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Jack Parsons and the Occult Roots of JPL  

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ptoner
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07/10/2013 4:40 pm  

Jack Parsons and the Occult Roots of JPL

.
Some of the more "sensationalist claims" have been warped. I thought it was a dog, mentioned in the "Sex and Rockets" book.

Most of it is a mish mash of various sites and info.

Upon searching the Parsons’ residence, police investigator Donald Harding and George Santmyer, the latter a close friend of Parsons, discovered a box which contained a film showing Parsons and his mother Ruth having sex. Was this was the final nail in the coffin of Parsons’ historical reputation?

http://www.spacesafetymagazine.com/2013/08/02/jack-parsons-occult-roots-jpl/


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William Thirteen
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07/10/2013 7:28 pm  

Perhaps another translation error and Jack was having it off with the Dog Star!


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jamie barter
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08/10/2013 12:40 pm  
"WilliamThirteen" wrote:
Perhaps another translation error and Jack was having it off with the Dog Star!

Was 'Star' the name of this mutt then?

This seems to have come up previously on a couple of other threads.  You can’t keep a good ‘story’ down, it seems...

- Down, boy, I said!
Norma N. Joy Conquest


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ptoner
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08/10/2013 12:56 pm  

Here is the complete break down of the Black Box/Film footage rumour from John Carter aka Paul Rydeen.

http://www.lashtal.com/forum/http://www.lashtal.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=75.msg75354#msg75354


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Michael Staley
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08/10/2013 1:03 pm  

I'm getting really sick of the perpetual nudge-nudge grin-grin stuff over these rumours.


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jamie barter
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08/10/2013 2:23 pm  
"MichaelStaley" wrote:
I'm getting really sick of the perpetual nudge-nudge grin-grin stuff over these rumours.

The best way to deal with media tripe is to ridicule it, Mick.  As soon as people start getting defensive and/or moved to justify things which remain unproven, it gives a certain degree of advantage to the ‘enemy’ – this is a well-known principle of both "orientalism" and martial arts.  If there was any clear evidence it would have surfaced by now – and if it should do so later, can then be dealt with appropriately at the time, as & when.

In the meantime, what’s the point in getting het up about it?  You might as well work yourself into a frenzy over the fact that the subject of this website was frequently labelled “the wickedest man in the world”, etc. ...

Barking up the wrong tree,
N. Joy


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Michael Staley
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08/10/2013 6:33 pm  

Doubtless you're right, Jamie, and I have got it out of proportion. It's just that I have for many years admired the fine body of work that Parsons left behind, and find the focus on this salacious gossip frustrating. In future I'll keep my Victor Meldrew impersonations strictly under wraps.


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Hamal
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08/10/2013 6:43 pm  
"MichaelStaley" wrote:
Doubtless you're right, Jamie, and I have got it out of proportion. It's just that I have for many years admired the fine body of work that Parsons left behind, and find the focus on this salacious gossip frustrating. In future I'll keep my Victor Meldrew impersonations strictly under wraps.

I don't believe it!  😀

🙂
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Michael Staley
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08/10/2013 8:01 pm  
"Hamal" wrote:
I don't believe it!  😀
🙂
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You and me both . . . 😀


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SatansAdvocaat
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10/10/2013 4:26 pm  

Have had a quick flick thru' the article on Jack Parsons and it looked fairly reasonable to me...

Had some dealings with Paul Rydeen when he was the Director of the Esoteric Order of Dagon; reasonable guy to a certain degree, but we certainly had some divergent points of view - he is not the most objective of commentators.

What's this doggy business; if its in the article I thankfully missed it.  Just have this old Pink Floyd track going thru' my mind about "I was in the kitchen, Seamus my dog was outside".  If Jack owned a dog, I hope that it was outside when he was casually mucking about with fulminate of mercury in the utility room, it might have got away with just getting its tale singed.... 😀


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ptoner
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10/10/2013 5:09 pm  

The Esoteric Order of Dagon (E.'.O.'.D.'.)
Taken from http://www.esotericorderofdagon.org/ website it lists Michael Stately above as a member and of course Paul Rydeen.
Maybe Michael should ask Paul directly why he included the nonsense rumour and did he actually make it up?

Former and current members of this organization include:

Michael Staley, spokesman for the Typhonian OTO and publisher of Starfire Publishing.

Paul Rydeen, author (as "John Carter") of Sex and Rockets, a biography of Jack Parsons.


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Michael Staley
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10/10/2013 5:38 pm  

I've had no contact with Paul Rydeen since the late 1990s. I have no knowledge of his whereabouts or where to contact him. My loss, doubtless; it's a cross I have to bear.


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ptoner
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10/10/2013 8:12 pm  

That made me laugh Michael,  thanks.  😉


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Shiva
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10/10/2013 8:55 pm  
"Satan'sAdvocaat" wrote:
... when he was casually mucking about with fulminate of mercury in the utility room ...

In the interest of full disclosure, I would refer you (anyone) to Hymenaeus Beta's Introduction to Three Essays on Freedom (by Parsons) where the "utility room" (I always heard it was a garage) incident is portrayed in a different light ... as in "assassination because he wasn't just going to Mexico to test rockets (the usual cover story), but was planning to defect to Israel (where he was appreciated) via Mexico" ... and never to be seen again in the USA (where they no longer appreciated him). Just imagine all that "secret" knowledge going to Israel  😮


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Michael Staley
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11/10/2013 11:28 am  

I discussed this with Bill Breeze many years ago. Marjorie Cameron maintained that there were two exposions, a smaller one followed by a larger one, the conclusion drawn being that explosives had been planted and that the smaller one triggered off the larger.

Parsons had by that time lost his security clearance (in January 1952 I think) on account of his having borrowed classified documents (some of which had been written by him) as background material with a view to pursuing employment in Israel. His last letter to Germer (a few days before his death) was a strange one, and included a reference to the forthcoming trip to Mexico. The concluding paragraph:

Now I’m off to the wilds of Mexico for a period, also in pursuit of the elusive H.G.A. before winding up in the guard (room) finally via the booby hotels, the graveyard, or -- ? If the final, you can tell all the little practicuses that I wouldn’t have missed it for anything.

Yes, it could have been an assassination. But then again it could have been a suicide, an attempt to fulfill the prophecy received in the course of the Babalon Working that ". . . She shall absorb thee, and thou shalt become living flame before She incarnates . . ."  Or it could just have been a tragic accident, Parsons working hastily to fulfil one last explosives commission before finalising preparations for the journey to Mexico.


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Shiva
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11/10/2013 6:53 pm  
"MichaelStaley" wrote:
Parsons had by that time lost his security clearance ...

It's interesting how some of these genius-scientists make a big breakthrough ... and then get pushed aside.

"The Oppenheimer security hearing was a 1954 inquiry by the United States Atomic Energy Commission into the background, actions and associations of J. Robert Oppenheimer, the American scientist who had headed the Manhattan Project that developed the atomic bomb for the United States during World War II. The hearing resulted in Oppenheimer's top secret security clearance being revoked."
- Wikipedia

Now I’m off to the wilds of Mexico for a period, also in pursuit of the elusive H.G.A. before winding up in the guard (room) finally via the booby hotels, the graveyard, or -- ? If the final, you can tell all the little practicuses that I wouldn’t have missed it for anything.

While subject to various interpretations, this ^ little quote is sort of a mind-blower.

"MichaelStaley" wrote:
Yes, it could have been an assassination. But then again it could have been a suicide, an attempt to fulfill the prophecy received in the course of the Babalon Working that ". . . She shall absorb thee, and thou shalt become living flame before She incarnates . . ."  Or it could just have been a tragic accident ...

Yes, any of the above might qualify for the truth of the matter (which we will probably never know), but knowing how these matters proceed, I'm voting for "Let's get rid of the guy before he escapes to Israel with all that secret rocket knowledge." This is just my pessimistic take on the demise of Jack Parsons, and it should not be used as a guide to purchase securities on the stock market.

"In 1979, when I requested access to Tesla papers held at the J. Robert Oppenheimer Study Center, at LANL ("Los Alamos National Laboratory"), the government admitted possession, but denied access for lack of the appropriate "badge" (security clearance). So I know that Tesla's papers are now held at least in part, in Los Alamos, New Mexico. On that same day, I found the hydrogen bomb plans on the public access shelves, yet was denied access to Tesla's papers. What could be more sensitive than the hydrogen bomb, which was invented by Tesla prior to 1943?"
- http://www.whale.to/b/lyne_tesla.html

[/align:3kyqzgac]


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Anonymous
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12/10/2013 2:14 am  

Well, as my attorney might surmise, by the expression "Living Flame" you mean, I presume "living", as in 'alive' or 'living', not 'dead', or "blown up". But alive in the fullest sense of the word. Truly incarnate. There was a wonderful woman I met once who knew, and came from a place called Living Flame, but that is another story.

It's simple. A grudge against 1950's LAPD will get you fucking murdered. Period.

I like this quote in the context of what might have been a future Jack Parsons. It comes off an album I'm listening to right now, by an artist long forgotten, or never know, called Young American Primitive. He sampled this it into his music...

I have developed a link gate, complex enough to regulate the forces of the field energy surrounding us. These waves are all around us now, like, radio waves; television channels; x-rays and so on, the entire electromagnetic flux. I have no actual power myself. By using my brain patterns as a sort of focusing device, I'm able to direct electromagnetic field energy into a discreet beam. It's rather as though my brain were a lens.
[source] - The Outer Limits: "The Man with the Power" (TV, 1963) Donald Pleasance (as Harold J. Finley)


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Michael Staley
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12/10/2013 10:06 am  
"Magickal" wrote:
Well, as my attorney might surmise, by the expression "Living Flame" you mean, I presume "living", as in 'alive' or 'living', not 'dead', or "blown up". But alive in the fullest sense of the word. Truly incarnate.

That is a fair point, Magickal. However, it's a matter for interpretation as to what was meant by this phrase at the time it was received; there is no specified time-period, for instance, for the "Living Flame" to remain living.  An attorney would, of course, be able to assert in retrospect whatever meaning his or her client wanted.


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SatansAdvocaat
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12/10/2013 12:05 pm  

After making my somewhat whimsical comments here on 10 October, I went home and consulted my copy of 'Strange Angel' by George Pendle which I find to be an excellent biography of Jack Parsons: not very deep on the Magickal dimension, but excellent on the rocket science and the ups and downs of Parson's short, creative, turbulent life.

Pendle gives a very detailed account of the fatal explosion which was cataclysmic, the worst of it being, of course, that it did not kill Parsons outright, but left him with appalling, lethal injuries.  He mentions that according to witnesses nearer the scene, there were two explosions in quick succession.  Personally, I go along with Pendle and believe that Parsons just wanted to get off to Mexico with Cameron and ended up being careless with lethal chemicals that you CANNOT be careless with: a terrible, stupid accident.  Pendle does mention that an almost illegible note was found at the scene in Parson's handwriting (presumably ?) containing some cryptical notes/observations.  Unfortunately, not thinking that this thread was going to take off much, I didn't copy it down or bring the book in with me. ( :-[)  I will do that on Monday, unless someone else would care to oblige in the meantime.

No mention of Jack owning a dog, but his mother Ruth Parsons did - it gets a mention on page 9 of Pendle.


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SatansAdvocaat
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14/10/2013 2:21 pm  

What I was referring to is as follows, taken from page 5 of 'Strange Angel' by George Pendle (Weidenfeld & Nicolson, 2005):

"Some twenty or so reporters and photographers are now at the scene of the blast, walking in and around the building, reading the scraps of paper that lie strewn across the floor.  A local newspaperman finds a fragment of legible handwriting.  It reads, "Let me know the misery totally.  And spare not and be not spared.  Sacrament and Crucifixion.  Oh my passion and shame."

Pendle makes no further comment on this, but presumably that quote appeared in a local newspaper at the time, probably taken as an indication of Parson's 'state of mind' at the time of the 'accident'.  It reads to me, like a diary fragment from 1948-49 when Parsons was undertaking his Ordeal of the Abyss; it is neither from from "The Book of Antichrist" nor "Analysis by A Master of the Temple".

Can anyone identify and validate its provenance ?


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ptoner
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14/10/2013 3:13 pm  

These alleged Newspaper articles, from the time, might shed additional light on the explosion evidence.

`The library had microfilms of two local newspapers published in June 1952: The Pasadena Independent and The Pasadena Star-News.

http://orlingrabbe.com/Jpar9.htm


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jamie barter
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14/10/2013 5:10 pm  

The [Pasadena] Independent for June 18, 1952 […] filled in some chilling details:

"Parsons body was literally torn apart by the chemical blast.
"The explosion blew off his right forearm, tore a gaping hole in his jaw and shattered the other arm and both legs. He was still conscious after the blast."

I turned my attention to the Star-News, and followed its version of the story, starting again with Wednesday, June 18-- the day following the explosion. The article implied that all four, not just two, of the upstairs residents had pulled Parsons from the debris after the explosion at 5:08 p.m. He had been found lying under a 2-tub laundry fixture.
After dragging Parsons free, they propped him against one wall, where he was found by the city ambulance crew.

"Parsons methodically directed his rescuers, while being loaded into the ambulance."

I thought about that. About Parsons, his limbs shattered, his right forearm blown off, methodically directing the ambulance crew.

There appears to be nothing there which indicates any clear connection with the passage in the Book of Babalon which declares: ". . . She shall absorb thee, and thou shalt become living flame before She incarnates . . ."  A terrible mess with limbs rent asunder and the like, but there is nothing about Parsons combusting, spontaneously or not.  While obviously under shock, he appears to have been able to function to an extent and would presumably have alerted his rescuers if he had thought any sort of ‘foul play’ was in the offing, or that he thought he was in some way fulfilling the prophecy

N Joy


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SatansAdvocaat
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14/10/2013 5:26 pm  

Many thanks ptoner for the Newspaper articles link.  Yes the passage is to be found in the section from the 'Star-News', Wednesday June 18:

"Parsons was born Oct. 2, 1914, and was the son of Maj. Marvel H. Parsons and Mrs. Ruth Virginia Whiteside. He had attended the University School in Pasadena.
There were a number of written notes found in the destroyed apartment.

"The notes, most bearing chemical symbols, but a few carrying philosophical and religious references, were found on the blast- shattered ground floor of the structure."
One partially torn note said: "Let me know the misery totally. And spare not and be not spared. Sacrament and Crucifixion. Oh my passion and shame--."

This was probably jottings for a poem, like the one Parsons had written for Oriflamme."

It follows on directly from the text in the second of the quotes that jamie has just posted.
Certainly not from "The Book of Babalon".


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ptoner
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14/10/2013 5:31 pm  

Personally, I think the most interesting line was from the Star-News,  its version of the story, starting again with Wednesday, June 18-- the day following the explosion stated.

After dragging Parsons free, they propped him against one wall, where he was found by the city ambulance crew.

"Parsons methodically directed his rescuers, while being loaded into the ambulance."

Still alive at that stage.... almost does sound like he was killed off and definitely not suicidal to me.


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Shiva
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14/10/2013 6:45 pm  
"jamie barter" wrote:
... would presumably have alerted his rescuers if he had thought any sort of ‘foul play’ was in the offing ...

If you (or I, or Parsons) was struck down by a sudden explosion, you (or I, or Parsons) would not be having any thoughts of "foul play" if you (or I, or Parsons) knew nothing about a time-delayed (or remote-controlled) explosion. Boom!  It just hits you (or me, or Parsons) and we dunno nothin' about what happened.

"Mercury fulminate, or Hg(CNO)2, is a primary explosive. It is highly sensitive to friction and shock and is mainly used as a trigger for other explosives in percussion caps and blasting caps."

- Wikipedia
[/align:3v7yujzx]


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Hamal
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14/10/2013 6:48 pm  

I don't know. The thing with severe burns is, immediately after the event they can be articulate, but the survival rate did not used to be good:

"What is the prognosis for severe burn victims?
A few decades ago, burns covering half the body were often fatal. Now, thanks to research, many people with burns covering 90 percent of their bodies can survive, although they often have permanent impairments and scars."

http://www.nigms.nih.gov/Education/Factsheet_Burns.htm

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ptoner
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14/10/2013 7:47 pm  

Well Sex and Rocket's author does say that he had a "gaping hole " in his jaw. That would have made it a tad difficult trying to methodically give instructions to his rescuers!


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jamie barter
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15/10/2013 12:31 pm  
"Shiva" wrote:
"jamie barter" wrote:
... would presumably have alerted his rescuers if he had thought any sort of ‘foul play’ was in the offing ...

If you (or I, or Parsons) was struck down by a sudden explosion, you (or I, or Parsons) would not be having any thoughts of "foul play" if you (or I, or Parsons) knew nothing about a time-delayed (or remote-controlled) explosion. Boom!  It just hits you (or me, or Parsons) and we dunno nothin' about what happened. ...

I was just thinking if he may have noticed the odd fuse wire or detonator hanging around his lab that oughtn’t really to have been there…

"ptoner" wrote:
Well Sex and Rocket's author does say that he had a "gaping hole " in his jaw. That would have made it a tad difficult trying to methodically give instructions to his rescuers!

Point well taken, Paul!  Perhaps he might have resorted to using some version of semaphore or other gesticulatory action?!

N Joy


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jamie barter
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15/10/2013 1:01 pm  
"jamie barter" wrote:
Perhaps he might have resorted to using some version of semaphore or other gesticulatory action?!

Actually, I have just thought: the poor guy didn’t have two sets of arms, either.  Yes, how the deuce would he have “methodically directed” his rescuers? 

This is surely a conundrum worthy of Sherlock Holmes...

N Joy


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15/10/2013 7:11 pm  
"Shiva" wrote:
"jamie barter" wrote:
... would presumably have alerted his rescuers if he had thought any sort of ‘foul play’ was in the offing ...

If you (or I, or Parsons) was struck down by a sudden explosion, you (or I, or Parsons) would not be having any thoughts of "foul play" if you (or I, or Parsons) knew nothing about a time-delayed (or remote-controlled) explosion. Boom!  It just hits you (or me, or Parsons) and we dunno nothin' about what happened.

"Mercury fulminate, or Hg(CNO)2, is a primary explosive. It is highly sensitive to friction and shock and is mainly used as a trigger for other explosives in percussion caps and blasting caps."

- Wikipedia
[/align:31x4ta2n]

HA!  I had been thinking of posting the same pic here with the quote of the prophecy from the Babalon Working!  ;D  Ah, Breaking Bad....such an awesome show!  Truly, it was the best show on American television, ever!  I loved the ending!

Anyway, back on topic....I'm skeptical of his demise being an accident on his part.  He knew full well how volatile Hg(CNO) is, and I don't think he would have been careless with it.  I'm leaning on the assassination side of the fence.

"jamie barter" wrote:
"jamie barter" wrote:
Perhaps he might have resorted to using some version of semaphore or other gesticulatory action?!

Actually, I have just thought: the poor guy didn’t have two sets of arms, either.  Yes, how the deuce would he have “methodically directed” his rescuers? 

This is surely a conundrum worthy of Sherlock Holmes...

N Joy

Agreed!  Jack Parsons was a "Strange Angel", indeed!


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Anonymous
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Los
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ptoner
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16/10/2013 8:51 am  

We were discussing incidents surrounding Jack's death, not the "Thelemic morals" of Breaking Bad.


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Hamal
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16/10/2013 11:35 am  
"ptoner" wrote:
We were discussing incidents surrounding Jack's death, not the "Thelemic morals" of Breaking Bad.

I'll second that, where has all this Breaking Bad stuff suddenly come from? Can it be deleted? It's entirely un-related.

😮
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jamie barter
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16/10/2013 1:02 pm  

No longer having the delights of a working televisual appliance since the digital changeover over two years ago, I know nothing of this show "Breaking Bad" (- is it terribly windy stuff??!) - have never even heard of it before - but despite spolierdom (which I'm not worried about) the snatches of its résumé I have been reading create a most unusual effect of quasi-familairity!  It can be most amusing to see how threads diversify and take on a life of their own. 

We were indeed just discussing the events around Jack’s death, but the original topic was Jack and the “Occult Roots” of JPL – not that JPL had many occult roots, apart from Jack?  And not that this actually got discussed much either, since it got de-railed fairly early on to the side-track of Jack’s having (or not) having had sex with his mother and/or her hound dog.

To return to the title topic, then, did the Jet Propulsion Lab ever have any other “occult roots”?  And was it true that Wernher vonBraun was a member of Ultima Thule? (joke)

Conspiratorially yours,
N Joy


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jamie barter
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16/10/2013 3:04 pm  
"Hamal" wrote:
"ptoner" wrote:
We were discussing incidents surrounding Jack's death, not the "Thelemic morals" of Breaking Bad.

I'll second that...

Perhaps some sort of a poll might be in order?  May I suggest, as a first draft:

YES, Jack met with foul play – it was:

  a) CIA/ FBI/ N(a)SA
  b) The LAPD
  c) Israeli Intelligence
  d) The Black Lodge
  e)          None of the foregoing, but someone else

NO - Jack was a clumsy idiot and blew himself up by accident

NO - Jack had had enough of things & decided to try and fulfil the prophecy and/or top himself

Regarding the sex claim(s):

  a) He did/ did not have carnal knowledge of his mother
  b) He did/ did not have carnal knowledge of the dog
  c) His mother Ruth did/ did not have carnal knowledge of her dog
  d) L Ron Hubbard as the ‘silent partner’ was/ was not the secret cameraman involved any filming

Democratically yours,
N Joy


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William Thirteen
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16/10/2013 4:15 pm  

Perhaps it was the dog who blew Jack as revenge for feeling jilted!


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