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Rey Tetixe
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20/08/2020 11:39 pm  

Does anyone know of a Liber (or other book) involving telepathic communication.  Particularly interested in formal training methods as well as how to reach out to a new contact without being misinterpreted as a psychic attack.

 


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dom
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20/08/2020 11:55 pm  
Posted by: @iztrttx

Does anyone know of a Liber (or other book) involving telepathic communication.  Particularly interested in formal training methods as well as how to reach out to a new contact without being misinterpreted as a psychic attack.

 

A new contact?  How do you mean?  What do you want to do exactly?

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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Rey Tetixe
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22/08/2020 1:07 pm  

@dom Like a phone call without a phone, but to a person you have never called before.  Is there a methodology for 1st contact where you are not perceived as a threat?


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ignant666
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22/08/2020 3:02 pm  

Laying aside whether it is possible to do what you want to do, let's see if an analogy helps clear things up.

If you were asking "Hey, i am really good at picking any kind of lock and defeating every kind of alarm. Can anyone recommend a methodology for 1st contact meeting someone in their living room after breaking in where you are not perceived as a threat?", what kind of answers would you expect to get?


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Rey Tetixe
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22/08/2020 3:31 pm  

@ignant666. I was expecting/hoping to get an answer from someone on here along the lines of "its answered in liber 93 starting at verse 14."  My question was not, "Does anyone in here not know how to do this? please speak up if you dont!"

To follow your analogy, is there a liber (or other type of book) describing a process for knocking first?  Crowley and a lot of magicians have described their methodology for many practices clearly or through metaphor in many different books.

These are topics and techniques that can occur accidentally based on a lot of variables.  When they happen it would be recommended to anyone to learn more about what they are doing instead of just forcing it or being disrespectful of the ability by claiming they are the best and have no more to learn.  One of my mentors saw auras for the first time while taking LSD and rather than claiming expertise he practiced and learned how to do it unaided over the course of 15 years.

To sum it up, I was expecting to get honest respectful answers from legitimate truth seekers.  Should I have expected otherwise in the "Magick" section of this private forum?

 


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ignant666
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22/08/2020 3:37 pm  

One more time: i am not disputing or discussing your ability to do this.

What i am pointing out is that you are asking "Is there some approved method for not frightening folks when you suddenly appear in their mind?" Of course there isn't.

If i planned to show up at someone's house, i would call or write first, and make certain i would be welcome. The same courtesy surely applies to the far more intimate sort of visit you propose.


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Rey Tetixe
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22/08/2020 4:03 pm  

@ignant666  Plenty of abilities were practiced before phones and the US Mail.  How was a polite knock and talk done then?

An individual under psychic attacks may not be trusting of a friendly "face" on the astral plane because that "face" may not be genuine. 

By the way, HGA doesn't really knock first, it's more like sit down and shut up. 


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ignant666
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22/08/2020 4:10 pm  
Posted by: @iztrttx

By the way, HGA doesn't really knock first, it's more like sit down and shut up.

Oh, a K & C of the HGA man- so why aren't you asking your HGA about this, instead of folks on an internet forum?

Anyway, you are not interested in common sense, courtesy, or consent. I wonder why you would imagine these unsolicited astral visits would be perceived as anything other than "psychic attack". Because that's exactly what you want to do.


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Rey Tetixe
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22/08/2020 4:32 pm  

@ignant666

Maybe the hga response was to collect and review formal writings.  Or perhaps a mentor suggesting using this forum as a place where discussions can be shared and stored for others to review in the open.

This was not in regards to HGA or it would have been stated in the initial question.  K&C was mentioned as an example that non malicious communications can be forceful.  This is in regards to communicating with new contacts without causing fear of attack, without the luxury of modern communication methods. Perhaps I should have clearly stated the implied communication would be with existing initiates and not the beasts of the field playing magick.

Again, the question was presented to seek knowledge of an established formal methodology, not to present a soapbox for someone to exclaim and reconfirm their ignorance.


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ignant666
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22/08/2020 4:55 pm  
Posted by: @iztrttx

without the luxury of modern communication methods

Such as the one you are currently using?

Why can't you simply reach out to these "existing initiates" you seek to contact via the internet, postal mail, or telephone, and ask if your astral visit would be welcome? It may well be so that folks did astral "knock and talks" before these things existed, but they do exist now. You use them for posting here, why not for your proposed astral visits?

It is interesting your use of the cop terminology "knock and talk" for this activity; a police "knock and talk" is certainly a hostile and invasive act.

Anyway, you aren't here for advice, or to ask a question, in the first place. Do feel free to boast away about your imagined astral travel abilities, O High Initiate.


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Shiva
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22/08/2020 5:11 pm  
Posted by: @iztrttx

To sum it up, I was expecting to get honest respectful answers from legitimate truth seekers.  Should I have expected otherwise in the "Magick" section of this private forum?

Unfortunately, all privacy has been abrogated from these publick forms.

I do not recall ever seeing "telepathy"  mentioned, along with any how to do it instructions of any kind, in any Liber or other kind of document.

The only reference to telepathy I know of is in Leary's work where he (or Wilson) notes that it is sometimes reported by people in the neuroelectric neurocircuit (6th, Electric, circuit), which is attributed to Geburah and further tagged as The Metaprogramming Circuit.

This telepathic rapport is a natural occurrence at these rather "high" levels, and it pretty much falls into the same category as "He will be able to recognize other members of the Inner Order.

Except for some collector who holds a secret doc on "Telepathy in Theory and Practice," this might be a rather difficult subject to nail down. I guess you can always use the Borg Search Motor ... if you think you can trust it in these digitally dangerous times.

Posted by: @ignant666

i would call or write first

Yeah, there's this unwritten, but often spoke, "rule" that says you "must" get permission before performing invasive procedures such as telepathing, energetic healing, and magical spells.

Apparently, doing these things without permission is supposed to be bad mojo, which means some sort of karmic muddling can get generated.

 


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Rey Tetixe
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22/08/2020 5:22 pm  

@shiva

Thank you sir.  I was waiting for your reply.  I was hoping for something perhaps akin to the Tibetin Book of the Dead (but regarding telepathy) or something else old and pre-electronic tech.  Doc has quite a bit of tech experience doing what I'm asking but I'm looking for a "natural" method.  I figured if it was in a library, you would be the one to know! 

For as much as Borg and things of that nature are mentioned here I really didn't think looking for workarounds would be met with hostility here, but unfortunately it seems nowhere is safe.

Perhaps some more writing needs to be done 😉

Thanks again, Shiva.


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dom
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22/08/2020 9:39 pm  
Posted by: @iztrttx

@dom Like a phone call without a phone, but to a person you have never called before.  Is there a methodology for 1st contact where you are not perceived as a threat?

To answer your specific question the only related references in Crowley's 'instructions' are found in Liber E here ;

 

https://www.sacred-texts.com/oto/lib9.htm#2

 

  in this section; 

II
Physical clairvoyance

..but it's not 'How to develop telepathy' as such.   No, Crowley never wrote an instruction booklet on Telepathy and Mind Control as such.  Why would he?   Why would that be part of his overall goal as a teacher of humanity? 

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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Rey Tetixe
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22/08/2020 10:21 pm  

@dom

Thanks dom, that's more along the lines of ESP, using your "gut".  What I'm looking for is at the higher circuits like Shiva mentioned.

I'm looking for telepathy not mind control, which is usually using a higher circuit to affect someone's lower circuit.  Or using tech to really mess with someone.

Why would crowley potentially teach telepathy?  The same reason everyone has a phone in their pocket.  Instant global communication, only telepathy would be without a need for a device (except for our own built in tech), just the ability to access the existing quantum entanglement.

It's like the next level of remote viewing, but 2-way.


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dom
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22/08/2020 11:26 pm  
Posted by: @iztrttx

@dom

Thanks dom, that's more along the lines of ESP, using your "gut".  What I'm looking for is at the higher circuits like Shiva mentioned.

So Shiva has answered your question? 

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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Just a Duck, on the internet
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22/08/2020 11:47 pm  

@iztrttx

I don't know if Crowley spent much time developing "telepathic" abilities or wrote much about it but these abilities were the kind of thing that were going on in the esoteric movements of his time. I wouldn't be surprised if Blavatsky and others had something to say about this so Theosophy may be one avenue to explore if you wanted to find some writings on this.


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apuleius
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23/08/2020 12:06 am  

@iztrttx I don't think a method can be established for this, in my view for practical purposes the best would be to use steganography through some kind of "magical link", in Crowley's terminology. But, probably there's people with telepathic abilities of some kind, in which case the best would be working with them instead of trying to develope something you have never experienced for yourself personally.


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Rey Tetixe
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23/08/2020 12:13 am  

@dom

Shiva answered accurately and honestly based on his knowledge and experience but did not provide a document for review.  That doesn't necessarily mean what I'm looking for does not exist, but it does mean he has not come across it in his studies.  He did mention more specifically the circuit used based on his medical background which actually got me thinking of a new way to search for something like this.

There are a number of interesting documents in private libraries so I was hoping something like that would pop up here.


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dom
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23/08/2020 12:23 am  
Posted by: @iztrttx

@dom

Shiva answered accurately and honestly based on his knowledge and experience but did not provide a document for review.  That doesn't necessarily mean what I'm looking for does not exist, but it does mean he has not come across it in his studies.  He did mention more specifically the circuit used based on his medical background which actually got me thinking of a new way to search for something like this.

There are a number of interesting documents in private libraries so I was hoping something like that would pop up here.

So let's say you find a document that helps you send thought-messages to people.... then what.. or more to the point....so what?  On a practical level how are you really going to verify that someone else receives your thought-messages anyway?   5 out of 10 successful guesses every time?   2 out of 10?  1 out of 10?   How do you know they are not patronizing you when they say they received your message i..e ...lying?   Learning to do ballet moves would be more constructive than this.  

 

By the way those Liber E ands Liber O exercise you say they are about 'gut' and not what you're looking for.  How do you know?  Did you do the work?

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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Shiva
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23/08/2020 2:46 am  
Posted by: @iztrttx

Perhaps some more writing needs to be done

Perhaps, but probably not by me (in terms of telling pathies).

Actually, I think it would be a good idea if everyone was telepathic. Then the telephone and the TV guys could get to work on something more productive, like growing corn or building boats.

You would someone has written a book on the subject, or at least an article. They probably have. But i've not seen it. Surely somebody here has seen such a thing?

Posted by: @duck

I wouldn't be surprised if Blavatsky and others had something to say about this

Not that I have read. I just did a Borgian Search Motor Driveby ("Blavatsky" "Telepathy"). Only one result; it mentioned HPB, but not in direct relation to telepathy, which was merely lumped in with crystal balls and astrology.

I repeat: I have seen no such thing. If anyone else actually has seen such a Duck thing, please speak up.

Most of the "powers" above Paroketh don't have practices issued. They tend to come about of their own accord. Since they are operated by the abstract mind on the causal plane, they work with a different logic than the linear mind.

Posted by: @apuleius

the best would be working with them instead of trying to develope something you have never experienced for yourself personally.

This is the fastest path. These "abilities" (siddhis) are easily "picked up" simply by doing the "trick" in the other person's presence. After that, one finds they can do it anytime, on their own. This is an example of a direct transmission in a natural way (no ceremony). Since the person probably gave a few words of instruction, the oral transmission component is usually included.

However, telepathy is a far higher grade of siddhi than water-dowsing, reading auras (at the lower levels), playing card clairvoyance, and winning at the casino.

Although Rey didn't say it specifically, he sort of implied that he has the experience, and his question was very specific: How to contact someone without alarming them (when they sense him in their head).

Posted by: @iztrttx

Shiva ... did not provide a document for review. 

But I will sell one for twenty-five thousand gold coins.

Posted by: @iztrttx

private libraries

Private Libraries of any kind are forbidden.

- Fahrenheit 451

fahrenheit 451 ray bradbury
Posted by: @dom

So let's say you find a document that helps you send thought-messages to people.... then what.. or more to the point....so what?

Such a siddhi would be of great benefit. The biggest problem is that folks treading the Path are warned (from Patanjali, to Perdurabo, and The Book to me, are warned against development of siddhis. Why? Every ion will be needed for the Great Crossing. After Crossing, the siddhis arise of their own accord.

Seek you first the Kingdom of Heaven,
and all these (other) things will be added unto you.
- Bible thumper quote

 


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apuleius
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23/08/2020 6:33 am  
Posted by: @shiva
 
You would someone has written a book on the subject, or at least an article. They probably have. But i've not seen it. Surely somebody here has seen such a thing?

I just remembered William S. Burroughs was obsessed with telepathy. In some of his books, "Naked Lunch" probably but can't tell for sure, he says he considers telepathy the "highest form" of communication or something along these lines. His "Yage letters" with Allen Ginsberg are purpotedly about a search in the Amazon for telepathic properties of the ayahuasca, but I don't recall having read those.


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dom
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23/08/2020 8:12 am  

Burroughs haha he did and said some nutty things.

Colin Wilson mentions telepathy regarding an incident with Gurdjieff and Wilson took Geller seriously, yes Geller the man who allegedly moved a football on a penalty spot during an F.A. Cup final whilst sat in a helicopter hovering above the ground.

The British public were obsessed with Geller for a short time back in the days of flared jeans.......or should that be flawed genes?  What you had to do was put your stopped clock on top of the TV set and Geller, live on TV would get it working again.  I think the success statistics were, err, 5 out of 56 million, that's impressive eh? 

 

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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Shiva
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23/08/2020 9:16 am  
Posted by: @dom

I think the success statistics were, err, 5 out of 56 million, that's impressive eh? 

I have known people whp paid money and went to the spoon-bending seminars. Yes, during the class, they could bend spoons with their energy (Qi). Oh, can you show me that?

"No. I couldn't do it after the seminar."

Some people really do have these siddhis. And usually, a person can do it too, when in their presence. If they can do it by themselves afterward, then there's been a transfer/activation of an inherent siddhi. If it goes away, sorry, no inherent potential available.

I see this all the time in martial arts students. They can do it (something) when I direct their arm or push their butt. I have seen it in aura classes. Some people are insensitive to this kind of thing. Most people can be influenced into some siddhi power, and some pick it right up and can do it later.

I haven't heard of this principle applying to telepathy, and I've seen no ads for Telepathy Seminars (Come in here and learn to do it). I suppose true mind reading could be considered a siddhi, but two-way telepathy is a long ways above that. I suspect it is not a siddhi as a "power," but rather the natural expression of a certain level of consciousness ... quite a ways up there.

 


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Just a Duck, on the internet
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23/08/2020 10:51 am  
Posted by: @shiva

Only one result; it mentioned HPB, but not in direct relation to telepathy

The old fashioned term for telepathy was "thought transference". From "The Key to Theosophy", 1889:

The time is not far distant when
the World of Science will be forced to acknowledge that there
exists as much interaction between one mind and another, no
matter at what distance, as between one body and another in
closest contact. When two minds are sympathetically related, and
the instruments through which they function are tuned to
respond magnetically and electrically to one another, there is
nothing which will prevent the transmission of thoughts from one
to the other, at will; for since the mind is not of a tangible nature,
that distance can divide it from the subject of its contemplation, it
follows that the only difference that can exist between two minds
is a difference of STATE. So if this latter hindrance is overcome,
where is the "miracle" of thought transference, at whatever
distance.

 

Annie Besant has a chapter "Thought-Transference" in her "Thought Power: Its Control and Culture", easily found online. Not a Thelema-specific text but the kind of thing Crowley would have been familiar with.


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Tiger
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23/08/2020 1:37 pm  

The Siddhas happen of their own accord it is recommended not to get trapped by them.
We are all psychic and connected, we just have to get everyone's thoughts out of our heads first so that correct seeing can happen.
Thought projection, transmission, transference, psychic radiation, can occur through an ubiquitous incorporeal medium free from spatial time conditions. Characters figures signs attract draw and impress the virtue of corresponding forces like tuning forks. The image is raised from the corporeal plane and real ized directed and invested; mind takes form of another mind.

mthong lam - the path of seeing
grong-‘jug - Entering the Citadel of Another embodiment

sgyu-lus - extra bodily state
lus phra-mo - Subtlest energy body

Citta-saṃtāna - the moment-to-moment continuum of sense impressions and mental phenomena

Phowa - mindstream transference

Six yogas of Naropa

Chod

Milarepa

might yield a text .


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Shiva
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23/08/2020 6:40 pm  
Posted by: @tiger

an ubiquitous incorporeal medium free from spatial time conditions.

AEthyr.

Posted by: @tiger

impress the virtue of corresponding forces like tuning forks.

Here is the key.

1. Both minds need to have their do-dad activated. The do-dad is an anatomical organ receiver/transmitter in the brain. Some folks say its the pineal gland. I don't know. I just know  "something" in their has to be "turned on."

2. Both receptors/transmitters need to be tuned to the same frequency, just like a radio, a TV or a phartsmone. This is the tuning fork reference. Modern digiboxes are either pre-tuned or push-buttoned. In the beginning, one must use the rotating dial knob to set the frequency. But there is no actual "knob." The virtual knob must be found and twirled ... (slowly).

Posted by: @tiger

Chod ... Milarepa   might yield a text .

I would book my flight to Nepal and my Yak to Tibet today, to find the text, in a cave of course, buried in the wall, but, you know, there's this Panicdem, and China isn't friendly to gringos. And then there's the cost, plus there's no air up there.

You will have to go instead of me. May the Spirits guide you to the Book on How to Gain All the Knowledge in Everybody's head. While you are there, also look for the one-paged Addendum, which tells you Knowledge will not cut it in the search for Liberation.

 


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apuleius
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23/08/2020 10:15 pm  

I'll add Alfred Korzybski to the list.


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Rey Tetixe
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26/08/2020 1:22 am  

Now we are getting to what I was expecting to find by posting in this forum.  Google can only take you so far, knowledge from experience can definitely bridge the gaps!

Posted by: @shiva

Such a siddhi would be of great benefit. The biggest problem is that folks treading the Path are warned (from Patanjali, to Perdurabo, and The Book to me, are warned against development of siddhis. Why? Every ion will be needed for the Great Crossing. After Crossing, the siddhis arise of their own accord.

Seek you first the Kingdom of Heaven,
and all these (other) things will be added unto you.

I've heard the term Siddhi but hadnt yet really delved into that realm of terminology.  These almost seem akin to the "powers" of each grade listed in Thelema, although I dont remember any mention of the ability to change size!  Is the Great Crossing the same as crossing the Abyss in Kabbalah?

Posted by: @shiva

Some people really do have these siddhis. And usually, a person can do it too, when in their presence. If they can do it by themselves afterward, then there's been a transfer/activation of an inherent siddhi. If it goes away, sorry, no inherent potential available.

I have experienced this and attempted to explain this with mundane abilities for years and more recently with magickal.  In hind-site I have seen it happen plenty of times but hadn't really had this association before.  Since learning of this other side of the world, I have picked up a lot of new talents quick by someone doing it for me once.  When I was starting out I felt this almost discredited what they showed me because if its really such a special thing, why is it so easy to do?  After a time I started seeking out these "abilities" out of disbelief and it led to collecting them (still cant see auras though!).

Posted by: @shiva

1. Both minds need to have their do-dad activated. The do-dad is an anatomical organ receiver/transmitter in the brain. Some folks say its the pineal gland. I don't know. I just know  "something" in their has to be "turned on."

2. Both receptors/transmitters need to be tuned to the same frequency, just like a radio, a TV or a phartsmone. This is the tuning fork reference. Modern digiboxes are either pre-tuned or push-buttoned. In the beginning, one must use the rotating dial knob to set the frequency. But there is no actual "knob." The virtual knob must be found and twirled ... (slowly).

When I'm in a "receiving" mode, I generally feel it in the prefrontal cortex, at the middle of my forehead slightly above my eyebrows.  A feeling like drowsiness or a heaviness is associated with this until I stop what I'm doing and let it flow at which point it is generally associated with intense hypnagogic imagery and my body from the waist up moves in a clockwise circle.  The duration definitely relates with how drained I feel after.  The more it occurs and I make dietary adjustments the drain has lessened.  I feel I have built up psy-energy stores that have helped, but has also made it so its on a little all the time.  A heads up display is the best I can describe it, but not so glaring and invasive.  Also, as my strength has increased, the 2-way version has started intermittently along with an experience that I felt uncontrollably invasive to another, so that brought me to looking for some sort of text explaining the process more.


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Rey Tetixe
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26/08/2020 1:25 am  

@tiger  Thank you very much for the input!

Posted by: @tiger

mthong lam - the path of seeing
grong-‘jug - Entering the Citadel of Another embodiment

sgyu-lus - extra bodily state
lus phra-mo - Subtlest energy body

Citta-saṃtāna - the moment-to-moment continuum of sense impressions and mental phenomena

Phowa - mindstream transference

Six yogas of Naropa

Chod

Milarepa

What disclipline is all of the above from?  Aside from six, yogas, and of, these are all very new terms for me?

Btw, what is your background/story?  If you have it posted Id be very interested in reading it.

 


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Shiva
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26/08/2020 3:23 am  
Posted by: @iztrttx

Is the Great Crossing the same as crossing the Abyss in Kabbalah?

Yeah.

Siddhis are "magical powers," such as invisibility, seeing auras, levitating, some forms of healing, knowing the future, manifesting things, moving things with energy ... that kind of stuff. Crowley claimed success in invisibilty, I can see auras, everyone seems to have a "pet siddhi" on the side. I guess a few ions can be spared ... as long as they benefit others and do not add density to the inate's ego in the process.

Posted by: @iztrttx

the prefrontal cortex, at the middle of my forehead slightly above my eyebrows

This is the "forward lines" for the burning tip of consciousness. This area is reserved for abstract thought, i.e., the higher mind. This is where we would expect telepathy to be active.

Posted by: @iztrttx

What disclipline is all of the above from? 

Tiger is a man of many disciplines. He already knows there is only one discipline, but it gets painted over, and feathers get stuck on, so that we can see several Tibetan concepts in the coded message, which is not coded at all.

Posted by: @iztrttx

what is your background/story? 

I can hardly wait for any reply that might tentatively manifest in reply

 


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Tiger
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26/08/2020 2:24 pm  

@iztrttx
My background is a fore ground, an all around Pan optic burning ground,
As a A Skull Bearer i excavate, imbibe and pour; which is a discipline in and of itself .

There is always a spiritus about.
As far as alien phrases from prehistory colored in the royal arts and Atlantean sorceries; The ancient old ones have deposited treasures in remote outposts. Some reserved in the elevated plateau of rLung guarded by the Dragon Kings taking form in Tibetan nomanclature but not limited to.

Best.

image

 


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Rey Tetixe
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26/08/2020 3:25 pm  

@tiger

I see we enjoy speaking in poetry.  Fun, yet frustrating to a learner trying to weed through the jibba jabba of the internet!  But I have also seen the benefit of doing so.  Everywhere has their own name for the same things.  Slowly attempting to collect and make more straight forward.  The labyrinth has been windy and I'm attempting a universal road map.

Posted by: @tiger

The ancient old ones have deposited treasures in remote outposts.

I've been "seeing" some of these but have not yet had the opportunity to go and look first hand.  I take it you have had sight through time for a while hanging out in Hod, while my site seems to be in Binah. 

Have you produced any writings available for perusal?


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Rey Tetixe
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26/08/2020 3:28 pm  
Posted by: @shiva

Yeah.

Siddhis are "magical powers," such as invisibility, seeing auras, levitating, some forms of healing, knowing the future, manifesting things, moving things with energy

Do you know of any post Abyss Crossing texts? 


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Tiger
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26/08/2020 4:22 pm  

@iztrttx
No writings
just messages
still working on Hod
when that part of The labyrinth
makes itself apparent


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Shiva
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26/08/2020 6:26 pm  
Posted by: @iztrttx

Do you know of any post Abyss Crossing texts?

What a tricky question, loaded with tricks of interpretation.

If you mean "a document written at some time after (post-) the author crossed the Abyss," there are many. One only needs to determine the date of the crossing, then all subsequent "books" would be post-Abyssmal texts. (We would expect them to be revelatory in some dimension.

If you mean "a doc written while the author is in a "state" or a "trance" in which their personal mind has sidestepped to take a break," then we have the so-called Class A documents. Liber AL is the first if the first-class Class A docs. The others vary in content. I never got much out of the poetry-prose Class A's, but I did like Liber B vel Magi.

Lots of other people have channeled their own equivalents of Class A writings. Since ALL of these "channeled" or "automatically written" texts are written (or scribbled, or uttered) by a human being, there is always the chance of bias, error, and other prejudices creeping in.

These "sacred texts" are often rolled out here, on their own threads, and great dissections take place by teams of interpreters, accompanied by squeaking trolls, who try to interpret WTF is being said ... and is it true? A lot of Hodian numerology gets erected, revised, and scattered. But there are those numbers that remain, and they are reserved for later study.

Nowhere in the sacred texts, or the Libers, or in the marginal notes, is The Secret of Liberation written in plain English.

Posted by: @tiger

No writings ... just messages

Messages are writings. Don't try to wiggle out of this by exuding clever definitions. Either you put up The Secret of Liberation from Mental Bondage, or (at least) tell us how to make gold.

 


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Jamie J Barter
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26/08/2020 7:56 pm  
Posted by: @shiva

Nowhere in the sacred texts, or the Libers, or in the marginal notes, is The Secret of Liberation written in plain English.

"Sit still.  Stop thinking.  Shut up.  Get out."  (from Eight Lectures on Yoga)

Plain-speakingly yours,

Norma N Joy Conquest


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Shiva
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26/08/2020 8:48 pm  
Posted by: @jamiejbarter

"Sit still.  Stop thinking.  Shut up.  Get out."

Yes, that one will do. many people attain to a posture that is "steady and easy." However, the second injunction ("stop thinking") is so well known that some of us either quote it or hint at it, endlessly, on these threads. But who can do it?

A few.

It's an esoteric thing.

We need not be concerned about the 3rd & 4th injunctions, until the 2nd is solved ... by each individual.

But you have indeed found the (almost) plain English instructions, close enough that you get the prize.

Note: The "almost" refers to "Shut up," which in plain English usually means, "stop talking." That it could possibly relate to Pratyahara is not usually evident to plain English readers, without a bit of further instruction.

No penalty. No karma. No blame.

 


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Tiger
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26/08/2020 8:53 pm  

@Shiva

Sometimes personal synchronicities make themselves apparent which is not a writing but can be wiggled into a personal message.

No grand messages for humanity;
except maybe shut up and don't question.

dance


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Rey Tetixe
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27/08/2020 2:58 pm  
Posted by: @shiva

What a tricky question, loaded with tricks of interpretation.

Not intended.  To clarify:  Do you know of any texts written by someone after crossing the abyss (not a temporary state) and documents their experiences after, including experience and identification of new Siddhis? 

When these "weird" things started happening to me, specific texts were presented that helped me understand what happened.  Many times I did the work accidentally/sub-consciously which triggered the occurrence.  2 big ones that immediately come to mind are Crowley's set up at Boleskine to invoke the HGA and his invoking of Choronzon.  I am seeking more writings of those that have experienced these changes so that I can understand more as well as potentially prepare for what still is to come.  Bear in mind, I only started seeking in the magical world 3 and a half years ago when these things started to occur.  I had never (knowingly) performed any rituals or spells or invocations to gain extra knowledge or ability.  I'm looking for fragments of individuals' "owners manuals" that I know are scattered about.

Posted by: @shiva

We need not be concerned about the 3rd & 4th injunctions, until the 2nd is solved ... by each individual.

3rd and 4th injunctions - what are you referencing here?  Where's that book/Liber?? The Book of 9's?

 

The owners manual for a car doesn't teach you how to drive, but it does identify all the little buttons and switches that you may not know are important (or even there). It even tells you what fuel and maintenance is needed. I'm not asking how to drive, I'm asking for what buttons are there that have gone unnoticed so I can identify what else is possible.  The owners manual is scattered about, hidden among all the dialogue, speculation and commentary. 

 


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Jamie J Barter
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27/08/2020 4:27 pm  
Posted by: @iztrttx
Posted by: @shiva

We need not be concerned about the 3rd & 4th injunctions, until the 2nd is solved ... by each individual.

3rd and 4th injunctions - what are you referencing here?  Where's that book/Liber?? The Book of 9's?

The reference was to my eight-word, four-sentence quote from Crowley's Eight Lectures on Yoga earlier, about which he went on to say:

The first two of these instructions [=injunctions] comprise the whole of the technique of Yoga. The last two are of a sublimity which it would be improper to expound in this present elementary stage.

I agree with Shiva where he noted in reference to the 3rd, though:

Posted by: @shiva

"Shut up," which in plain English usually means, "stop talking."

that some might construe this as relating to the 2nd ("Stop thinking"), in that both appear connected with the mind's interior stream-of-consciousness chattering monologue: however to do so would also diminish its more rightful relevance in terms of considerations of Pratyahara.

The 4th "injunction" might also reference the (apparent) paradox of the unity of opposites, as in for example the expression by the prog-combo Genesis in their composition The Carpet Crawlers that: "you've got to Get In (as in, inner space in order) to Get Out" (of what Philip K Dick and the Manichaeist Gnostics referred to as the Black Iron Prison of/,or material illusion).

Or something along those lines.  I hope this has managed to answer your enquiry?

N Joy


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Jamie J Barter
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27/08/2020 4:35 pm  
Posted by: @iztrttx

[...] The owners manual is scattered about, hidden among all the dialogue, speculation and commentary. 

"Oh, Operator's Manual, I'd just fall apart without you (If only I had a mechanic, then somehow I know I'd pull thru)" - Pete Shelley, Operator's Manual

N Joy


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Shiva
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27/08/2020 6:45 pm  
Posted by: @iztrttx

Not intended.  To clarify:  Do you know of any texts written by someone after crossing the abyss (not a temporary state) and documents their experiences after, including experience and identification of new Siddhis? 

Oh, there was no intention on my part to accuse you of being intentionally tricky. The thing is, ANY question or statement regarding supra-abtssmality in books, speech and art is destined to automatically open Paradox's Box, and one either has to dimiss it with a laugh, or go into great detail with all kinds of opposites.

I thought I interpreted your question properly and gave broad examples of answers. If you want a blow by blow, step by step, account of Crossing the Abyss, then you may refer directly to Liber 418, The Vision and the Voice, which is "the complete initiation of a Master of the Temple," ... or you may refer to my own Appendix I from Outside Solar Lodge - Inside the Law, where my process was much less spectacular than the Vision and the Voice. You, or anyone) may have already read this - it's been on my website for more than a decade. Anyway, here it is again, ready for one and all to x-amen, anal-eyes, and for use as evidence that the author is insane ... that's why he's laughing ...

However, if you (or anyone else) reads such documents and assumes that any person who experiences this experience is going to be any different in relation to before and after, then you will be disappointed. Nothing changes in the external world or in the appearance of the vehicle. Internally, the dork now has an "imprint" registered at Binah. That's all. it means nothing, unless the initiate is operating in the Light Body (not the astral or the causal body).

Thus, all mystical interaction is temporary.

If we need to go further, and discuss the imposition of a [gasp] permanent state of not-Self, even while walking around on the ground, then we must look to Kether, and the utterances of the spiritual terrorist, U.G., because Crowley never wrote about it (except for a few hints here, there, and everywhere).

Posted by: @iztrttx

I had never (knowingly) performed any rituals or spells or invocations to gain extra knowledge or ability.

I am just finishing up in Hot Zones (under construction) on examples of folks who moved up really high on the Tree due to their own inherent ability to generate spontaneous transcendental experiences. Some had the experiences as children. None of them

Posted by: @iztrttx

3rd and 4th injunctions - what are you referencing here? 

Posted by: @jamiejbarter

"Sit still.  Stop thinking.  Shut up.  Get out."  (from Eight Lectures on Yoga)

1, 2, 3, 4.


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Shiva
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27/08/2020 6:48 pm  
Posted by: @jamiejbarter

Oh, Operator's Manual, I'd just fall apart without you

man manual 93

As revealed in The Master Codex


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apuleius
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28/08/2020 10:12 am  
Posted by: @shiva
on examples of folks who moved up really high on the Tree due to their own inherent ability to generate spontaneous transcendental experiences. Some had the experiences as children.

Would this include cases like Hildegard von Bingen?


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Shiva
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28/08/2020 6:40 pm  
Posted by: @apuleius

Would this include cases like Hildegard von Bingen?

I don't know (or even know of) this person.

Essentially, the subject refers to people who become "aware" or "awake" as pre-pubertals ... in relation to the spiritual path. Last night, the last paragraph I wrote was ...

All those people were solo operators. Self-reliant, self-contained. I have named all those I knew who were constructed in that manner. They are all gone now, passed away. I have known others as well, but they showed forth strongly in other arenas, not the Path of Liberation.

I see I/we have now reached the point where the forums sync with my writing, in real-time right-now today terms. This is auspicious. No karma, no blame.

Posted by: @shiva

I am just finishing up in Hot Zones (under construction) on examples of folks who moved up really high on the Tree due to their own inherent ability to generate spontaneous transcendental experiences. Some had the experiences as children. None of them

In finding out where your quote came from (^), I noted that the punch line was not punched. This is an unauspicios sign. Mis-spelling a word is understandable, but just breaking off in the middle of a sentence can be a symptom of spontaneous samadhi, or severe spacing-out - which is not the same thing. Proofreading would probably help. Please allow me to complete the truncated sentence ...

None of them had (or needed) a Guru or a Mentor.

 


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apuleius
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28/08/2020 7:14 pm  

@shiva Hildegard von Binden was a prominent Christian mystic who started to have her first quite peculiar spontaneous spiritual experiences at an early age. I thought you had in mind historical figures for this, she fits quite accurately all the criteria you mention.


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christibrany
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28/08/2020 7:48 pm  

@apuleius

 

Is she the one that is said to have travelled astrally and then materialised a second corporal body in the New World and converted the Natives?


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Shiva
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28/08/2020 8:23 pm  
Posted by: @apuleius

she fits quite accurately all the criteria you mention.

Then she should be included in the list. In my current writings, I only cite those (4) persons I knew and was somehow affiliated with. Such people are rare, but not unknown. The true list is probably quite long.

 


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apuleius
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28/08/2020 8:34 pm  

@christibrany No this was not Hildegard, Hildegard lived a few centuries before the so called "discovery".


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christibrany
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28/08/2020 8:36 pm  

I guess I was thinking of Sister María Jesus de Ágreda

https://www.desertusa.com/desert-people/lady-in-blue.html


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