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[Closed] How can one practice magick with out mucking up your life?

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 Anonymous
Joined: 52 years ago
Posts: 0
 

I do remember one time during meditation that I "lost an hour". I must have been in the "void" as I can't see that I had fallen asleep as I was in an Asana that would not have been conducive to sleeping (I take Adderall, too). It just seemed like as I was watching my thoughts go by they seemed to have stopped at some point, then I remember opening my eyes after an indeterminite (or seemed so, anyway) amount of time and a whole hour had passed. I consider that one of my most successful meditation sessions to date. The quickness with which everything just stopped and the duration of an hour is what amazes me.


 Anonymous
Joined: 52 years ago
Posts: 0
 

I stared at the ceiling with my eyes open one time, and zoned out watching it kinda ripple as my focus faded in and out, and I got deeply into meditation, when I finally jumped up and shook my head, it had been almost 10 hours. It seemed more like about 30 minutes.


Azidonis
(@azidonis)
Member
Joined: 15 years ago
Posts: 2967
 
"name538" wrote:
Ok let me ask you this.

If I smoke cigarettes and I know that it is unhealthy, but I do it anyway. I am addicted to them, I know it and I still keep smoking. Then I write up a health study that I did, I show the procedure, I use careful controls, and I show the results are that cigarettes cause health problems and lung cancer. I further reference 6 other studies that all agree, and they all show that smoking is unhealthy. I agree with my own study and every other study I indicate, I stamp in with my approval and I write to the surgeon general under my own sign and seal that cigarettes are dangerous and unhealthy.

and Yet I continue to smoke.

Does the fact that I still smoke, proof that cigarettes my studies are not true?
When I tell people that if they want to be healthy they had best not smoke, should they demand that I am mistaken because I myself smoke. (Even though I smoke and I have emphysema and hypertension, thus I smoke and am unhealthy.)

Because Erwin maybe did not fallow his own statements and he may suffer for it, but that does not make what he said false.

93,

If you smoke, and tell people that if they want to be healthy then they should avoid smoking, then it is okay.

But if you smoke, and you tell people they should not smoke, that makes you a hypocrite.

Likewise if you read Erwin's works, and tell people they could learn from them, it is okay.

But if you read Erwin's works and determine that it is the only way they people can learn and you try to force them to read Erwin's works, that is not okay.

And we don't really care how much time you spent "meditating".

By the way, I wrote you a letter.

93 93/93


 Anonymous
Joined: 52 years ago
Posts: 0
 
"name538" wrote:
Ok let me ask you this.

If I smoke cigarettes and I know that it is unhealthy, but I do it anyway. I am addicted to them, I know it and I still keep smoking. Then I write up a health study that I did, I show the procedure, I use careful controls, and I show the results are that cigarettes cause health problems and lung cancer. I further reference 6 other studies that all agree, and they all show that smoking is unhealthy. I agree with my own study and every other study I indicate, I stamp in with my approval and I write to the surgeon general under my own sign and seal that cigarettes are dangerous and unhealthy.

and Yet I continue to smoke.

Does the fact that I still smoke, proof that cigarettes my studies are not true?
When I tell people that if they want to be healthy they had best not smoke, should they demand that I am mistaken because I myself smoke. (Even though I smoke and I have emphysema and hypertension, thus I smoke and am unhealthy.)

Because Erwin maybe did not fallow his own statements and he may suffer for it, but that does not make what he said false.

If your true Will is to accomplish a tobacco non-smoking campaign, and at the core of your campaign are methods for overcoming this habit, and yet your own tobacco smoking prevents you from accomplishing this campaign, then your own behavior has defeated your true Will, rather than accomplishing it, yes. Either you have failed your own campaign or your methods have failed you, or both.

Nice and simple little analogy, thanks. Not quite as extremely ironic as in this case, but close.


 Anonymous
Joined: 52 years ago
Posts: 0
 

What if your anti-smoking campaign is based on convincing people to not start smoking in the first place?
What if you are not telling people they have to stop smoking, you are merely giving advice that smoking is unhealthy and if you want to stop, here is a method that has proven to work.

Even if you yourself choose to keep smoking and you accept that it's unhealthy.


 Anonymous
Joined: 52 years ago
Posts: 0
 
"everyone" wrote:
Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin... Erwin...

Goodness me. Obsessed much, anyone? A psychiatrist reading this thread would think all his Christmasses had come at once.

Some of you folks clearly have far more time to talk about me than I do, so I'll just deflect the highlights.

"AEternitas" wrote:
Erwin Hessle, I've generally found...to be...not very magical

And I should bloody well hope not, too!

"Camlion" wrote:
I find it not only difficult but potentially hazardous to take seriously the conclusions of a person who cannot restrain his sociopathy even for the brief time required to exchange a few posts on the Internet.

You, sonny, have led an astonishingly sheltered life if you think laughing at people who believe in goblins, magic spells, and "magickal [sic] universes" is indicative of "sociopathy", because that's pretty much the treatment you'd receive everywhere else outside of your superchums clubs if you admitted to such beliefs in public.

"Camlion" wrote:
There is no reason to settle for either example of imbalance, actually.

You wouldn't know "balance" if it jumped up and poked you in the eye. You don't get any "balance" when dealing with the occult until someone starts pointing out what a complete load of old toot it almost all is.

"Horemakhet" wrote:
Erwin insults & underestimates his own audience. I find that contemptible.

Are you and Camlion actually serious?

People who believe in goblins, magic spells, and "magickal [sic] universes" are not my target audience! My goodness, if you can't at least get that from my writings then there's no hope for you at all.

My target audience is the people who aren't complete goons. The fact that some of those goons might happen to frequent the same places that I do is neither here nor there, except inasmuch as they may happen to serve as good examples from time to time. There's no point arguing with young-earth creationists, and there's equally no point arguing with occultists who believe in goblins. You're attributing yourself way, way too much credibility if you think what I write is directed at you.

"gurugeorge" wrote:
No, frankly I'd rather have the crazies, the mad jumble

You're welcome to them. By all means, please take them away with you.

"Azidonis" wrote:
As for Erwin... to be quite honest, I haven't been to his Website, and don't really care to go

Yet for some reason you still feel the need to take the time to write a "23 page word document" about me. You, son, might want to think about going to see a doctor.

"tai" wrote:
I'm not going to give the game away

Because you don't have the first clue what you're talking about, as usual.

"MichaelStaley" wrote:
HGA is somethng extremely intimate. Nobody can lay down the law on what it is and what it isn't.

Crowley did. In fact, despite adopting the terminology from Abramelin, his usage of the term is entirely his own invention, so if you disagree you're just not talking about the same thing he was. You may as well disagree with Orwell on the finer points of Newspeak.

"AEternitas" wrote:
What I find to be in poor taste is the attitude taken towards the beliefs and practices of others who don't share similar views

"Poor taste"? Seriously, now, exactly what were you people expecting to happen when you decided to put on public record that you believe in goblins, magic spells, and "magickal [sic] universes"? Are you actually trying to imply that ridicule is not an appropriate response to this kind of nonsense?

"Camlion" wrote:
If his own methods have failed him, if he is plagued by problems that he claims are resolved by his own methods, if his own true purpose is defeated by antisocial psychological complexes that should, according to him, have been resolved by his own methods, then his advocating these methods is hypocritical and unjustified.

Your delusions become grander by the day, sunshine. You clearly have some enormous inferiority complex to deal with.

"gurugeorge" wrote:
But that cuts both ways - it shouldn't bother Erwin & Co. one little bit if others believe "magick is real" - since the point is, precisely, that the metaphysical status is irrelevant. The aspirant can think "this is all just visions/this is all real" INDISCRIMINATELY, it simply is of no consequence one way or the other with respect to the course of training and discipline, analysis and self-discovery.

The idea that "it simply is of no consequence one way or the other with respect to...self-discovery" whether the Holy Guardian Angel, for instance, is a symbol of one's true self or a discarnate spaceman is probably the single most foolish idea I've seen on this entire thread. And that's saying something.

"gurugeorge" wrote:
I'd say we're on the brink of discovering ways to truly test this stuff scientifically

We've already been through this, and this is as silly a notion now as it was the first time you advanced it.

Honestly, some of you people seriously need to get out more.


 Anonymous
Joined: 52 years ago
Posts: 0
 
"gurugeorge" wrote:
"alrah" wrote:
You're putting adepts and MT's on a marble pedestal marked with words like 'unattainable', 'aloof', 'above me', etc. - but these are living, breathing people, and even the Buddha went to the toilet once a day.

Actually I never used any of those words, you're putting them into my mouth.

Well - you overstate things sometimes. 😉

I just think people have a bit of a wonky sense of "scale" about all this. In a trope, everyone mistakes a glimpse of Satori for crossing the Abyss. No, actually, a glimpse of Satori makes you a Neophyte, and that's it. But AC says somewhere that the Path of the Wise gets exponentially harder the "higher" you go up on the Tree - the work STARTS when you're a Neophyte and have had your "glimpse".

IOW, the scale of the adventure is really, really vast.

Well - people may get very excited at the first blush, but I really don't see most people commonly making that sort of mistake, and when they do there's usually an underlying mental condition responsible.

As for the scale of the operation - you're squashing in spiritual lessons into a single lifetime, but the operation is 'do'able in the average time frame we live. And it's not as if anyone has anything better to do - so they might as well.

As for the scale - to a child, someone of a mere 40 years seems ancient and with vast life experience, but everyone of 40 years will tell you 'this', 'that', and 't'other' seems like yesterday. They don't appreciate the 'scale' at all. It's no different from the Neophyte and the MT.

And actually, they say the same thing in Zen (I've just remembered) - in the old days in China, someone would have their Realization and THEN they'd go on a long trek around the monasteries (hardship of the road, adventures with brigands, etc.) "testing" their attainment. It's just that they never talked about all that part of the training. It would be only after a few years of that (I think around 15 years was the standard period?), and after confirmation by a Master, that they'd be considered Enlightened with a capital "E" (which is the equivalent of MT).

Yup. Takes a chunk of time. But so what? I don't see your point. Am I supposed to be impressed by the fact it takes a long time? Actually - 15 years is the blink of an eye. I'd go so far to say it was reasonable.

So: on the one hand, the truth is close, and not all that difficult to cognize (maybe a few days, maybe a few months), it's democratic, everyone should have access to it, everyone should have the opportunity to have a "glimpse" of what the hell is really, really going on.

On the other hand, if you're talking about a structured and COMPREHENSIVE path like the A:.A:., that's a big, big thing, it's not for everybody - it's more of a specific calling.

I just mentioned Crossing the Abyss, not training to be a teacher of the A.:A.: . Some people are driven to just get things done as quickly as possible (even when that spans decades) by the most direct route.

My pet metaphor for it is: riding a bicycle is a great thing, everyone should learn to ride a bike, it will enrich their lives. But not everyone is called to compete in the Tour de France. Most claims to MT I've seen are like some jerk togged up in their cycling gear claiming to be as good a cyclist as Lance Armstrong.

Ah! I see! You think only teachers of the A.:A.: should be called Magisters, and not those who have crossed the Abyss outside of the system of the A.:A.: - as they aren't fully equipped to teach that system?

Ok. lol. 🙂

Well - what exactly are these 'chops' anyhow? Do you think we should use a different term for someone who's crossed the abyss but isn't everyones idea of what a magister should be?

Come back to me when you've written something as sublime as the Holy Books and the corpus of A:.A:. instructions 🙂

You say that as these things are important to you. A physicist would laugh at you and demand proofs on par with Einsteins 2 theorys of relativity instead - that's important to him. There are many things important to the evolution of the human race - the timing of which makes certain demands. Nature demands that her magisters are not kept in one small basket. She doesn't stuff the stars into one small portion of the sky either. 🙂


Michael Staley
(@michael-staley)
MANIO - it's all in the egg
Joined: 18 years ago
Posts: 4194
 
"Erwin" wrote:
Yet for some reason you still feel the need to take the time to write a "23 page word document" about me. You, son, might want to think about going to see a doctor.

You have misread the post. The document is a compilation of posts by name538. Whilst some of this material might be "about you", most of it isn't.


Azidonis
(@azidonis)
Member
Joined: 15 years ago
Posts: 2967
 
"MichaelStaley" wrote:
"Erwin" wrote:
Yet for some reason you still feel the need to take the time to write a "23 page word document" about me. You, son, might want to think about going to see a doctor.

You have misread the post. The document is a compilation of posts by name538. Whilst some of this material might be "about you", most of it isn't.

93,

Thank you, Mr. Staley.

If anything, Erwin, the parts of the document that have anything at all to do with you are really just pointing out the effect your writings have had on name538.

I have been waiting for the day you came on these boards and marveled at all the talk about yourself. While your timing is great, your responses were easily predicted.

93 93/93


lashtal
(@lashtal)
Owner and Editor Admin
Joined: 18 years ago
Posts: 5342
 

Moderator's Note

I am bored beyond belief by this thread and the obsession that some members seem to have with Erwin Hessle.

Locked.

Owner and Editor
LAShTAL


Alan_OBrien
(@alan_obrien)
Member
Joined: 12 years ago
Posts: 260
 
Posted by: @azidonis
"AEternitas" wrote:
Along with Erwin Hessle, I've generally found the folks that contribute to the "Journal of Thelemic Studies" to be a bit rigid, boring and not very magical. No offense to anybody. I guess in particular I'm reffering to IAO131 and Erwin for the most part.

After a long break from these boards, I guess no one has figured out for sure of those two are the same person.

IAO! I came across a Thelemic song by The Goons called IAO. I am sure The Great Beast would have liked it.

https://youtu.be/PoavAebBxiA


kidneyhawk
(@kidneyhawk)
Member
Joined: 15 years ago
Posts: 2042
 
Posted by: @lashtal

Locked.

Apparently not.

This may be a Resurrection Free-for-All! 

 


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