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Indulgence and transgression in magickal practice

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Shiva
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Posted by: @katrice

I see psychedelics as a tool, and don't see them as necessarily superior to other ways of altering consciousness for magickal or psychological purposes. 

I would agree, and I discard the "drugged out" scenario. I am always presenting concepts of controlled, safe, magically-enhanced rites. Not a white sterile clinical setting. Not a musty room filled with Chinamen in bunks with long pipe and peanut oil lamps. No, not these, net-neti, but a Temple with a solid door, or a Circle inscribed in the sand of the Wild-places? Sure.

What is that saying? Take your store of women and strange drugs - they will not harm ye at all. Was that it?


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katrice
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Posted by: @shiva

  I am always presenting concepts of controlled, safe, magically-enhanced rites. Not a white sterile clinical setting. Not a musty room filled with Chinamen in bunks with long pipe and peanut oil lamps. No, not these, net-neti, but a Temple with a solid door, or a Circle inscribed in the sand of the Wild-places? Sure.

Set and Setting are important, any of those could work for a particular person.  😀 

 

What is that saying? Take your store of women and strange drugs - they will not harm ye at all. Was that it?

Not quite

To worship me take wine and strange drugs whereof I will tell my prophet, & be drunk thereof! They shall not harm ye at all.

and

Ye shall gather goods and store of women and spices; ye shall wear rich jewels; ye shall exceed the nations of the earth in spendour & pride; but always in the love of me, and so shall ye come to my joy. 

 

But stores of women, strange drugs, and spices all sound good to me too.


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Shiva
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Posted by: @katrice

To worship me take wine and strange drugs ...

Posted by: @katrice

Ye shall gather goods

Oh, yeah, I remember those now ... not that I actually forgot them in the second place. In the first place, I was just mixing and matching. Sort of like ...

Posted by: @katrice

stores of women, strange drugs, and spices all sound good to me too.

Now the Boy Scouts (an Outer Order of a different kind) have this motto, "Be Prepared!" And I've played around with this wilderness survival stuff, and the urban survival thing and the US Army taught me how to kill (which I have never done), but not how to cook or hunt or grow things. Neither did the Boy Scouts. Nor the concrete jungle.

Yes, it took certain lines from Liber AL to point us in the right direction, a half-century ago ... but we also stored gasoline, lumber, and hardware. The women were no problem, they just came around and some decided to stay. I don't know much about spices, but they're important for food preservation in certain settings. I was a purveyor of incense. We had a doc with a license, so any kind of OTC or Rx drug was available, and a lot of them were stored. The ironic part is, nobody came out of the Great Storeroom in the Desert addicted to anything but tobacco ... except the doc, who was the only one who sampled his stores.

Then I gave all that up. I became a semi-normal citizen. I entered medical school, graduated and immediately ran (administered) the school I just graduated from. I enjoyed a career of treating patients while upgrading a series of schools. But I did not get in trouble for sampling my stores, because Doctors of Oriental Medicine are not to be trusted with dangerous drugs - only herbs (some of which can kill, so it's not light-duty), of which I took/take many, but avoid the nasties.

During my period wherein I posed as a normal person, I gathered a small amount of stores. A dental laboratory, lots of herbs and (solid, not illegal hollow) needles, tools, books. A couple women came along, and (figure this one out, guys) they both ran up the ladder to 5=6 without a hitch and without cheating on The Tasks of the Grades.

A few guys came around. One who arrived a long time ago ('79), took a while but he 5=6'd as well. But the rest of them pooped out during probation, and a couple made it to 1=10. But I wasn't collecting guys for storage, so who cares. I have always cut everyone loose at 5=6.

Oh, wait, I was not collecting spices or women as well, so I married one of them and the other went on to run her own starship.

Then, after pretending to be normal for 33 years, I/we retired from normalcy and retired. My wife, who has never been normal, who prides herself in "living off the grid" her entire life, asked me, "Why do you keep all that stuff?" (my store of tools and parts). She has since found out why (when I make inexpensive repairs), but she doesn't like that stuff.

We then lived a normal, boring retirement for 12 years. It was so boring that we resorted, like U.G. and A.C., to reading novels for hours and days on end. I re-assembled my solar panel and 3-battery bank.

Then, one day in '17, my wife hurled prophecies upon me. "The grid is failing; the grid is failing!" This motivated me to replace the shot, single remaining battery with 3 Solar Powerhouse batteries at 15% of their retail cost, even though they were new. This initiated storage. Each week since then ('17), she has brought home extra water, food, and dog toys.

Lately, the past 3-4 months, I have reverted to Boy Scout standards. Spices? No, my wife looks after those. Women? Well, we know a couple, but they live in their own houses. Both of them have expressed to same opinion - they think all this funny stuff that is going on world-wide is "going to return to normal." We're not collecting woman right now - that's the job of the younger studs who might be reading this thread. Go getem, fellows, the clock is tick-tocking.

Seriously, just do the wu-wei and they'll come to you.

Goods? Yeah. Especially items, mainly dealing with possible loss of electricity, water, natural gas, or www.

So, why did AL instruct to gather things (including female people)? Why did AC's last publication of AL say that WW2 would destroy civilization? Why did Therion warn of a 500-year "dark age" moving in? Enough of Why, I will give you the Because.

Because things are breaking down, right now, before our very eyes and in our very utility companies. I have had to evoke the Emergency Power Station three times in the past 6 months or so, due to etensive power-offage (about 12 hours each time - usually a 30-minute to 1-hour deal).

That's enough. Perhaps I will go back to pretending to be normally retired and sleep. But I worry about you folks in the Ur-ban cities. If you turn up the paranoia dial, and follow the advice of the survival school, you will have three exit routes set up in your "tentative movements" mind.

This has been a Public Service Announcement, sponsored in part by The Boy Scouts of America and Antarctica, and The Liber AL Foundation.


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katrice
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Posted by: @shiva

 

Oh, yeah, I remember those now ... not that I actually forgot them in the second place. In the first place, I was just mixing and matching. Sort of like ...

Posted by: @katrice

stores of women, strange drugs, and spices all sound good to me too.

I knew that, I just figured if I went along with it I'd get a story.  😀 

 

And, before anyone else out there assumes, my comment was not my expressing a desire for sex slaves.  Consent is crucial. 

 

Yes, it took certain lines from Liber AL to point us in the right direction, a half-century ago ... but we also stored gasoline, lumber, and hardware. The women were no problem, they just came around and some decided to stay. I don't know much about spices, but they're important for food preservation in certain settings. I was a purveyor of incense. We had a doc with a license, so any kind of OTC or Rx drug was available, and a lot of them were stored

 

There's nothing wrong with self-sufficiency and DIY  

 

  they both ran up the ladder to 5=6 without a hitch and without cheating on The Tasks of the Grades.

I'd call it impossible to truly attain a Grade while cheating on the tasks

 

  But I wasn't collecting guys for storage  

They'd be required too, if I was storing. 😉 

 

  reading novels for hours and days on end. 

 

A life I'd dream about having.

 

  We're not collecting woman right now - that's the job of the younger studs who might be reading this thread. Go getem, fellows, the clock is tick-tocking.

Not only "fellows"!

 

Seriously, just do the wu-wei and they'll come to you.

As everything will, in time.

 

 Why did Therion warn of a 500-year "dark age" moving in?  

 

There are plenty of people saying that now, too, some of who (not me) seem to be looking forward to it.

 

 . If you turn up the paranoia dial, and follow the advice of the survival school, you will have three exit routes set up in your "tentative movements" mind.

 Like I said above, there's nothing wrong with self-sufficiency and DIY. Even if you never need what you learn in that way, it can still benefit you in other parts of your life.   


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Shiva
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Posted by: @katrice

I'd call it impossible to truly attain a Grade while cheating on the tasks

The real really true grades, earned through diligent work and seasonal encounters with the initiatory archetype? Those ones? Yes, I agree.

The formal or informal grades bestowed by someone in fancy dress who is influential in some line or neo-org, or even just a piece of parchment granting one a grade - all this, more or less, in an order or line or ladder run by human persons - some of who may play the [gasp] favortism game (for wealth, influence, or [maybe] sex?)   No, it's possible under these appointed circumstances.

Pardon me, but I'm often quick to make the distinction between the real thing and something designed to imitate that process, run by people who may demand money.

Posted by: @katrice

As everything will, in time.

One can speed the process up by simply doing The Invocation of Thoth (Liber Israefel, or spelled something like that). Once a day or eve.

Posted by: @katrice

There are plenty of people saying that now, too, some of who (not me) seem to be looking forward to it.

I am an old person now. I don't have the Chi available that I did back when we saw it coming ... prematurely. Now I have to fall back on old skills, and it's a pain in the rump room. I would simply be most pleased if I could just be left alone (which I am, right now), but I at least want the utilities left on.

-----

The Attached video shows the Tomé Hole Phenomenon. It is just over 2 minutes - The Hill is just 2 miles away. The panorama is not particularly professional, what with a house and a tree blocking much of the view.

There are three round-views of the circle on a day when Tomé Hill was flexing it's muscles. One can see in the color of the sky overhead that this zone is clear. Sometimes the circle comes in closer and it's right down on the ground, rumbling and spitting lightning (at night. I had a video of it in close (daytime). Dark clouds all around, but the blue sky could be seen through the Holy Hole in the clouds up there above Tomé Hill. I'll keep looking for The Lost Word Video, and watch for a new opportunity to capture that deal.

The 3 passes are essentially the same, taken 20 or 60 minutes apart. The first pass identifies the landmarks - for those who don't regularly commute through the Rio Grande Valley. All the scenery may remind you of those funny films taken by plane crews who fly into the Open Eye of a Hurricane. It's a better ride if you click the "full screen" do-dad on the player ...

.

 


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katrice
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Posted by: @shiva

 The formal or informal grades bestowed by someone in fancy dress who is influential in some line or neo-org, or even just a piece of parchment granting one a grade - all this, more or less, in an order or line or ladder run by human persons -

I don't personally care about those grades, just the "really true" ones.

 

some of who may play the [gasp] favortism game (for wealth, influence, or [maybe] sex?)   

can confirm the maybe

Pardon me, but I'm often quick to make the distinction between the real thing and something designed to imitate that process, run by people who may demand money.

I completely understand.

One can speed the process up by simply doing The Invocation of Thoth (Liber Israefel, or spelled something like that). Once a day or eve.

I shall have to add that to my regimen. 

The Attached video shows the Tomé Hole Phenomenon  

Very interesting!  And good choice of music too!   I wonder, would you compare this phenomenon to something like Reich's Cloudbuster? 

 

 


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Shiva
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Posted by: @katrice

I wonder, would you compare this phenomenon to something like Reich's Cloudbuster?

I don't know anything about this Cloud, Buster - so I cannot compare. If you could provide a simple definition ... ?


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katrice
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@shiva 

 

The Cloudbuster was a device that Wilhelm Reich invented that was intended to manipulate weather through orgone energy, grounding energies believed to form clouds or drawing energies that aided in the formation of clouds, in order to prevent or create rainfall.  Some natural structures are said to act as orgone accumulators, so natural cloudbusting sites would not be out of the question.  


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Shiva
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Posted by: @katrice

natural cloudbusting sites would not be out of the question.  

I see. I also see that will will have to open the laboratory.

Orgone is synonymous with Ki, Chi, Qi, Prana, Vril, and some other names. I think Tesla called it "fine matter." This is the energy that is linked to the 8th, Quantum, neuro-circuit - and is sometimes called Quantum energy. Our contemporary brethren et sistren, the Scientists of the Fifth Ray [Lemon Yellow], have stated, "All these ferenghi names are confusing. We have decided to call this Scalar energy. So that's the term if you (anyone) want's to be hip and current. I may continue to say QUAN TUM, because I'm used to it, and I did not authorize, nor was I consulted by, the upstarts who are redefining the esoteric lingo.

Anyway, there are two energies at work in our current reality. We are all familiar with ElectromagnetismEMF (electro-magnetic-force) pretty much runs everything from Solar Plasma & Light down to Atomic-bonding & Gravity. EMF is partnered with The Theory of Relativity (credit: Albert E.).  Insert Note: Aleister C. claims to have beaten Albert E. to this insight - See Liber AL and the )=2 equation. There's only one place (a pretty big one) where The Theory of Relativity breaks down and can no longer explain "reality" - and that secret sanctuary place is Inside a Black Hole.

Then this physicist guy, Max P., popped up with his Quantum Theory, which is said to be reliable inside a Black Hole, 

Today, scientist are trying to mate Quantum and Relativity into a Unified Field Theory that will fit all environments.

Now, all this funny stuff started with Tesla. First he gave us alternating current that runs over wires to light our homes and run our refrigerators ... Then he went up on a hill in Colorado Springs, Colorado (now Home of the US Space Force) and set up a Quantum (Scalar) Generator ... lighting up light bulbs in homes 25 miles away!

J.p. Morgan backed Tesla and Westinghouse on the A.C. invention - because he could put a meter in the wires and charge fees. But he refused to back the Quantum version - "Free electricity? No way!"

I now Declare the Laboratory Open (curtsy).

I immediately convert your wondering into "Is Tome Hill emitting some Quantum (Scalar) effect? Orgone-based manipulation of the spectrum.

I immediately answer: No, I don't think it's a ClodBuster. But then I don't know what it is or doing, so I shall either abstain or recuse myself from any firm opinion. Here are the facts, ma'm ...

Tome Hill is a volcanic bump. It never erupted. Los Lunas Hill, shown in the video, actually erupted, and it has a cone. There are other similar bumps around here, but they don't exhibit weather patterns. The ancients noted the, what?, energy of the Hill, and they made it a spiritual site (by definition and pictographs), and it remains a religious site today for the papists and the penitentes.

image

.

image

.

I didn't know any of this when we moved here, but I soon noticed a natural circle (which I naturally assumed to be Magickal) that affected the weather ... but only by resisting the incursion of clouds and rain.

One day, I told a visitor about this. He said, "So it's a negative ion generator." Storms, wind, clouds are spurred on by negative ions. Negative deflects negative. Since storms/clouds are resisted (sometimes to a tiny hole over the Hill), then it (the Hill) must be negative. It's the same principle as trying to push thenorth poles of two magnets together. Following that hypothesis, I have found it to be a reasonable explanation - based on the Theory of Relativity.

It seems as though, if it were an Orgone/Quantum situation, that the Hill might be programmable. I have seen no evidence of that, but it should not be discarded. This Scalar Stuff is pretty amazing. What is under/inside Tome Hill?, and can its output be modified by a miniature copy in my back yard? When you come to visit, I will give you a shovel and point you toward the Hill. You may also participate when we dump buckets of water on the miniature Hill, or parch it with a hair dryer. All this to see if the weather changes.

I never quite understood how Crowley equated 0=2 with Albert E's Theory of relativity. Did you? Did anyone out there? I'd like to hear it explained in street language. 

 


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katrice
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Posted by: @shiva

I see. I also see that will will have to open the laboratory.

Orgone is synonymous with Ki, Chi, Qi, Prana, Vril, and some other names. 

Exactly.

 

I think Tesla called it "fine matter." This is the energy that is linked to the 8th, Quantum, neuro-circuit - and is sometimes called Quantum energy.

Auric Magick's nonlocal effects

 

Our contemporary brethren et sistren, the Scientists of the Fifth Ray [Lemon Yellow], have stated, "All these ferenghi names are confusing. We have decided to call this Scalar energy. So that's the term if you (anyone) want's to be hip and current.   

I've never been one for hipness. Any hipness on my part is unintentional.   😛 

 

Then this physicist guy, Max P., popped up with his Quantum Theory, which is said to be reliable inside a Black Hole, 

Planck. 

Now, all this funny stuff started with Tesla. First he gave us alternating current that runs over wires to light our homes and run our refrigerators ... Then he went up on a hill in Colorado Springs, Colorado (now Home of the US Space Force) and set up a Quantum (Scalar) Generator ... lighting up light bulbs in homes 25 miles away!

and the Wardenclyffe Tower in Long Island.

 

I immediately convert your wondering into "Is Tome Hill emitting some Quantum (Scalar) effect? Orgone-based manipulation of the spectrum.

I immediately answer: No, I don't think it's a ClodBuster. But then I don't know what it is or doing, so I shall either abstain or recuse myself from any firm opinion. Here are the facts, ma'm ...

The negative ion idea does make as much sense as anything. 

Just to clarify my idea, I wouldn't think that it was intentional, just maybe something to do with the structure of the hill making it a natural accumulator and cloudbuster, which could explain the attraction to the site for these people, like you mentioned, possibly combined with some energetic side-effect of their practices. It doesn't have to be anything under the hill, it could be something as simple as alternating layers of rock and earth in its makeup.  If I remember right, Reich's orgone was in some ways an expansion on the original idea of libido, which was less sex drive and more an energetic phenomenon. Reich's orgastic potency was very much about releasing energetic blockages. I could compare the (unintended) effects of their crucifixions to what I mentioned about Maria's  Mystery of the Hanging, combining an altered state with extreme physical stress and release. There could be a lot of energy getting released on that hill, which could combine with some property in the hill's structure.  This is all just idle speculation on my part. 

 

When you come to visit, I will give you a shovel and point you toward the Hill. You may also participate when we dump buckets of water on the miniature Hill, or parch it with a hair dryer. All this to see if the weather changes.

If I'm out your way I'll take you up on that! 😉 

I never quite understood how Crowley equated 0=2 with Albert E's Theory of relativity. Did you? Did anyone out there? I'd like to hear it explained in street language. 

That one never made sense to me either, but I'd love to see an explanation. 

 


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Shiva
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Posted by: @katrice

and the Wardenclyffe Tower in Long Island.

Okay, so you already know the story. Tesla, his tale, the greater part of his life story, all comes down to that Tower ... which was a device that would broadcast on ALL FREQUENCIES SIMULTANEOUSLY.

The Tower was well underway in its construction ...

image

Here's The Official Party Line about this modern-day Tower of Babylon ...

Wardenclyffe Tower (1901–1917), also known as the Tesla Tower, was an early experimental wireless transmission station designed and built by Nikola Tesla on Long Island in 1901–1902, located in the village of Shoreham, New York. Tesla intended to transmit messages, telephony and even facsimile images across the Atlantic to England and to ships at sea based on his theories of using the Earth to conduct the signals. His decision to scale up the facility and implement his ideas of wireless power transmission to better compete with Guglielmo Marconi's radio-based telegraph system was met with refusal to fund the changes by the project's primary backer, financier J. P. Morgan. Additional investment could not be found, and the project was abandoned in 1906, never to become operational.  -Wikipedia.

Ah, we see that Tesla was on the ground, getting results in electrifying the world, before Aleister C., Albert E., and Max P.   This Alternating Current thing was perhaps the crowning achievement of the Osirian Age. But the Quantum/Scalar thing was too advanced for J.P. Morgan, old moneybags himself, and he said ...

"Leave it for the next Aeon, Nikola."

I don't know that those were his exact worda, but the answer was "No."

So we got 110 Volts AC running into our homes on wires, while the booming coal and oil industries made smoke, and more smoke.

I understand that when Tesla died, the FBI was into his safe within hours, carrying off the papers that would move Quantum/Scalar Energy research into The Black Ops departments of the gov. 

Posted by: @katrice

I wouldn't think that it was intentional, just maybe something to do with the structure of the hill making it a natural accumulator ...

I have studied and visited places that are known as Vortices most of my life. Some of them (like The Oregon Vortex, The Texas Hill Country, the many Vortices of Sedona, AZ, and Montauk Point, Long Island) are supposedly at the intersection of Ley Lines (Earth's electromagnetic grid "nadis."). This is where my research breaks down. There are many "maps" of the Ley Lines on the www, but they are mostly drawings of the world with chickenwire mesh lines, but I can't find anything in DETAIL. If you, or anybody else, can evoke a link to LEY LINE DETAILS - that would be great.

But there may not be any anybodys else. It seems like you and I are talking way off-topic at the end of an almost empty forum hall. Of course, our existence may be justified by citing Tesla's work as a transgression against established science, and Crowley's self-inclusion in the scientific collection of inventors in the early 1900s should keep us within the rules.

Posted by: @katrice

the attraction to the site for these people

image

 

 


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David Dom Lemieux
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Posted by: @katrice

 

Just to clarify my idea, I wouldn't think that it was intentional, just maybe something to do with the structure of the hill making it a natural accumulator and cloudbuster, w

An accumulator by Reich's standards is not  a cloud buster.  The cloud buster was a type of canon that was said to be able to release and direct/shoot Orgone (or whatever) at the skies or draw Orgone into it but a hill-structure built with alternate forms of organic and inorganic matter isn't a canon structure, it's a hill.   The hill is not going to bust clouds or make it rain.

 

I haven't seen Reich's thesis on the cloud buster but I doubt that it put Lavoisier to shame with it's levels of  thoroughness.  The stats are too fuzzy, how do you delineate whether a terrestrial metal object directly affected a group of clouds or didn't?   He was in correspondence with Einstein at one stage but the latter broke off all ties with him. 

 

I don't think I ever read anything about Crowley being interested in ley lines curiously enough. 

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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David Dom Lemieux
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Posted by: @shiva
Posted by: @katrice
 

I wouldn't think that it was intentional, just maybe something to do with the structure of the hill making it a natural accumulator ...

 

Apologies for double but whilst we're on the subject, Reich would've viewed any 'trance of loathing' or so called magical  Aghori-like activity as being wrong and mad (the end result of centuries of 'Patriarchal' damage) i.e. he would've put it in the same box as a) the many disorders that he treated or b) the rise of the Nazis which he personally documented at the time in Germany. 

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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katrice
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Posted by: @david-dom-lemieux

An accumulator by Reich's standards is not  a cloud buster.  The cloud buster was a type of canon that was said to be able to release and direct/shoot Orgone (or whatever) at the skies or draw Orgone into it but a hill-structure built with alternate forms of organic and inorganic matter isn't a canon structure, it's a hill.   The hill is not going to bust clouds or make it rain.

True. I was just speculating and wondering if the combination of factors could produce a similar effect.

But also conceded that the ion theory was plausible too.

 

Do you have a theory, Dom?

I don't think I ever read anything about Crowley being interested in ley lines curiously enough. 

 

I don't remember anything from him about them either.

Posted by: @david-dom-lemieux

Reich would've viewed any 'trance of loathing' or so called magical  Aghori-like activity as being wrong and mad (the end result of centuries of 'Patriarchal' damage)

Also true, he would have, but he also would have viewed magickal activity itself as wrong and mad.

That said, such activity works in terms of releasing energetic blockages and confronting complexes.   


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katrice
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Posted by: @shiva

Okay, so you already know the story.  

I've done some reading.

 If you, or anybody else, can evoke a link to LEY LINE DETAILS - that would be great.

There really doesn't seem to be a lot of agreement on that. 

 

  It seems like you and I are talking way off-topic at the end of an almost empty forum hall. Of course, our existence may be justified by citing Tesla's work as a transgression against established science, and Crowley's self-inclusion in the scientific collection of inventors in the early 1900s should keep us within the rules.

Reich may qualify too, and applying his principles to works of indulgence and transgression work well.  The ideas of crucifixion as  a gateway to gnostic experience, although applied by these people in a right hand path manner, also can serve as a transgressive act that could be applied in initiatory work.

 


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Shiva
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Posted by: @david-dom-lemieux

The hill is not going to bust clouds or make it rain.

Right. This Hill does not make rain - it pushes rain clouds away.

It is only a "CloudBuster" in the sense that it is still pushing when heavy cloud cover comes in, but a tiny hole remains to the sky over the Hill. Then it often (usually) gets closed (by a strong storm), the Hole closes, and the Rain begins. In my present mind-state, I still thinks its Negative Ions, not Quantum/Scalar/Orgone related.

Posted by: @david-dom-lemieux

I don't think I ever read anything about Crowley being interested in ley lines curiously enough. 

Yes. Ley Lines are an older concept, surely popular during the Crowley era. But then there were other popular topics that he didn't seem to address.

Posted by: @katrice

I was just speculating

Almost everything we're onto here is (mainly) speculation, a passing of the time, until some evidential evidence comes forth.

Posted by: @katrice

I don't remember anything from him about them [Ley Lines] either.

I have just summoned up "Ley Lines" on Wikipedia, which is often a good place to start. I also offer up this pic ...

image

And here's one with USA detail, but it's poorly detailed, and fuzzy to boot, which illustrates my problem ...

image
Posted by: @katrice

There really doesn't seem to be a lot of agreement on that. 

The two maps I posted are in general agreement. I see a major nexus just off the coast of Florida, and a big one near Yuma, AZ (I'll have to really consider that one - every time (EVERY) I drove through Yuma, it was like the Pit of Hell (the hot one, not the frozen version). All maps seem to agree on the union at the Giza plateau.

 If possible <haha>, I would like intersections delineated by little circles no more than 11 feet in diameter. Then I can go there and say, "This is It!" and take pictures to prove it ... or something like that.

 

 


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Shiva
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I have completed my homework and I have found out that ...

"The idea of "leys" as straight tracks across the landscape was put forward by the English antiquarian Alfred Watkins in the 1920s, particularly in his book The Old Straight Track. He argued that straight lines could be drawn between various historic structures and that these represented trade routes created by ancient British societies." - Wikipedia

It turns out Ley Lines are a belief system, and nobody has come up with any proof, evidence, or data that confirms any "lines" (electromagnetic, trade routes, paths, or otherwise). As your personal cosmic stock-broker, I'd say don't go broke by betting on this one.


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David Dom Lemieux
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Posted by: @katrice 

Do you have a theory, Dom?

Orgone is said to encompass all matter but it is concentrated in certain structures such as water. If a physicist wants to risk his reputation he can do the math.  I'm not a physicist and I don't care.   Why discuss it?  Why ask Buddha if God exists?  He said it was irrelevant but we do know what the Law is.   Dharma that is.  I believe Orgone is described as follows;

 

14. Above, the gemmed azure is
The naked splendour of Nuit;
She bends in ecstasy to kiss
The secret ardours of Hadit.
The winged globe, the starry blue,
Are mine, O Ankh-af-na-khonsu!

26. Then saith the prophet and slave of the beauteous one: Who am I, and what shall be the sign? So she answered him, bending down, a lambent flame of blue, all-touching, all penetrant,

~  AL

..so if that's my theory I don't expect to be taken seriously.... by the people anyway. 

Posted by: @katrice

Also true, he would have, but he also would have viewed magickal activity itself as wrong and mad.

That said, such activity works in terms of releasing energetic blockages and confronting complexes.   

Maybe.   It depends.

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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Shiva
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Posted by: @katrice

That said, such activity works in terms of releasing energetic blockages ...

The exact same thing is said of Chi and the actions of Acu-needles and Herbs.


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katrice
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Posted by: @david-dom-lemieux
   Why discuss it?   

 

Following that logic, why discuss anything?

 

...so if that's my theory I don't expect to be taken seriously.... by the people anyway. 

I believe RAW said similar things, and I do agree that some experiences of the vision of Nuit can be explained this way, having had similar experiences myself from doing Energized Meditation. 

 

But I was asking about a theory on how the hill itself worked. 

 

Maybe.   It depends.

I'm not sure which of my quoted statements this refers to. 

 

Posted by: @shiva

The exact same thing is said of Chi and the actions of Acu-needles and Herbs.

This is true, and I was just referring to these practices as they relate to Reich's ideas, which to a Reichian purist would be a more materialistic and psychological model of the world.

 

It turns out Ley Lines are a belief system 

like, for example, models that magickal systems are based on?  😉 

 

I want to mention that I have never meant to imply that I believe that the topics that I described in my first post on this thread, and my comments relevant to those topics, are to be taken as being for everyone, or that they represent my idea of the best approach for everyone. I know that they're really not even for most people.  They are what works for me, and for others that follow this manifestation of the Path. We each have our own callings, and this is how I feel called to pursue my own work. 

 


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Shiva
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Posted by: @katrice

like, for example, models that magickal systems are based on? 

Sort of. However, some esoteric concepts have been drawn down from theory into practical application. The Ley Line Theory has not been proven in any way through earth-bound sciences. But Tesla "dreamed up" an "impossible" invention, and now we rely on AC electricity all day long - every day. 

Anyway, although we all tend to lean on one belief system or another, Crowley warned us against it. This is why I favor his Class D practices, but take his philosophy carefully. I mean it's based on an absolute (so-declared) "belief" in a praeterhuman guy named Aiwass.

Anyway more, I'm a bit distracted right now. 80,000 Haitians, many armed by the cartel(s), have just run across our southern border and strange things are happening over Tome Hill. The word is that the Nat'l Guard and local cops just backed off and let them in. Private militias are said to be responding, but the situation is not clear. I have seen a video of the "invasion," but the mainstream news is not (yet) covering this. So I have to go now and decide when it's time to load up.


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Shiva
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P.S. - Here's a pic of the funny stuff in the sky ...

image

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hadgigegenraum
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If I may make an indulgence of sorts and enter the thread through perhaps one of its transgressing meanderings, to thus speak to a query of Shiva's regarding Einstein and Crowley!...(which will lead us to searing of the flesh tortures and ecstasies ... from whips to furs...I promise!)

Crowley appreciated Einstein's "Special Theory of Relativity" as it served the zeitgeist of the New Aeon and the smashing of the old order with a radical subjectivity that even Einstein would rebel with his 
"God does not play dice" quip against the Quantum kids and their playing with randomness and probability...and thus the statistical models being used to predict, manipulate and control, rather than to "divine" as one might use the I Ching or Tarot to divine the underlying order...

Note that Einstein burst on to the world stage in 1905 in what has been called a miracle year "annus mirabilis" with a number of papers including the E=MC2 equivalency formula. I am sure, from the Richard T. Cole perspective on the Cairo Revelation, that a back dating to 1904 for the reception of Liber Legis due to a need to supersede Einstein's revolution...

Crowley's equivalency formula 0=2 is certainly a more elegant equation, simple and all encompassing, including such derivatives as Einstein's plagiarism. 

Yes Virginia, Einstein's originality does come into question as this short article provides an outline

http://allais.maurice.free.fr/English/Einstein1.htm

Of course Crowley would be accused of the same, but it can be argued that genius has something to do with the packaging....

And now a note from our sponsors-

Both Einstein and Crowley are found on the Beatles Sgt. Pepper's album cover, Einstein in the front row, and the bad boy Beast is found with the mug shot like photo, his bald dome piercing into the infinite blue, how fitting, and yes Dom I do resonate with your reference to the Stele paraphrase and lines from Liber Legis suggestive of Reich's blue atmospheric orgone energy. Thanks!

Now many know that it was Wilhelm Reich who presented novel laboratory equipment, the Orgone Accumulator to Albert Einstein for review, to which Einstein was open to what he regarded would be a "bombshell for science". Later positive findings were dismissed relative to an argument of "convection currents', one that Reich came to suspect that Einstein was being purposefully mislead by his assistant Leopold Infeld, whom Reich identified as a "red fascist".

The "convection" explanation would later be proven incorrect.

http://www.encyclopedianomadica.org/English/reich_einstein_experiment.php

Reich was of course undaunted in pursuing his scientific work regarding his novel discoveries which did involve weather modification with his DOR buster, where DOR stands for Destructive Orgone Energy, and where Reich was aware of the negative impact of nuclear explosions and other pollution that was making man further crazy and killing the planet, upon what he had termed in a sociological sense the Emotional Plague.

Now Reich's breakthrough came through his work as a psychiatrist in the school of Freud, where, Reich was presented with patients who could not get off sexually, have an orgasm, without being spanked, whipped or beat, and where hyperventilation and asphyxiation, being bound, tickled, cut, dipped in honey and left for the insects, etc, etc. spoke from Reich's clinical observations, and upon realizing that the libido was not just a word that described an energy, an energy that wanted to fill up a bag of skin like a balloon, to be filled with more and more energy, that was not able to simply surrender and relax into the sexual embrace but needed to be whipped spanked prodded with cattle prods etc in order to come....

Indulgences and transgressions, where certain physical mechanical needs corresponded to psychological complexes, of wanting to be humiliated in a panoply of sin indulgences, right up the Church's confessionals, or sported in Liber Pyramids.

Reich came to see such behaviors as an attempt at wholeness, of health, and Crowley likewise as a means of freedom and psycho spiritual integration.

Reich's work looked beyond dualisms of mind and body, and the split of science and religion, he saw the devil as but a manifestation of a somatic split, an armoring of one's eyes and brain, that would so create phantasms, illusions and stories, the feverish dreams of those caught in their own biological trap and seeking to blast through such armor, and where Reich understood that drugs etc would give glimpses of that freedom, but tend to then intensify the armor, without love, as the stimulus wore off...

Ahh, but such psychonautic pioneers, upon indulgences and transgressions, hero casualties or just victims, how many died from the drug culture pushed by the same elite press that pushed Einstein and the bomb, and no future, and Covid, and the present panopticon....and Reich died in prison, murdered, his work mocked,  distorted, and in many ways lost...just as Crowley's great work sequestered and spun...

So hold the fort and maybe climb an old volcano that never blew!

 


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Shiva
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Posted by: @hadgigegenraum

playing with randomness and probability.

Yes, that's what we get if we dive deeply into the box labeled "How does this Quantum stuff work?" This box attempts to explain simpler things on the surface. On the surface (of the planet), if one, anyone, especially Tesla who did it first, starts an arc running up a Jacob's Ladder, with magnets on each side of the arc, and then disrupts (breaks) the current, a "rip" or "tear" occurs in the etheric medium ... and energy is released.

image

This was shown, not by randomy or probably, to reliably light up light-bulbs 25 miles away from the infernal/supernal radiator.

image

This part (effect)  is not random or probable. Let there be Light! ... and there was Light. This is what it looked like in operation ...

image
Posted by: @hadgigegenraum

... the statistical models being used to predict, manipulate and control, rather than to "divine" ...

Oh, that. Yes, let's study it more and find out how it works under various variables. Let's see, I think the first thing should not be lighted bulbs, but rather a device that will evaporate those people I do not like.   "Scalar weapons are already part of the consideration. J.P. Morgan and The Gov will not give funds for light bulbs, but billion$ are available for weapons of individual and mass destruction.

Posted by: @hadgigegenraum

Of course Crowley would be accused of the same, but it can be argued that genius has something to do with the packaging....

Sure. But accusations and arguments take time, and right now I'm getting busier because of the, you know, "invasion," so let me say that AC and Albert E. got caught up in the confusion of what surrounds many (any?) breakthroughs. Nature seems to provide multiple entry-points for newness. This means that two or more (often many more) people will come up with the same idea at approximately the same time, and then spend the rest of their lives arguing about who was first. 

 

 


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katrice
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Posted by: @shiva

Sort of. However, some esoteric concepts have been drawn down from theory into practical application. The Ley Line Theory has not been proven in any way through earth-bound sciences.  

Agreed, but other energy systems like kundalini, reiki, and qigong, haven't been proven in any way through earth-bound sciences either.    I haven't tried working directly with the idea, but I'm sure others have, but that also raises questions of whether they get results from ley lines, or from something else that they interpret as ley lines.

In some ways, belief in magick itself is a form of antinomianism towards society, against both mainstream science and mainstream religion.  Satanism and Thelema particularly so since they tend to have more sinister reputations.  

Anyway, although we all tend to lean on one belief system or another, Crowley warned us against it. This is why I favor his Class D practices, but take his philosophy carefully. I mean it's based on an absolute (so-declared) "belief" in a praeterhuman guy named Aiwass.

We all do tend to lean on one belief system or another. I think that that's where healthy skepticism comes in. Not the popular definition of the word, but the idea of not investing absolute belief in anything, but keeping open to ideas that may cause one to feel the need to update their beliefs.  Like RAW's approach.  

  I have seen a video of the "invasion," but the mainstream news is not (yet) covering this.  

 

A quick search turns up posts about it from The Washington Post, Reuters, CNN, The New Republic, and The Hill, dating back to late September. 


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katrice
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Posted by: @hadgigegenraum

Reich came to see such behaviors as an attempt at wholeness, of health, and Crowley likewise as a means of freedom and psycho spiritual integration.

 

Thank you for the interesting response!

The key different between indulgence and transgression against the self being whether it's something you enjoy, or something you do not enjoy. Each has its place and each has its own power. 

 

Reich's work looked beyond dualisms of mind and body, and the split of science and religion, he saw the devil as but a manifestation of a somatic split, an armoring of one's eyes and brain, that would so create phantasms, illusions and stories, the feverish dreams of those caught in their own biological trap and seeking to blast through such armor,

The Devil can become your ally through reconciliation. 

 

 and where Reich understood that drugs etc would give glimpses of that freedom, but tend to then intensify the armor, without love, as the stimulus wore off...

 

Like with visions, they mean nothing unless you can get something from them that you can use afterwards.

 

Ahh, but such psychonautic pioneers, upon indulgences and transgressions, hero casualties or just victims, 

 The Path is not a safe one. 

 


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Shiva
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Posted by: @katrice

Agreed, but other energy systems like kundalini, reiki, and qigong, haven't been proven in any way through earth-bound sciences either.

I'll pass on the Kundalini, but I went out of my way to temporarily leave my BonPo Empowerment lineage to enroll, at a very reasonable price, in the three degrees of Reiki - so that when I did demos, and people asked (with Stars in their eyes), "Are you a Reiki Master.?" I could give the proper answer.

You see, it so distressed me to see the light drop out of their eyes when I said, "No, what I'm talking about is much more powerful than Reiki."  That did nothing but crack or burst the illusionary rapture they looked forward to by being face-to-face with a real Reiki Master. So I promised myself that I'd keep my eye out for anything reasonable. When the 1st degree came up for $50, I jumped on it (traditionally $150). When the same guy, a month later, offered the 2nd degree for $65, I jumped again (the "standard" price is $500). When he verbally offered the exalted, supreme crown of attainment, the 3rd degree for $300 (normally $10,000), I spoke up, and he said, "Come to my house." 

I went (at the appointed date and time). I received the oral transmission (a long lecture, with details). I received the 3rd degree empowerment. Then I received the empowerment that empowered me to empower other people. I handed over 3 Franklins. He handed over a lineage doc. If I remember correctly, I am #13 in (this) line from Dr. Usui, who founded the art. Then he handed over a Diploma/Certificate that showed 25 hours of California Board Approved, continuing education hours. We had spent 3 hours together this evening. I pointed that out.

"If you actually do (DO) the things mentioned in the lecture, it'll be just about that number of hours."

I replied, "I see." I have not yet empowered my first Reiki candidate. No, I have much more fun with this than that. What I do is this, with an individual or a room of about 20 students, or a room of 20 in the audience, more or less ... After the initial lecture (which distinguisheses between Reiki and Wolf Star [Sirius - in Chinese], Empowerment], I take the first person, or the solo person, sit them in a chair, and I put my hand on their head, and I say, "This is Level One Reiki - let me know when you feel it." 

I can tell you that it is a warm tan-brown vibrating flow - that can be felt by anybody (except the very few - like 1%).

This is an absolutely great preliminary state for the next step. I say, "And this is Sirius Level one." The voiced reaction is usually "Wow," or "Oh, my God!"

Both Reiki and Sirius deliver the same energy as Qi Gong. I was empowered in White Cloud Monastery Medical Qi Gong by one of the few monks who escaped being killed when the Commies destroyed all the monasteries but four. White Cloud was one. It is now a tourist attraction.

None of the above is objective proof of anything. It is me talking about my background in order to establish my credibility as a "subject matter expert." That was my title when I worked for the California Acupuncture Board, Dept of Consumer Affairs: Enforcement. This last word means police ("investigators"), arrests, and court. I am not saying I will arrest you, or testify against you, but I would like to pass on a few words about the phrase haven't been proven in any way through earth-bound sciences.

Anyway, my unusual, um, credentials mentioned above had their root in Oriental Medical School. I started there at age 42. We learned the whole Chinese system. It's simple (not complex like Western Medicine). It is comparable to learning 777 and Sepher Sephiroth - and then using it to treat sick people in the clinic. Many scientific papers have been published on the efficacy of needles, herbs, and Qi Gong

So that was the original curriculum for Gai Jin (foreigners, lierally "barbarians") in California. But then, before I got to school, the gov upgraded acupuncturists from "Supervision by an M.D." to "Primary Care Physicia." which is what everybody wanted. But the gov said, "There's no way you can be primary-care unless you take the following courses ..." which they added to the curriculum. You know, Pathology, Western Medicine ! & II, Pharmacology, Biochemistry, etc, etc.

I was already advanced enough when I got to school that I taught the Physics course, while I was still a student. One thing I learned up front was that the MDs, who were doing everything they could to smash Chi (mainly acupuncture). Their answer to Chi was, "It stops pain through hypnosis." They also said, "There are no channels. We have looked for them in cadavers." Their are no "points" on the body. There is no Chi."  I think the same position was taken by them in relation to Reich and Orgone.

Here are the simple answers:

Hypnosis? Oh? Then why does it (Acu, Herb, or Chi Kung [Cantonese spelling] work on dogs?

Of course there are no channels to be seen in a dead person. Chi is not conducted over tubes or strands that look like nerves. Each POINT is like a directional microwave tower. The beams are sent down a "valley" or "canyon" to the next point. The valleys can be felt by anyone by running a finger down the long grooves in their arms or legs. So even to the practitioner, the "channel" is an abstract belief. Who among us can see a microwave beam? - Even if the patient can feel the Chi running down the channel, right where the textbook said it should be.

So it comes down to the points. Can the points be proven with hard Malkuthian Science? Oh, yeah. We all have one of these ...

image

We use these to apply electricity to points, with or without needles. It has another circuit called "Point Detection." It [gasp] measures the GSR (Galvanic Skin Resistance). The points are found electronically, right where the ancient scrolls put them. Of course, nobody would actually USE the point locator, unless they were a beginner and wanted to do the scan (usually on themselves), because one doesn't get out of school, much less licensed, if they can't go "right to the point" with their finger.

Then there were the scientists in China. Goodness, can we trust them? They took their fancy instruments and they measured the output of energy from the hands of Qi Gong masters. When compared to normal folk, they did indeed discover an anomalous curiosity in the frequency of the masters ... when compared to regular folks. Then they built a machine. I have one. It cost $450, about 30 years ago. It emits the same frequency patterns, including the anomoly, through something that looks like one end of a telephone handle (telephone, not smartyphone).

image

So that's pretty Earth-science grounded.

Now that it's late, I'll stop the parade, but there are more scientific things available. It usually took me no more than three lesson to "prove" that Chi was real, in the Tai Chi classes. But that's too easy to argue "subjective," so let me end with one of the finest objective do-dads on the market. We (acu folks) use it for medical diagnosis. Some of us, not many.

image

  


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Shiva
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Posted by: @katrice

A quick search turns up posts about it from The Washington Post, Reuters, CNN, The New Republic, and The Hill, dating back to late September

Yes, I found the same old stuff. The stories covered the buildup, the cat and mouse game of capture and release (into the USA), and interviews with waiters who are just waiting for "the proper moment." The event I mentioned took place on Saturday, and the Natl Guard just stood aside. I doubt if all the (est) 18,000 came through, but I don't know such things.

I neglected to finish the Tale of Doctors vs Chi. Their childish efforts to discredit the concept of Chi didn't work. Oriental Medicine did work. So they switched things and described acupuncture working through a "gate theory" that pretended to describe a neural connection that did not exist.

They pushed that, and studied it, and then decided to Take Over Acupuncture!  Yes, acupuncturists could be created ... to work as a "team member," supervised by an M.D.  There is a Medical tong, you know. But the Tong lost. Their agenda was not implemented in time. Several States passed laws making us Primary-Care Physicians, so it was too late.

They finally packed in the struggle. The changed their rules, and M.D.s are only allowed to practice acupuncture AFTER they take a 400-hour approved course.


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ptoner
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Posted by: @katrice

Such practices can loosen the bonds of ego and put it more in perspective. Taboos and other limits are part of the ego, after all, while in terms of indulgence, the induction of ecstatic states can also loosen the bonds too. You are correct that they could be applied in either way you mention, though.  Personally, though, I do not subscribe to the idea that ego should be exalted over all, nor, though, so I think it should be despised. Like the Freudian id, it has its place. 

 

Interesting line of thought and one i have extensively pursued the last 2 years. 

Practices that dissolve but do not destroy the ego are a vital part of the puzzle IMO. 
The ability to confront yourself, in an observation role and critically identify, what you did wrong and how you can correct it/ all to be a better human, without the lust of result is invaluable. You do it for Love, simple, Love for yourself and then in turn, others. 
"For pure will, unassuaged of purpose, delivered from the lust of result, is every way perfect."

How you do this can be via many means, I have decided, hence my "The plants talk to me" in my profile, to journey with various plant medicines. Mushroom, Ayahausca, the Toad, the Frog etc etc along with Breathwork. It has been one of my biggest teachers in my life, the revelations i have experienced, up there with the arrival of my daughter. 

Find your own path through the forest. 


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katrice
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Posted by: @ptoner

Interesting line of thought and one i have extensively pursued the last 2 years. 

Practices that dissolve but do not destroy the ego are a vital part of the puzzle IMO. 

Thank you for your response!

I see dissolving but not destroying as very vital. I seek to use everything available to me as tools for initiation.  Ideas like accepting the rejected, transmuting poison into medicine, using that which binds as a tool for liberation, all about the topics I started this thread about.  This can apply to the ego too.

The ability to confront yourself, in an observation role and critically identify, what you did wrong and how you can correct it/ all to be a better human, without the lust of result is invaluable. You do it for Love, simple, Love for yourself and then in turn, others. 
"For pure will, unassuaged of purpose, delivered from the lust of result, is every way perfect."

Exactly! All born of love for self and others. And Self!.  Not just identifying what you did wrong, but also identifying the causes of those deeds, working to control, weaken, or sublimate those, and to identify those positive elements you want to strengthen as well. 

 

How you do this can be via many means, I have decided, hence my "The plants talk to me" in my profile, to journey with various plant medicines. Mushroom, Ayahausca, the Toad, the Frog etc etc

 

Many means indeed, and identifying which means work best for you, finding your own path through the forest as you put it, is extremely valuable. That itself is part of initiation.   My own experience with psychedelics is minimal. I respect those who work with them successfully.  

 

along with Breathwork. 

  People sometimes underestimate how powerful breathwork is. It's a potent tool that you always have with you. I've worked with several different systems, to very good effect. 


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katrice
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Posted by: @shiva

I'll pass on the Kundalini, but I went out of my way to temporarily leave my BonPo Empowerment lineage to enroll, at a very reasonable price, in the three degrees of Reiki - so that when I did demos, and people asked (with Stars in their eyes), "Are you a Reiki Master.?" I could give the proper answer.

  When the 1st degree came up for $50, I jumped on it (traditionally $150). When the same guy, a month later, offered the 2nd degree for $65, I jumped again (the "standard" price is $500). When he verbally offered the exalted, supreme crown of attainment, the 3rd degree for $300 (normally $10,000), I spoke up, and he said, "Come to my house."   If I remember correctly, I am #13 in (this) line from Dr. Usui, who founded the art.  

 

I'm aware of Reiki's background. I have all of the empowerments too, though I bartered for them rather than paid money. I've also studied a couple of forms of qigong too. 

People do tend to light up when you say you're a reiki master. 

Wolf Star [Sirius - in Chinese], Empowerment

I'm not familiar with this.

 

I'm familiar with Chinese medicine, and certainly do not doubt its effectiveness, and I know that it, and accupuncture, and reiki have found use in allopathic medicine. I also know the examples that you mentioned.  I should have said something more like "proven to the point of widespread acceptance".  Have they moved further out of being accepted as a fringe practice at best in more conventional allopathic medicine?

So that was the original curriculum for Gai Jin (foreigners, lierally "barbarians")

Isn't that Japanese?  With the equivalent in Chinese being gweilo?

 


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grouchotrout
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What a delightful read! Thanks to all involved thus far.

I can find no faults in the general thrust, as it were, in the basic concepts of Reich. He definitely seemed to hit a major nerve with the twitchy, nervous status quo. I've always said to friends & associates who know about my practice when they ask me about starting, I say it all starts with the physical body. Get to know your body. Whether it's through martial arts, basketball, rock climbing - get to know your body. 

I've done some of Hyatt's stuff from Energized Meditation solo & with a group & we had immediate, downright paranormal results. In a certain sense, the body is literally a temple - a house for deities. We either cleanse & prepare every room for a familiar spirit, or unknowingly allow any old vagrant to take up residence in the neglected sanctuaries.

In my experience, it seems that wanton indulgence is best in revealing those areas that need attention. The spirits in general seem to take more notice when I refrain, restrict & regiment my habits. They're all very specific in their demands, aren't they?


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Shiva
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Posted by: @katrice

People do tend to light up when you say you're a reiki master. 

Yes. I find this unfortunate. Because Reiki Masters are bought, not awarded the title due to work. Oh, sure, there's some minimum practice, and one must memorize those funny symbols. The line I hooked up with uses the term Independent Master Reiki Teacher in order to avoid "association" with the money-hungry "traditional" Reiki Masters.

Posted by: @katrice

I'm not familiar with this.

I only recently discovered this (Sirius) is a Bonpo lineage. And I hold a pretty high degree, so you would think I should have known a long time ago.

Posted by: @katrice

reiki have found use in allopathic medicine.

Yeah. I was in the hospital for a few days (a few years ago). A nurse came by an offered Reiki. I was impressed - that the staff/admin had probably seen it work, so they said, "Why not?"  Many nurses take the Reiki Continuing Education course.

But I have not yet heard of an M.D. who would "stoop so low."

Posted by: @katrice

I should have said something more like "proven to the point of widespread acceptance".

Ah, so. The allopathic docs have competition to face, so they oppose anything that might give power (or licensure) to some other type of practitioner. The docs themselves are usually okay (but some are crazy) - they simply pay dues to the Amer Med Assn, and the Assn has bulldogs and attorneys who do the legal opposing. Not many (or nobody at all) in mainstream western science is promoting studies of Chi, Ki, or Prana. If they mention Vril, they will be accused of Nazizm. If they whisper Orgone, their license will be reviewed.

Posted by: @katrice

Have they moved further out of being accepted as a fringe practice at best in more conventional allopathic medicine?

Not that I know of. Look here: Acu can be used to perform ALL major surgies without general anesthetic. The patient is awake and taking. No pain. An acu I know needed his Gall Bladder removed. He went to the admin and asked if his friend, another acu, could do the anesthesia. They said Okay, but only if an anesethetist was standing right there (in case, you know).

The operation was a no-pain success! To my knowledge, that was the last time an acu was allowed inside a surgical suite anywhere in the country. Why? I imagine the anesthetists saw themselves being put out of business. Just imagine, when the patient finishes being cut & sewn, he/she gets off the table, walks back to their room, and recovers in half the time (as a knocked out patient).

My fee for this service would be $120. The anesthetist wants $1000. Do the math and see how our reality is shaped.

Posted by: @katrice

Isn't that Japanese?  With the equivalent in Chinese being gweilo?

I yeild to your correct memory and differentiation of the heathen Oriental lingos. I once spoke with Mao Shing Ni (who was a student in some of my classes), a 38th generation Taoist (priest? Practitioner? Initiate?). Somehow the question of racial distinction arose. I said, "But I understand the Chinese call us white folks "barbarians."

"Well," he said, "that's true."  Aha! I confirmed right from the horse's mouth, not by reading it in a book.

Posted by: @grouchotrout

it all starts with the physical body. Get to know your body.

The Path starts at Malkuth ... in every tradition. But not all traditions do the body stage. They all want one's money, which is very Malkuthian, but they often drift over any physical stuff in order to get on with the belief, and the faith.

Crowley suggested stretching the physical envelope in all directions ... in order to find one's limits. Dirty Harry said, "A man has got to know his limits."

Based on experience, I recommend that one do this stretching, pushing, bending, and experimenting in their younger years. I was still pushing in my mid-50s, but it certainly wasn't as easy as my mid-20s. 


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katrice
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Posted by: @grouchotrout

What a delightful read! Thanks to all involved thus far..

Thank you!  I'm happy that you found it so delightful!

  I say it all starts with the physical body. Get to know your body. Whether it's through martial arts, basketball, rock climbing - get to know your body. 

I feel that this is an important, but too often overlooked, part of magickal practice. Your body is an important tool. Training, maintaining health, learning and expanding your limits and making your body closer to your ideal, as well as the uses of bodily states and sensations as part of practice, are all valuable.

 

I've done some of Hyatt's stuff from Energized Meditation solo & with a group & we had immediate, downright paranormal results. 

Yes indeed!  I've found it incredibly powerful on multiple levels, body, emotions, mind, and spirit. It's like another form of yoga, or spiritual alchemy, breaking down barriers between different levels of the self.  

In my experience, it seems that wanton indulgence is best in revealing those areas that need attention. 

That can be an important part of it too, though for me it also addresses helping to learn and manifest your true self, and also the use of indulgence for inducing ecstatic states for magickal work.  Always, though, as I mentioned, with an eye towards practical application rather than using magickal practice as an excuse to indulge, and always with an eye towards avoiding potential addiction.  We master our tools, we are not mastered by them.

Like with antinomian practices, it's vitally important to be honest about why you are doing it, and whether or not it truly works for you. 

In some cases, antinomianism and indulgence can be brought together in the same practice, and if approached in certain ways, the inner and outer applications of antinomianism can be brought together too. Algolagnia, for example, is an indulgence that, while it's seen more mainstream acceptance, is still regarded as weird,  can be used to test one's limits and confront one's taboos. Traditions like the Amg Ada system of sex magick, with it's focus on orgies as a central element, could work in a similar manner, though I admit I've never personally even met any actual practitioners of Amg Ada so I can't give a fully informed opinion on it. 

 

The spirits in general seem to take more notice when I refrain, restrict & regiment my habits. They're all very specific in their demands, aren't they?

It all aligns with you true self and, by extension, your Will. 

 

Posted by: @shiva

Yes. I find this unfortunate. Because Reiki Masters are bought, not awarded the title due to work. Oh, sure, there's some minimum practice, and one must memorize those funny symbols. The line I hooked up with uses the term Independent Master Reiki Teacher in order to avoid "association" with the money-hungry "traditional" Reiki Masters.

This has been the heart of my issue with "mainstream" reiki, the idea that money has been part of the tradition from the beginning. Thankfully, we have some "rogue" reiki masters who reject that aspect. 

 

Posted by: @shiva

I only recently discovered this (Sirius) is a Bonpo lineage. And I hold a pretty high degree, so you would think I should have known a long time ago.

Are there any resources where I could learn more?

 

Posted by: @shiva

But I have not yet heard of an M.D. who would "stoop so low."

I haven't either but I have heard of hospitals who have people who do reiki on call if needed.

 

What is your opinion on devices like Welz Chi Generators?

Posted by: @shiva

I yeild to your correct memory and differentiation of the heathen Oriental lingos.

If I remember correctly, gaijin isn't always necessarily a slur, but gweilo is.

 

 

 


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Posted by: @katrice

This has been the heart of my issue with "mainstream" reiki, the idea that money has been part of the tradition from the beginning.

Well, yes, but not exactly. Dr Usui gave away all his "attunements," free for no fee. But then he noticed that the poor people he had empowered didn't use it. This caused him to say, "The attunements should (must?) be paid for. But he did not set fees or collect payments.

AFTER HE DIED (a familiar phrase), his followers decided to initiate the collection of fees. They (the followers) set $150 (Level 1), $500 (Level 2), and $10,000 (Level 3 - Master). Wow! One can buy into multi-level marketing with their own franchise ... which is what they did.

But it gets worse even better: A rumor circulated among the Reiki community that a "dark lineage" had arisen in the Reiki stream. I searched out this lineage, or current, for a few years, but I never found it. One day, it became clear. The traditionalists (the franchisees) started this rumor in relation to those "Masters" who provided attunements at a discounted price (those evil knaves). Oh no, I was already in the "dark" lineage. I had paid greatly discounted fees.

Confirmation via a living example. My Reiki instructor, who charged $50/$65/$300, received a small group of traditional $150/$500/$10,000 Reiki Masters who (with his permission) observed his class, including the empowerments. Afterward, the leader of the group said, "From what I have seen, he is doing everything properly ... except he doesn't charge enough."

The fornicating evil black magicians with their grasping paws infiltrate everything, you know. I believe most lineages of the A.'.A.'. are still free of this money-grubbing, and Bailey's Arcane Schooe (online) accepts donations, like in church, 10 cents or $100, according to the self-identified financial status of the donor.

The good part is that the attunements (empowerments) work, regardless of the philosophy or the prosperity/poverty of the Initiator. In fact, it works so good that common people, with just a curious interest in healing, are suddenly empowered to do just that: heal.

In reference to the Sirius system, here's the Chapter (Appendix) from The Master Codex ...

Posted by: @katrice

What is your opinion on devices like Welz Chi Generators?

I never heard of such a thing. Well, I did hear that Reich had Orgone machines. But I cannot opinionate as I have never seen/tested such a device. My Qi Gong machine merely duplicates frequencies, but it doesn't seem to "emit Chi."


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hadgigegenraum
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@katrice 

Nice to read your posts as i seems to learn something new....like a word, and I can not believe I was not familiar with "algolagnia"...at least as a word...lol...

I was also prompted to look up Amg Ada and came across this .pdf "The Method of Purefire Sex: In the Magica Fraxinus" by Brother Eleven and Nami Sanders Lohr found linked from this site as free download!!! 

https://amgada.wixsite.com/purefire/blank-pvj6y

Skimming through I am intrigued by attention to such explorations where the practice bans the use of regular language in the rites towards more primal uses of sound, of mantric structures, making me think of the infernal adorations  of OAI in  Liber Stella Rubeae...The descriptions of the approach to dreamtime is a contribution that merits wider appreciation...

Thanks~~~

 


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Shiva
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Further on Ferenghi Lingo: An Oriental linguist noted our conversation and informed me ...

"The Japanese 'Gaijin [外人], literally means 'outsider', which when you consider the Japanese obsession with group membership and belonging, implicitly means 'person who is not one of us'. Of course the more formal 'Gaikokujin' [外国人] simply means 'person from a country outside Japan.'

"I read enough kanji to get a rough grip of the Chinese 'gweilo', [鬼佬] as 'ghost fellow', or 'demon fellow' perhaps a reference to our white skin? The Japanese and Chinese understanding of ghosts and demons isn't quite like ours in the west, there is quite a bit of overlap ..."
 
Note; Dead people lose their color and turn pale (white). White is a superstitiously avoided color by the Chinese. I was told, "It is the color of death. Get rid of that [white] lantern!" 
 
 

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katrice
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Posted by: @hadgigegenraum

@katrice 

Nice to read your posts as i seems to learn something new....like a word, and I can not believe I was not familiar with "algolagnia"...at least as a word...lol...

I'm always happy when I introduce someone to something new! 

 It's a useful word to have, more precise, I think, than the more common terms. 

Skimming through I am intrigued by attention to such explorations where the practice bans the use of regular language in the rites towards more primal uses of sound, of mantric structures, making me think of the infernal adorations  of OAI in  Liber Stella Rubeae...The descriptions of the approach to dreamtime is a contribution that merits wider appreciation...

Thanks~~~

The comparison to Liber Stella Rubeae is a good one. I hadn't thought about that.  It also reminds me a little of the barbarous words in PGM magick. I've seen some people try to claim that the Amg Ada mantras are an "infernal" opposite to Enochian, but I think that's just silly. For one thing, there's nothing Satanic about Amg Ada. For another, plenty of "Satanic" or just LHP people use Enochian with no problems. 

Amg Ada has some very fascinating elements. It surprises me that it isn't as well known among sex magicians. 

 

Posted by: @shiva

 But it gets worse even better: A rumor circulated among the Reiki community that a "dark lineage" had arisen in the Reiki stream 

Which leads to self-identified rogue masters, who are only "rogue" in that they take less money or don't take money at all.

 

The good part is that the attunements (empowerments) work, regardless of the philosophy or the prosperity/poverty of the Initiator. In fact, it works so good that common people, with just a curious interest in healing, are suddenly empowered to do just that: heal.

Which just shows that the money thing has nothing to do with the technical aspects of the system itself.

In reference to the Sirius system, here's the Chapter (Appendix) from The Master Codex ...

Oh my goodness! Thank you!

 

I believe most lineages of the A.'.A.'. are still free of this money-grubbing, and Bailey's Arcane Schooe (online) accepts donations, like in church, 10 cents or $100, according to the self-identified financial status of the donor.

 

Crowley's own words forbid the exchange of money for A:.A:. membership so anyone who does charge is going against the tradition. 

 

The fornicating evil black magicians with their grasping paws infiltrate everything, you know.

Well,technically I'm a fornicating black magician, though whether or not I'm "evil" is in the eye of the beholder. 😉 

 

I never heard of such a thing. Well, I did hear that Reich had Orgone machines. But I cannot opinionate as I have never seen/tested such a device. My Qi Gong machine merely duplicates frequencies, but it doesn't seem to "emit Chi."

 

I'm surprised you hadn't heard of them, but I'm surprised whenever I end up mentioning something you're not familiar with.  I met an OTO guy a while ago who's in to orgone and radionics technology and he told me about them

 

 


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Posted by: @katrice

Well,technically I'm a fornicating black magician, though whether or not I'm "evil" is in the eye of the beholder.

Black? You? It depends on how much you charge. It also depends on whether you do magic to get liberated, or to enhance your property and prosperity - and whether you do it at the expense of other folks or little animals.

Posted by: @katrice

I met an OTO guy a while ago

Oh? 

Posted by: @katrice

who's in to orgone and radionics

Ah. Scalar/Quantum stuff. By the way, in relation to the Crowley claim that he (Liber AL) beat Einstein to the "Relativity" punch ... Max Planck came up with the Quantum punch in 1902.

 


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katrice
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Posted by: @shiva

Black? You? It depends on how much you charge. It also depends on whether you do magic to get liberated, or to enhance your property and prosperity - and whether you do it at the expense of other folks or little animals.

Liberation and initiation, of course, though prosperity helps with keeping a stable base to work from, and creating an environment that helps facilitate my practice. I don't see those as mutually exclusive when approached from a certain perspective. I'm primarily of the Transcendent branch but some aspects of the Immanent have their place. I never do anything that would be intentionally done at the expense of other folks or little animals.  But as a follower of the LHP some would call me a black magician by nature.

 

Oh? 

I've hung out with some Camps and Lodges. 

 

Posted by: @shiva

Ah. Scalar/Quantum stuff. 

Which in my experience works pretty well with other energy based systems. I've seen orgone accumulators used in conjunction with reiki, for example. 

By the way, in relation to the Crowley claim that he (Liber AL) beat Einstein to the "Relativity" punch ... Max Planck came up with the Quantum punch in 1902.

Good to have a year on that. 


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ignant666
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Posted by: @shiva

Max Planck came up with the Quantum punch in 1902.

Further proof of RTC's theory (among several) that AC faked up AL on his first visit to Egypt in 1902. Thus antedating AC's "discovery" of relativity. Yeah sure (to both AC's, and and RTC's, claims).

Pardon me for the prolonging of this digression.

As to the OT, i spent much of my 20s-40s enraged in "transgressive" sexual practices of an S & M/B & D nature, and also did a great deal of ritual magick during those same decades, but the twain never really met. The sex magick i did engage in during that period was more or less straight-up sex as to the physical mechanics of it.

Having been identified as one of two elderly American druggies who run this forum (as if), i can say that different drugs tended to correspond to the two streams of activity: amphetamines and cocaine and alcohol with the kinky sex, psychedelics (mostly LSD, mushrooms, and 5Meo-DMT during this period) with the ritual magick/sex magick. I have of course consumed enormous amounts of cannabis every day since i was 13, so that has to be included in the familiar drugs with both streams.


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Serpent 252
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@katrice

I apologise for these off-topic notes.

To all & to none

I remember I haven't read anywhere that AC compared his formula 2=0 with Einstein's well known formula. My memory is still pretty decent, but if I am wrong, please correct me, and, please, provide the exact quotation & the source thereof.

However, I remember AC's mentioning of Einstein somewhere in similar fashion (i.e., comparing). So, I've opened a book which has been my first suspect & there it is.

AC, Eight Lectures on Yoga, Yoga for Yellowbellies, Second Lecture:

"25. I feel almost ashamed of the world that I have to tell you that in the year 1900, four years before the appearance of Einstein's world-shaking paper, I described space as “finite yet boundless,” which is exactly the description in general terms that he gave in more mathematical detail.* (...)"

" * Tannhauser, written in Mexico, O.F., August, 1900. See also my Berashith, written in Delhi, April, 1901."

Internet check on Hermetic here.


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Shiva
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Posted by: @serpent252

To all & to none

I am None, and I say, "There's a Serpent in every Garden."

Posted by: @serpent252

I remember I haven't read anywhere that AC compared his formula 2=0 with Einstein's well known formula.

I think it was in Conessions, or maybe Without Tears, but I certainly cannot remember, my mind being much more attacked by cosmic rays due to my longevity.

However, it was writ in the context that Albert got all the glory from his paper of Sept 1905, while Aleister was mostly ignored (even though AL April 1904, was first).

Maybe not first. Maybe second. Max tossed out Quantum in 1902.

Posted by: @serpent252

please, provide the exact quotation & the source thereof.

Calling all bibliophiles and data memorizers. Does anybody know where AC belittled AE?

Posted by: @serpent252

25. I feel almost ashamed of the world that I have to tell you that in the year 1900, four years before the appearance of Einstein's world-shaking paper, I described space as “finite yet boundless,” which is exactly the description in general terms that he gave in more mathematical detail.*

Oh, my beagle! You found it. You are correct. It's not the 0=2, it's  "Infinite yet Boundless," which is how the Tibetan heathen yogis have described the highest state (Ain Soph) for a looonng time, but that has no bearing on AC, AE, & MP, except to show that AC was first (1900).

Of course, Max's proposal involves no frequencies or time delays - but that's a different matter.

 

 

 


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katrice
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Posted by: @ignant666

Pardon me for the prolonging of this digression.

No need to apologize, it's an interesting discussion!

As to the OT, i spent much of my 20s-40s enraged in "transgressive" sexual practices of an S & M/B & D nature, 

Transgressive against the outer world, against your personal boundaries, or both? 

 

and also did a great deal of ritual magick during those same decades, but the twain never really met.

Which I find interesting because creating a bdsm scene and creating a ritual have some similarities.

But my thinking that is because I personally try to harness as much of my life towards my magickal practice as I can. 

 

 The sex magick i did engage in during that period was more or less straight-up sex as to the physical mechanics of it.

To be honest, much of mine focuses on altered states through orgasm or exhaustion, so to an outside observer it wouldn't look much different from regular sex.  I only occasionally make it in to a full external ritual.

 

Having been identified as one of two elderly American druggies who run this forum (as if), i can say that different drugs tended to correspond to the two streams of activity: amphetamines and cocaine and alcohol with the kinky sex, psychedelics (mostly LSD, mushrooms, and 5Meo-DMT during this period) with the ritual magick/sex magick.

 

My own experience with drug use is mI can see that analogy, mundane sex vs magickal sex, surface vs deeper. 


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christibrany
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@ptoner 

 

@ptoner 

 

I have only experienced mushrooms 2x, in the same weekend and it really changed me.  At least it opened up new ways of thinking and reacting.

Some were 'good' and Solar, some were 'bad' and Saturnian 


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christibrany
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Posted by: @shiva

Black? You? It depends on how much you charge. It also depends on whether you do magic to get liberated, or to enhance your property and prosperity - and whether you do it at the expense of other folks or little animals.

At least in my experience it seems we all start out as Black Magicians, and slowly start to see the LVX.

I mean after all, who hasn't done rituals for personal gain, and/or health and/or other's gains/and or health? 

Then after awhile you stop seeing the need in your personal life as you are living it...and it works by itself?  At least it seems that way to me.

Now I am trying to get more into Theurgy if you will.  Not gimme-urgy 

I mean, once you plug in the machine, it tends to keep running by itself even if you are not tending it. 

 


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katrice
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Posted by: @christibrany

I mean after all, who hasn't done rituals for personal gain, and/or health and/or other's gains/and or health? 

Then after awhile you stop seeing the need in your personal life as you are living it...and it works by itself?  At least it seems that way to me.

Now I am trying to get more into Theurgy if you will.  Not gimme-urgy 

I mean, once you plug in the machine, it tends to keep running by itself even if you are not tending it. 

 

As one works on one's initiation, and progresses, there is less need on that level.  In some instances, the machine does indeed run by itself, things just fall in to place, in others, the need gets put in to perspective and just falls away on its own. The best tools disappear in to their function. There is less need to "do" magick as one becomes magick.    Or at least that's been my experience. 


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christibrany
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Posted by: @katrice

My own experience with drug use is mI can see that analogy, mundane sex vs magickal sex, surface vs deeper. 

The question is and that's the tough part, is how much of that is your Ego, lying to you, indulging in what you want, and saying that you are really moving deeper, and learning something, and not just indulging said Want/Ego, and how do you tell you are truly being 'magickal'? 


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ptoner
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Posted by: @christibrany

@ptoner 

 

@ptoner 

 

I have only experienced mushrooms 2x, in the same weekend and it really changed me.  At least it opened up new ways of thinking and reacting.

Some were 'good' and Solar, some were 'bad' and Saturnian 

Hey there Chris,

 

I agree with your comments, plants are teachers, they teach you to look at yourself through a perspective that you would never normally be able to access. You dissolve the ego and even via some plant or animal medicines, like the toad, you can reset and go back to the love and bliss of source. Nothingness. 0=2 has a completely different meaning and understanding to me now. 

Without duality we cannot achieve nothingness. 


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christibrany
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Posted by: @ptoner

d bliss of source. Nothingness. 0=2 has a completely different meaning and understanding to me now. 

day 2 in the light of Sol was a neverending experience of joy. I was lying in ...on a bush by a mountain lake in a normally uncomfortable contortion because everything felt good and the plants were me and me them and I put Charlie Parker on my headphones and couldn't stop laughing.

I learnt that there is joy in this sharing of energy if we can but throw away the veil of samsara and ego and just experience pure experience. 

 

Never felt like that but once or twice with meditation and sometimes with beer. 

Usually it's muddy. 


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