and work it all out. Also, never got much feedback on older mural/fresco photographs, for use on the walls, of an interactive, 3D model. 

Yes, yes. That's the one (the interactive 4D astral  immersion experience) - where the spirits of the paintings activate the paintings and visitors scream or lose their minds. I can hardly wait

Your feeble excuse of "no time" is noted and casually discarded - because nobody has enough time these days to do anything but survive and worry. If you're lucky, there might be time for some sleep.

Posted by: @toadstoolwe

From whom were you going to obtain the original mural photographs? 

If I recall in truth, and not in perverse memory, the call went out to any and all (of us, and you) for any photos of the walls/paintings. Right there, exactly at that call-point (perhaps the date and time have been enshrined), that any progress became abstract as ptoner wrote to us about "getting really busy."

It is my impression that he is still "busy," and if he's not, then he's not living in the current zeitgeist ("the general intellectual, moral, and cultural climate of an era").

Thus it seems, Mr. Stool (I assume the "we" is appended, like jr, IV, esq, and does not refer to the size of your member), that you have discovered your "Will." Surely, having found the lost photo, you now realize that you must (1) buy the Abbey. (2) hire Ken to touch up the pics (or do it yourself) and (3) get the works embedded in ptoner's matrix - so that we, and the rest of humanity, can walk through the Horror Chamber.

 


   
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I am indeed a "wee Laddie" But to set the record straight, in order for my password to be accepted, I had to add a couple of letters, quite arbitrarily I might add.  Anyway, loan me about a million dollars (I'm a Yank if you haven't guessed that already) and I'll see what I can do.  Until then, DO WHAT THOU WILT SHALL BE THE WHOLE OF THE LAW, LOVE IS THE LAW LOVE UNDER WILL.


   
Shiva
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Posted by: @toadstoolwe

I am indeed a "wee Laddie" But to set the record straight, in order for my password to be accepted, I had to add a couple of letters, quite arbitrarily I might add.

I see. The Toadstool Mysteries unravel day-by-day, day after day, daily. By the time everything is revealed, it may turn out that you are just an ordinary person, like me, and him-her-it, without trappings.

Say,you didn't happen to be a really wee (young) stool that was a  fan of Lord of the Rings, did you?

I was older than wee, but I was immediately captivated by the QBL synchonicity that was embedded in the tale.


   
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Qoth-Beth-Lamed to receive the truth. Yes, I was a Wee fan of The Lord of the Rings, I still am.  Like Crowley, J.R.R. Tolkien sought to discover the synthesis of all world mythologies and esoteric teaching.  What Jung would call the Archetypes.  Think of the shadow personality.  For Tolkien it was Morgoth, for Crowley it was Choronzon. 


   
(@katrice)
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Posted by: @toadstoolwe

@katrice You are right.  By the way, did you look up the article about Leila Waddell?  I think you would enjoy her composition, "Thelema: A Sound Testament" Assuming you were not already aware of it.

I did reply to your post but it may have gotten lost in the rest of the discussion.  Thank you for sharing the article!  I hadn't seen it before. I was a fun read.  I was already aware of the composition, and do enjoy it. Thank you for the prompt to listen to it again. 


   
the_real_simon_iff
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Posted by: @ptoner

Also, never got much feedback on older mural/fresco photographs, for use on the walls, of an interactive, 3D model.  

Now that they found Spare's lost "Psychopathia Sexualis" at the Kinsey Institute they might want to look further for the lost Kenneth Anger film on the Abbey, I am sure that would be hugely helpful. But I know the feeling: I have several little projects of service and/or devotion to AC's cultural impact that I am working on for decades and never find the time to finish it.

I liked your idea very much and would be sorry if I haven't been more encouraging then. Unfortunately I have not very much more to offer than what is strewn around in biographies and such. I gather you have the paintings description TS from the Warburg?

Love=Law

Lutz


   
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@katrice You are welcome!  I sort of figured that you probably were already familiar with it, but half the fun of studying Aleister Crowley is discovering all the connections and personalities involved.  (I love researching period newspapers online (Library of Congress Newspaper resources) that mention Crowley, A surprising number of American newspapers gave him coverage, usually of the sensationalized kind. 


   
the_real_simon_iff
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@ptoner So if you ever start over, I don't know if you have this one, showing the backside (or frontside) with two doors instead of one:

 


   
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Posted by: @shiva

All kinds of people tried to "initiate" something (paintings' restoration, Abbey restoration, patching the hole in the roof - it grows bigger each rain). In the end, it was not the cost (which was exorbitant), but some form of law/red tape/restrictions.

Yes, I tried, got so far and then it became less important, if I am honest. Life and living, seems to take precedent more often now. New house, separated from wife and daughter, trying to do DIY. Ah the mundane. 🙂 

 

Posted by: @shiva

I thought you did a great job. Yet somehow I have the memory that there was/is still more coming. I think it had to do with paintings, which is the topic of this thread. Anyway, I imagine that reconstruction of the paintings (digitally) might be one of the "impossible" tasks.

Well i did gather a rather large resource, collected from video, websites, books and reaching out in emails. I should share the resources, so you all know the extent of what I collected. It would be very hard to reproduce the paintings, as only 20% of them where actually visible in any photos that I could locate. The shutters are better described and photographed than the chamber. So if it ever got kick started.... expect a lot of "green screen" wash effect. 

 

Posted by: @shiva

If I recall in truth, and not in perverse memory, the call went out to any and all (of us, and you) for any photos of the walls/paintings. Right there, exactly at that call-point (perhaps the date and time have been enshrined), that any progress became abstract as ptoner wrote to us about "getting really busy."

Are not we all busy living Shiva? There only is the present moment after all. 

 

Posted by: @toadstoolwe

That is too bad.  From whom were you going to obtain the original mural photographs?   Was it Kenneth Anger, or another source?  I am sure you thought of this, but there a few period photographs of a few of the rooms, and both floor and wall images are fairly distinct.

here... have a wee nosey.
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B0rHwPu8JU_6Z0g2SXJxR0c2LTg?resourcekey=0-2qFw82QFzhZd5355Ly8ULA&usp=sharing

 

Posted by: @the_real_simon_iff

So if you ever start over, I don't know if you have this one, showing the backside (or frontside) with two doors instead of one:

Yeah, in the 50-60's the Abbey was split into two, so the owner could rent out two properties, under one roof. 


   
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Shiva, ptoner:  Very Cool!  I didn't realize that full color images of the murals and Magic(K) circle existed Thanks!  I am sorry ptoner that you are in a rough patch right now.  So was I about 7 years ago.  I just got divorced, and I moved out of my house abandoning a pretty substantial library of first edition occult books.  All is well now.  


   
(@ptoner)
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Posted by: @toadstoolwe

Shiva, ptoner:  Very Cool!  I didn't realize that full color images of the murals and Magic(K) circle existed Thanks!  I am sorry ptoner that you are in a rough patch right now.  So was I about 7 years ago.  I just got divorced, and I moved out of my house abandoning a pretty substantial library of first edition occult books.  All is well now.  

Thank you Toadstool, happened just over two years ago, very raw then of course, felt like I was abandoning my daughter for example. Yet, now, I am happier, so is my ex wife and we support each other more than ever now, we both put our daughter first and have a great relationship. 

I had had immense spiritual growth in those two years, that has also bolstered my confidence etc. 
So all is good! 🙂

 


   
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@ptoner That's gggggreat!  to quote that wise old mystic Tony the Tiger.  Yes, Time does have a way of healing all wounds.


   
Shiva
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Posted by: @ptoner

Are not we all busy living Shiva? There only is the present moment after all.

Yes, of course. the eternal present is always nagging about something. I have had a few projects, mostly written, but some more practical, that got started and then sat on the BB (back-burner), with the gas off, for ... um ... decades. 

Thus there is hope and help in the concept of Tomorrow.

Posted by: @ptoner

Yeah, in the 50-60's the Abbey was split into two, so the owner could rent out two properties, under one roof. 

This is what we gringos call a duplex. Do not confuse this word with the term duplexity, even if both words convey a sense of two separate entities (peeps, perps, families, orders) squeezed into one structure.

 


   
(@katrice)
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Posted by: @toadstoolwe

@katrice You are welcome!  I sort of figured that you probably were already familiar with it, but half the fun of studying Aleister Crowley is discovering all the connections and personalities involved. 

I'm interested in that too, and other personalities involved in magick from around his time. Xul Solar, Evola, Bardon, Gurfjieff, de Naglowska, Randolph, Quintscher, and more.  So many interesting people and ideas! 

(I love researching period newspapers online (Library of Congress Newspaper resources) that mention Crowley, A surprising number of American newspapers gave him coverage, usually of the sensationalized kind. 

It's interesting reading what people wrote about Crowley in his own time, especially other people involved in magick from the time when his written works weren't as available. 

 


   
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Thank you for kind response.  It is with great shame and humility that will admit that with the exception of Ebola, and Gurdjieff, I had not heard of these other occultists.  Thank you for opening my mind to these fascinating personalities.  You have injected new blood into a rather atrophied intellect! (Does that make me a "Psychic Vampire"?  I hope not!) I will remedy the situation immediately by a new reading regimen.

Crowley was a genius, but he wasn't the only blazing star in the firmament.


   
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Addendum: I mean Evola, not Ebola.


   
(@katrice)
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Posted by: @toadstoolwe

Thank you for kind response.  It is with great shame and humility that will admit that with the exception of Ebola, and Gurdjieff, I had not heard of these other occultists.  Thank you for opening my mind to these fascinating personalities.  You have injected new blood into a rather atrophied intellect! (Does that make me a "Psychic Vampire"?  I hope not!) I will remedy the situation immediately by a new reading regimen.

 

No problem! I love turning people on to new ideas, even unintentionally! 

 

Crowley was a genius, but he wasn't the only blazing star in the firmament.

Indeed he was not! There are others who have interesting ideas and work to offer too! 

 

Xul Solar was a magickal artist, sometimes called the Argentinian Austin Spare, though he has also been compared to Dali.  He's definitely worth looking in to.

Franz Bardon's Initiation Into Hermetics is one of the most comprehensive magickal training systems ever created, and it mostly focuses on developing ability rather than just doing rituals.

But Bardon owes a huge debt to pioneering sex and drugs magician PB Randolph, who once wrote “Will reigns Omnipotent; Love lieth at the Foundation.”, a predecessor to another phrase we all know well. I find Randolph's method of creating magic mirrors very interesting.  John Patrick Deveney's biography on him is definitive.

A translation of Randolph's book Magia Sexualis was done by Marisa de Naglowska is a major fascination of mine.  She led a cult of "Satanic" gnostic sex magicians. Some of her writings have become available in English for the first time fairly recently.  

Ra Omir Quintscher was a leading figure in Adonism, a magickal belief system founded in the 1920s https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adonism  


   
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Thank you for your synopsis of these historical figures of esoterism.  My interest in Aleister Crowley, and occultism in particular started in my high school years when I read The Spear of Destiny"  A shameless forgery, but, nonetheless full of references to Rudolf Steiner and the Anthroposophical Society , Helena Blatvastsky, The Hermetic Order of the AA, Dietrich Eckart and the Thule Society, and Guido von List the Runic scholar and founder of the Armanism  Society .  I am quite sure you are aware of the Pan-Germanist movement in folklore and Magic(K) that was prevalent at the turn of the 20th century, And in Great Britain, the longing for a mythological past, expressed by J.R.R. Tolkien and Gerald Gardner.  (I once owned a first edition of a biography of Gerald Garner written by none other than Aleister Crowley, and a translation of Eliphas Levi.)  Anyway, have a great rest of your weekend.  I guess with the events going in Russia and the Ukraine, Choronzon is having a field day.


   
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To Any and All.  I was mistaken.  Aleister did not write a biography of Gerald Gardener, although he did influence Gerald Gardner's Wicca Religion.  The book I was thinking of, Witchcraft Today, was written by Gardner.


   
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Julius Evola, Satri Devi, and Occult Fascism.  I would recommend two books, both by Nicholas Goodrick-Clarke, The Occult Roots of Nazism, and Black Sun.  I pose the question, is Thelema esoteric Fascism?


   
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Posted by: @toadstoolwe

I pose the question, is Thelema esoteric Fascism?

No.

Glad i could clear that up for you.


   
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@ignant666 I agree to disagree!


   
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Posted by: @toadstoolwe

Thank you for your synopsis of these historical figures of esoterism.  .  

You're welcome. 

My interest in Aleister Crowley, and occultism in particular started in my high school years when I read The Spear of Destiny"   

Trevor Ravenscroft. 🙂 

 

I'm familiar with the Goodrick-Clarke books you mention too.

 

Mine was sparked by a chapter on Crowley in a book on different figures in magic and the supernatural that I read in high school. It was sensationalized but fit the dark glamour that I was in to at the time, and in a way am still in to now, just in a more mature manner. 

 

I am quite sure you are aware of the Pan-Germanist movement in folklore and Magic(K) that was prevalent at the turn of the 20th century,

Indeed. I'm familiar with the Armanic tradition and writers like von List, Marby, and Kummer. I've read Michael Moynihan's translation of Wiligut's writings too. 

 

 Anyway, have a great rest of your weekend.  I guess with the events going in Russia and the Ukraine, Choronzon is having a field day.

You as well.  I'd say Chrononzon has been having a field day for years now.

 

Posted by: @toadstoolwe

I pose the question, is Thelema esoteric Fascism?

Like @ignant666 said, no. 

 

While I do have interest in the magickal writings of people like Evola and other Traditionalists, and I'd recommend the Introduction To Magic books and The Hermetic Tradition in particular to anyone here, I have no love for their sociopolitical views at all. 

 

 


   
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Who were Marby and Kummel?  I am not familiar with them, but I would be interested in reading about them.  Today, I will be Pandora and I am going open the box.  I direct the reader to two examples of what I meant by: Is Thelema Fascism?  "Between Occultism and Fascism:  Anthroposophy and the Politics of Race and Nation in Germany and Italy, 1900-1945 by Peter Staudenmater; Ordo Templi Orientis Phenomenon Proto Fascist Elements in the O.T.O.  By the way, I don't think of Fascism in a negative way.


   
Shiva
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Posted by: @toadstoolwe

Black Sun

Uh, oh. You're getting into some interesting concepts there, which tend to provide a different orientation of science, geography, and esoteric perspective.

Posted by: @toadstoolwe

I pose the question, is Thelema esoteric Fascism?

You could look at it that way - if you were one of the low men. Or you could deny it - being one of the Kings. Since the question has two answers that are diametrically opposed, we must return to the Black Sun, saying "WTF?"

You have just posted three posts in a row. This is erratic behavior, according to The Guidelines, which say seial posting is a sin, and you may consider this a friendly yellow-light (caution) notification from the fascial council of Oz.

Posted by: @toadstoolwe

I agree to disagree!

Uh, oh, uh, oh no!  Why would you purposely stick you feet in the fire, after taking your boots off? 

Posted by: @toadstoolwe

I direct the reader to two examples of what I meant by: Is Thelema Fascism? 

Um, it is writ by Ankh, who started all this, that each fragmented unit from the whole (the black whole) is to ascertain the meaning of Liber Al for hirself, and said unit only has appeal to Ankh,s further writs.

Get it? Now that injunction, from fascia 418 himself, is the hard-core approach to Thelema, wherein I Am a Rock - I Am an Island.  Such an approach leads, of course, to fundamentalism, and we see that folly expressed from time to time.

Posted by: @toadstoolwe

By the way, I don't think of Fascism in a negative way.

Oh, Lordy and the 333 Variations of Truth!  You now have a few concepts to clear up, due to reverse-polarity wriggling, and your feet are already incinerating in the fire. I believe theimmanent conflagration should be recorded and sent to news media outlets (mainstream and alternative) everywhere.

 


   
(@katrice)
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Posted by: @toadstoolwe

Who were Marby and Kummel?  I am not familiar with them, but I would be interested in reading about them.   

Friedrich Marby and Siegfried Adolph Kummer were both influential 20th century Armanic Rune magicians

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friedrich_Marby

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siegfried_Adolf_Kummer   

 

Today, I will be Pandora and I am going open the box.  I direct the reader to two examples of what I meant by: Is Thelema Fascism?  "Between Occultism and Fascism:  Anthroposophy and the Politics of Race and Nation in Germany and Italy, 1900-1945 by Peter Staudenmater; Ordo Templi Orientis Phenomenon Proto Fascist Elements in the O.T.O. 

Anthroposophy, and Ariosophy, were indeed influential in their time, in magick and in politics, but need not have had any prevailing influence on Thelema as a concept in terms of fascism inherent in the idea. I'd also argue that fascist elements in an organization dedicated to a concept does not mean that the concept itself is inherently fascist. 

 


   
(@Anonymous 51639)
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Sorry if I violated a Guideline by posting three times.  "Three times the Charm" I don't mind putting my feet in the fire, A good immolation can only purify me. (Or devour me) Could you further elaborate what you meant by: "Um, is writ by Ankh, who started all this, that each fragmented unit from the (black whole) is to ascertain the meaning of Liber AL for hirself, and said unit only has appeal to Ankh's further writ.... Get it?"  To be honest with you, no.  I don't get it.   Please elucidate.   If I opened Pandora's box, I pay the consequences.  


   
Shiva
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Posted by: @toadstoolwe

Could you further elaborate what you meant by: "Um, is writ by Ankh, who started all this ...

Certainly. Just go see The Comment to Liber AL, which is appended to several versions of its publication.


   
(@Anonymous 51639)
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Thank you.  Good grief, and here I am name dropping Goodrick-Clarke's books, and I overlooked what should have been obvious.  My only defense, it's been a while since I read either book.  I also have a copy of The Secret King, and Hammer of the gods a book about The Thule Society. (Not to be confused with the Led Zeppelin book by the same title)  Guess I'll re-read them.  


   
katrice reacted
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@shiva Ankh f-n Khonsu According to the comment we are forbidden to discuss The Book of Law, better burn your copy before it's too late!


   
ignant666
(@ignant666)
Elderly American druggie
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Posted by: @toadstoolwe

better burn your copy

He did.


   
(@Anonymous 51639)
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ignant666: You are an elderly American druggie? Me to!  Well, ex-druggie anyway.


   
ignant666
(@ignant666)
Elderly American druggie
Joined: 18 years ago
Posts: 4550
 
Posted by: @toadstoolwe

ex-druggie anyway

"Quitters never win/Winners never quit."

Right up there with "Only users lose drugs" as words to live by.

You seem to want to be friends, which is nice, but you are barking up the wrong tree. FYI, i am probably lashtal's left-most member, being that i am an anarchist-communist, and hard-left Democrat.

So, since i have not said it in a while, because politics have been largely absent of late: fuck Fascism, fuck Fascists, fuck Nazis, and fuck Fascist International Supremo Putin, and fuck his "special operation". And fuck anyone who says

Posted by: @toadstoolwe

I don't think of Fascism in a negative way.

Cause, Comrade, believe me when i say i do.


   
katrice reacted
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@ignant666 Well, you've certainly put me in my place.  I used to be a leftist, anarchist, Commie, etc,. etc,   But then I discovered the latent hatred and hypocrisy of the left. (That is too say MY hatred and hypocrisy) You don't want free-thinkers, you want  every one to think like you do.  Me, I don't care, believe in whatever you like.  Fascism ( not to be confused with National Socialism) satisfies my ego, my sense of self-worth.   If you really understood Aleister Crowley, you would know that he was no "Leftist liberal"  In fact, I think he would put you in a rage at some of the comments he made about Jews and "People of color"  That doesn't bother me, it is his insight into the truth behind myth and ritual that attracts me to him, his unequaled insight into the character of others.  You've chosen your political path, and I have chosen mine.  Carry old Comrade!

 


   
ignant666
(@ignant666)
Elderly American druggie
Joined: 18 years ago
Posts: 4550
 
Posted by: @toadstoolwe

Fascism ( not to be confused with National Socialism) satisfies my ego, my sense of self-worth. 

Pathetic. Also typical of Fascists, Nazis (and believe me, Comrade, i do confuse them, since they are the same thing), and far-right imbeciles everywhere.

Posted by: @toadstoolwe

If you really understood Aleister Crowley, you would know that he was no "Leftist liberal"

Well, actually, he was, at times, as well as being a right-wing nut, at times.

As i have said rather often, anyone who takes his politics from AC is both a moron, and likely to be totally confused, what with being an anarchist, pro-aristocracy, revolutionary Bolshevik Nazi ultra-conservative. See Pasi's Aleister Crowley and the temptation of politics for a masterful book-length exegesis on this theme.

Posted by: @toadstoolwe

In fact, I think he would put you in a rage at some of the comments he made about Jews and "People of color" 

AC talked a lot of shit about a lot of topics.

But it is a simple matter of historical fact, recorded extensively in his diaries, that he took every possible opportunity to suck the penises of Jewish men, and to suck the penises of Black men, and to have his ass fucked by Jews and Black men.

Also, since you are condescending to me as to my lack of knowledge of AC, i have to assume you are familiar with his not-entirely-positive (well, actually virulently, hatefully negative) views on English people, white Americans, and Europeans? And his worshipful remarks about Arabs, Mexicans, and the Chinese?


   
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