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Yeats's poetry "lacked virlity"?

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hadgigegenraum
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@belmurru

Yes your are correct, but i think the problem is that Aleister tried so very hard to create the very mystery that makes poetry... through overkill when it came to using various props of accepted poetry; mythic names and allusions, repetition of romanticized references to nature, etc, that something was lost...

I have taken to reread some of his offerings in the Collected Works, and frankly I am impressed, but the impression is an impression the poetic prostate could well drown all comers in volume and reference, which might well have been practice relative to actually being commanded to participate in something greater...


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ignant666
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Reminded of a parodic reference (source forgotten) to non-mediocre poet T.S. Eliot's similar habit of larding his work with allusions (Ezra Pound, another non-mediocre poet, had this tendency as well):

Said T.S. Eliot while writing a tome

'It takes a heap o' erudition to make a pome.'

This is a parody of (very mediocre) poet Edgar Guest's "It takes a heap o’ livin’ in a house t’ make it home"


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belmurru
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Posted by: @ignant666

Reminded of a parodic reference (source forgotten) to non-mediocre poet T.S. Eliot's similar habit of larding his work with allusions (Ezra Pound, another non-mediocre poet, had this tendency as well):

Said T.S. Eliot while writing a tome

'It takes a heap o' erudition to make a pome.'

This is a parody of (very mediocre) poet Edgar Guest's "It takes a heap o’ livin’ in a house t’ make it home"

When I was a teenager, I tried to imitate Eliot, and also the Romantics like Keats and Shelley, and of course Crowley, working erudite references into the rhyme-scheme, if the poem had one. 

But I really have no great love for poetry, enjoying the pleasure of the words. I don't read prose fiction either, except, like poetry, if I have to to for the sake of science, to learn something about the object of my study. 

I feel a kinship with the "antiquarian, linguist, and historian" Louis Dufour de Longuerue (1652-1733), who said that he preferred books about Homer to Homer himself, and of whom it was said that, at his death, in his library "not a volume of poetry was to be found."

longuerue196

Isaac D'Israeli, Curiosities of Literature, vol. II (1834), p. 196.

 


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kidneyhawk
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Posted by: @belmurru

When I was a teenager, I tried to imitate Eliot, and also the Romantics like Keats and Shelley, and of course Crowley

How does one "imitate Crowley" here? This was my earlier point. There is nothing to imitate. Unless you want to meter out a "uterus which understands you." Bonus points for blood clots and a facial.

I don't mean to be combative-and I will again state (for the record): I am an admirer of Crowley's prose. He was very gifted in condensing insight into language. There is nothing in his poetry for me to sneer at or look down upon (except when he gets awkward and bungles it trying to be the "most nasty" who ever set pen to parchment). 

But there is nothing which lifted him off the launch pad as an "original."

And when reading his "Collected Works," I find that there is actually something missing. It is as if he is the poet commissioned to write for the big event-or orgy-but he fails to touch on a raw, naked element within himself that might resonate with all readers (a reason certain great poets are "great").

Crowley could have never written "On Another's Sorrow" (by Blake) as this feeling was not in his breast. At times, his soaring words feel like he is imitating emotion. He knows lust but he doesn't walk well in vulnerability.

Forgive me as I cannot remember the source but I remember someone once commenting that Swinburne (one of Crowley's idols) was all Angel or Ape with nothing of the human in him. I think this is an adequate description of Crowley the Poet, don't you? From the masterfully crafted descriptions of mystical reverie to the filth and mud and shit (also showing off his shredding fingers on the axe of poesy), Crowley doesn't ever let us know that he is really human, does he? And if so, is it play-acting?   

This (btw) is a great thread. Or at least I find it interesting. There is no way to "prove" that either poet was better but I do think our perspectives give some food for thought.  

 

 


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Tiger
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To map the voyage
on the Barque of Ages;
to rouse the dead and dying
on waves
caught
in passing
the symbol of torture and death
the cross of osiris
moving through
a world of phantasmagoria
the Tulpa reclaimed.

A newborn
personification
of liberty and freedom
overcoming the darkness;

a scribe
links
the filament
to the battery
of inspiration and revelation;

a seemingly human figure
made out
in the shadows.


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hadgigegenraum
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@kidneyhawk

Well said once again, and yes Crowley's prose is exceptional and worthy of the claim to be a master of the English language.

You have hit on something quite important, actually several, but I would agree that we do have the presentation of both ape and angel, but the human in-between seems to be absent, and certainly vulnerability does not sit well with him, and indeed there is too much of a straining for emotions, be they exalted states or those debased.

As regards imitation, well I suppose an imitator can be imitated, why I suppose some of my comments might so qualify as the pale product, but be that as it may this is the Aleister Crowley Society so I probably not alone in being so influenced by my reading habits and interests...

Posey or poetry has always attracted the poseur, to which magic or Magick could well be considered but a house of cards, ready to fall over into a heap to which I am sure there have been many an honest poet who have thrown the pile of parchment into the fire...which is part of the whole romantic psyche where a search for a greater identity is played out through verse, and where like the return of the salmon to spawn the rap sheet continues through the generations...

@tiger

Thanks for the poem!.....now how about another hundred stanzas by Thursday by Jove!


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dom
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Posted by: @kidneyhawk

How does one "imitate Crowley" here? This was my earlier point. There is nothing to imitate. Unless you want to meter out a "uterus which understands you." Bonus points for blood clots and a facial.

Do you think that Yeats was original?  If so, how?  That is someone should be able to imitate Yeats or Blake?

 

Would Crowley and Yeats have had the same idols?

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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kidneyhawk
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Posted by: @dom

Do you think that Yeats was original?  If so, how?  That is someone should be able to imitate Yeats or Blake?

Yes, I do. Although Yeats would-and did-write:

 

Talk to me of originality and I will turn on you with rage. I am a crowd, I am a lonely man, I am nothing.

 

A bit different from Crowley's claims to be one of the greatest poets who ever wrote in the English language (“for one MUSN'T forget Shakespeare”).

 

The original accusation of “lacking virility” falls flat. I think your own citation of Leda and the Swan is indicative of this. I would imagine that young poet Crowley, were he in, say, a different relationship towards Yeats, would also agree, if for no other reason than the immediate subject matter.

 

But the poem is about more than the classical tale of a rapist god in zoomorphic disguise. Yeats is addressing questions of destiny and fate, karmic fields of cause and effect. He asks a question which both Determinism and Quantum Mechanics have sought to answer.

 

His writing can be stark, blunt and to the point while at the same time achieving a type of ornate structure. Consider the first line of Leda. It's like a film opening with a lightning bolt, a gunshot, cut into the middle of the penultimate action. What follows moves further into the event until it becomes a philosophical inquiry through its mythic framework.

 

Yeats, as a modern poet, conveys a dichotomy between the magical world of the Shaman-Bard (tiresome Druids to Crowley) and the weight and emptiness of modernity. We find this theme echoing in The Stolen Child where the visionary faery landscape (accessible directly, “hand in hand”) is contrasted with a world “full of troubles” and “weeping.” This longing, mystical vision and surrounding sadness translated well in the Waterboys' arrangement for this poem (from Fisherman's Blues).

 

But really, I am often taken by the language Yeats uses. The words he weaves together convey an invocatory cadence through a sea of shifting moods. But perhaps it is his stance as a “modern,” a figure familiar with the sadness and emptiness of the world, which allows him to link a reader (or inhabitant of that same colorless empire) with the mystical verities he is expressing. In the case of Yeats, his preoccupation with myth serves this position well, for it is an archetypal framework which can speak to both worlds (the Magical and the Objective-Rational). There is no pretentiousness in Yeats. His keynote is that “passionate intensity” he bemoaned as belonging to the “worst” in the Second Coming.

 

To imitate Yeats is to follow after these themes and to do so with one's head full of his echoing lines, the beat and pulse of the words. I once carved a favorite line of his into a blockprint (titled “The Druid”...of course! It's Druids-A-Go-Go with the Man of Ireland!):

 

Take, if you must, this little bag of dreams. Unloose the cord, and they will wrap you round.

 

That's Yeats. Every word serves a purpose here. “If you MUST...” It's not compulsory. It may come with a consequence. But having decided, you don't ask, you don't purchase. You TAKE it. And it is LITTLE. An unassuming thing which holds the BIG MAGIC. It's not a Djinn who appears-or a demon in the triangle (although one may recall, with some anticipation, Elliot's line: “I will show you fear in a handful of dust”). What comes out of the bag wraps you round. Buoyed up, protected, healed, embraced. The ethereal substance of dream proves to be the panacea for the brokenness of Spirit which had led us to the “MUST” stage of things.

 

And for all my comments, my own experience of this poet is where all of what I have described (and more) is realized within the depth of my own being as I read and utter the words from my own throat.


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kidneyhawk
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Posted by: @dom

Would Crowley and Yeats have had the same idols?

They were certainly both mythologists. But they encountered their myths as very different personalities. I don't think it is an issue so much of drawing from the same font but rather how that material is distilled into new and individual creative works. 


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dom
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Posted by: @kidneyhawk

But perhaps it is his stance as a “modern,” a figure familiar with the sadness and emptiness of the world, 

 

 

"Existence is pure joy", maybe we're getting to the crux of the matter on why AC thought Yeats lacked virility? 

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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hadgigegenraum
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@kidneyhawk

I very much appreciate reading your reply to Dom's questions concerning Yeats originality, etc...

The subject had be pull out a copy of Colin Wilson's essay "Poetry and Mysticism" (1969) were Wilson  quotes from Yeats thus relative to a notion  Wilson would oft explore: 'absurd good news' that he attributes to G.K. Chesterton, who had things to say about Crowley's poetry...

...

"It happened to W.B. Yeats for no particular reason, when he happened to be sitting in a London shop:

My fiftieth year had come and gone

I sat a solitary man,

In a crowded London shop

An open book and empty cup

On the marble table-top

While on the shop and streets I gazed

My body of a sudden blazed;

And twenty minutes more or less

It seemed, so great my happiness,

That I was blessed and could bless.        ( Wilson does not say which poem this is from)

   Yeats is full of these sudden insights, particularly in his later years, when he had got over his romanic self-pity about the "wrong of unshapely things". In a poem called the "The Gyres." which begins by repeating some of the ominous prophecies of "The Second Coming". he has these lines:

What matter? Out of cavern comes a voice,                                                                                    And all it knows is that one word "Rejoice!"   (Yeats, The Gyres)

...

Note Wilson makes reference to Yeats having gotten over his 'romantic self pity', which I suppose is the flip of the coin to romantic self aggrandizement...So when Crowley was saying that Yeats poetry lacked virility it would concern his earlier periods and this 'self pity'....

Actually  a factor in my coming to appreciate Crowley came from Colin Wilson, who was able to extract from Crowley's biography a certain essence relative the issue of 'absurd good news' particularly the story of the cure of Jane Wolfe relative to her cure taken a Cefalu, her magical retirement on the rocks above the ocean, learning to recharge the batteries...the very theme of the cure in a Diary of a Drug Fiend....

Speaking of that book, note that the world's greatest poet uses the incantations of JFC Fuller there in the beginning of the book...

  "O thou golden wine of the sun, that are poured over the dark breasts of the night! I adore thee Evoe! I adore thee I A O!"

The reality is that Crowley could be magnanimous to other writers influenced by his influence, correct me if wrong, Neuberg, and essays by Frank Bennett regarding his experiences at Cefalu, and perhaps a few other writers!

HG


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dom
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It's also notable that AC's other well-known insult fired at Yeats was that he was a "lank, dishevelled demonologist".  That's a curious public insult made by Crowley of all people who appears to be engaging in some sort of attempted "blackening" of Yeats's reputation a la some sort of Satanic expose perhaps? 

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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kidneyhawk
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Posted by: @dom

he was a "lank, dishevelled demonologist".

Dom, I listened to this BBC podcast on the way into work this morning and found it to be a quite interesting picture of the poet. It is absolutely worth your time, I believe. Quite the lively conversation at times. Crowley is even mentioned once (as a charlatan). 

One point I found interesting about this talk was that Yeats, like AC, is driven through his own neurosis on a personal quest for Truth and Spirit on the grand scale. The Second Coming is mentioned as a type of prophetic poem which heralds the coming of a new age (or Aeon) and Yeats is compelled to develop "his own religion" in response to modernity's death-dealing attack on the religious views of his upbringing. He seems to follow along with the same initiatory blueprint that underpinned Crowley's career-and yet he manifested it through his own unique and individual history (which we all must-or ought-do).

In other words, Yeats, too, followed the Law of Thelema and we know this by his fruits: poetry that remains sharp, incisive, prophetic, mythic and of relevance to the modern human experience in the world. 

Lots more of interest in the podcast. Only half an hour long but no fluff. I'll look forward to what you think.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzOq5j8gAvY&t=2s

 

 


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Shiva
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Posted by: @dom

"blackening" of Yeats's reputation a la some sort of Satanic expose perhaps? 

That one is always a good choice.. The most popular one in use today seems to be "child abuse," in one of its many forms. If the abuse is connected in any way to non-Christian beliefs or practices, then it's obviously Satanic ... the double whammy.

Although the word "demonologist" is easy to define, it is a rather rare and suspicious compliment to lay on one's GD fellow. Did these quaint barbs come after the GD exploded?


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dom
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Posted by: @kidneyhawk
Posted by: @dom

he was a "lank, dishevelled 

Lots more of interest in the podcast. Only half an hour long but no fluff. I'll look forward to what you think.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzOq5j8gAvY&t=2s

 

 

The podcast doesn't make me want to do any more research on Yeats.  I'm with Crowley, if Yeats would've wuffed bags of coke, stirred up the bourgeoisie, became a junky, lost count of how many brothels he did, climbed mountains, traveled through China on a donkey doing strange prayers, hung his crazy wife upside down in a wardrobe,  wrote pornographic poetry and played some good chess and instigated practices such as razoring the forearm  when saying "and" I'd be interested.   

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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hadgigegenraum
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@dom 

Great....start slashing way..."and" when the artery pops "and" sprays all over the room,  if your viral enough "and"... then "and" we will count your response "and" as a vote for Crowley!


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Shiva
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Coca promotes false virility.


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dom
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Posted by: @kidneyhawk

 

In other words, Yeats, too, followed the Law of Thelema and we know this by his fruits: poetry that remains sharp, incisive, prophetic, mythic and of relevance to the modern human experience in the world. 

Judge for yourself folks;

Yeats Poems Titles (csun.edu)

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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kidneyhawk
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Posted by: @dom

if Yeats would've wuffed bags of coke, stirred up the bourgeoisie, became a junky, lost count of how many brothels he did, climbed mountains, traveled through China on a donkey doing strange prayers, hung his crazy wife upside down in a wardrobe,  wrote pornographic poetry and played some good chess and instigated practices such as razoring the forearm  when saying "and" I'd be interested

So you'd prefer a poet who leads a "celebrity lifestyle" as opposed to one who writes powerful and poignant poetry? As if slashing one's forearm, doing coke and eating a turd makes ones artistry great. If Yeats could have just done things you, apparently, find impressive (like hanging his wife upside down in a wardrobe), you'd give him some study. For surely and of a truth, shocking and outrageous behavior makes for great literary accomplishments, ipso facto!

And then there is this:

Posted by: @dom

Judge for yourself folks;

 

"Judge" Yeats merit as a poet by a chronological list of his TITLES? By that "logic," let's judge Led Zeppelin's first 4 albums by their rousing titles, now, shall we?

 

 


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Michael Staley
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Posted by: @dom

if Yeats would've wuffed bags of coke, stirred up the bourgeoisie, became a junky, lost count of how many brothels he did, climbed mountains, traveled through China on a donkey doing strange prayers, hung his crazy wife upside down in a wardrobe,  wrote pornographic poetry and played some good chess and instigated practices such as razoring the forearm  when saying "and" I'd be interested.   

Embarassing stuff. Whatever turns you on, I suppose.

My favourite writer is Helen Dunmore, who I think led a fairly quiet life, but who wrote some of ther finest novels I have come across, and in whose poetry I am becoming increasingly interested.


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dom
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Posted by: @kidneyhawk

So you'd prefer a poet who leads a "celebrity lifestyle" as opposed to one who writes powerful and poignant poetry? As if slashing one's forearm, doing coke and eating a turd makes ones artistry great. If Yeats could have just done things you, apparently, find impressive (like hanging his wife upside down in a wardrobe), you'd give him some study. For surely and of a truth, shocking and outrageous behavior makes for great literary accomplishments, ipso facto!

You asked for my opinion on the podcast and I was talking about the podcast, 'twas a bit stodgy the way the academics there delivered the narrative of Yeat's path and there were only a few seconds on Yeat's  (to quote you) Second Coming .... mentioned as a type of prophetic poem which heralds the coming of a new age (or Aeon) and Yeats is compelled to develop "his own religion" in response to modernity's death-dealing attack on the religious views of his upbringing.  I expected a podcast about that but was disappointed therefore that podcast did not tweak my interest in WBY.   That WBY poem is interesting yes prophetic for sure.

They missed out an important event documented here in this link where WBY was "violently thrown against a wall" at a seance with Blavatsky;

The Wonderful & Frightening World of W.B. Yeats - BoB 2016 - YouTube   7m30s.

 

33m46s in we have a WBY discussion on 'the anti-Self' which for sure aligns with Liber Al.  Also ironically in the same lecture we are told that WBY took mescal and hashish! (9m50s.) 

To answer your question it is said that Shelley was 'mad, bad and dangerous to know' but some of his poems are nauseating to me so no.  WBY was what Americans call 'pussy whipped' and I don't appreciate the mopeyness in his existence and his work (from what I've seen) but OTOH the fact that he was a known I.R.A. sympathiser and steadfast in his beliefs about 'other worlds' shows he had balls so yes he was complex.  

 

Posted by: @kidneyhawk

 

In other words, Yeats, too, followed the Law of Thelema and we know this by his fruits: poetry that remains sharp, incisive, prophetic, mythic and of relevance to the modern human experience in the world. 

Judge for yourself folks;

Yeats Poems Titles (csun.edu)

It's not a mere list of titles, this a link to actual full poems by WBY for the possible delectation of Lashtal lurkers and posters alike. 

 

Posted by: @kidneyhawk

 

In other words, Yeats, too, followed the Law of Thelema and we know this by his fruits: poetry that remains sharp, incisive, prophetic, mythic and of relevance to the modern human experience in the world. 

 

 

Any artist does.... for starters. 

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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belmurru
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Posted by: @dom

 

To answer your question it is said that Shelley was 'mad, bad and dangerous to know' but some of his poems are nauseating to me so no. 

"Mad - bad - and dangerous to know" was how Lady Caroline Lamb (1785-1828) described Lord Byron (1788-1824) in her diary of 25 March 1812, after seeing him for the first time at a society ball.


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dom
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Posted by: @belmurru
Posted by: @dom

 

To answer your question it is said that Shelley was 'mad, bad and dangerous to know' but some of his poems are nauseating to me so no. 

"Mad - bad - and dangerous to know" was how Lady Caroline Lamb (1785-1828) described Lord Byron (1788-1824) in her diary of 25 March 1812, after seeing him for the first time at a society ball.

 

Sorry, Byron yes.   

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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hadgigegenraum
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And the lovely conversation has brought me to reopen the Collected Works again and to take on JFC Fuller's "Star In The West" as I suppose a friendly readers guide, which basically what he says it is.

I wonder what Yeats thought of Fuller's presentation?

Here is a nice.PDF of it...

https://www.thelemistas.org/PDF/Fuller_J_F_C-The_Star_in_the_West.pdf

 

 

 

 


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dom
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Interesting opening lines in the following prophetic poem (on the coming decades of the 20th century) ....

THE SECOND COMING

www.csun.edu/~hceng029/yeats/yeatspoems/TheSecondComin

 

TURNING and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer

..as Horus is a falcon-headed God.

 

 

WBY here appears to be writing a poem based on past-life vision of others;

 

ANOTHER SONG OF A FOOL

www.csun.edu/~hceng029/yeats/yeatspoems/AnotherSong

 

Furthermore page 51 from Colin Wilson's Aleister Crolwey The Nature Of The Beast, Aquarian Press 1987 Wilson claims that Crowley thought that he had been cursed by WBY hence he was impressed by Bennet's introduction, "...the Goetia has been meddling with you"

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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wellreadwellbred
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 As pointed out by belmurru on the first page of this thread, Crowley's poetry, require a key, or many keys, to be understood.

The poetry of Yeats speaks more immediately to the human condition (that is all the characteristics and key events that compose the essentials of human existence), of a general, uninformed reader of poetry.  

Like Crowley's poetry appears to be aimed at a particular audience, as it requires many keys to be understood, this does also appear to be the case with Aleister Crowley's so-called "Holy Book[-s] of Thelema".  

 


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hadgigegenraum
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From JFC Fuller himself in Star of the West we have this reference to Crowley as the virile, relative to being a poet. as found at the beginning of the first chapter called "The Looking-Glass"!

"ON surveying the works of Aleister Crowley the two essential facts that grip our understanding are: firstly, the superabundance of his genius; and secondly, the diversity of his form. “My womb is pregnant with mad moons and suns,”* he writes, and though we could hardly agree to endow so virile a master with so feminine an organ, yet we can attribute something very like it to his brain."


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dom
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If you're a Thelemic religionist who views Crowley as an upgraded Christ or Shakyamuni Buddha then Yeats plays an important part in the story of the unfolding of the New Aeon. 

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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kidneyhawk
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Posted by: @dom

If you're a Thelemic religionist who views Crowley as an upgraded Christ or Shakyamuni Buddha then Yeats plays an important part in the story of the unfolding of the New Aeon. 

If one takes such a view, then Yeats must appear as a figure of impertinence and opposition on the unfolding path of the Messiah. But there are more views than that available. It would seem that the New Age, the New Aeon, the Crossing of the Rubicon happens at a rough-and not precise-time frame (at least as we are able to ascertain). It moves out in ripples like those formed when a pebble breaks the surface of a still lake. As those ripples hit us, some are impacted more deeply than others. Some gather the gist of a Planetary Shift and try to sort this out from within the field of their own experience and predilection.

 

It is my view that Yeats was as much a “Prophet of the Aeon” as Crowley (whose role as such I do not doubt). Blake was fond of quoting the Bible: Would that ALL the Lord's people were Prophets. Thus, I see many around this central event taking such a role: from Walt Whitman to Philip Dick. But these are heralds of the English language. In the meantime, what of the scientists, computer technicians etc? Stephen Hawking, Child of the Aeon. What of Tesla catching the wave and manifesting Magic thru Science? Kenneth Grant regarded Dali (born in 1904) as one of the first born artists of the New Aeon. In fact, Yeats gets a name check when Grant mentions Dali on p. 34 of OTCOT. According to Grant, Yeats suggests that Mathers used techniques similar to those of Dali (who, himself, described one of his methods for generating subject matter as “witchcraft” in his book on the Secrets of Magic Craftsmanship) to go beyond the rational into the New Gnosis. Rimbaud certainly did.

Posted by: @dom

They missed out an important event documented here in this link where WBY was "violently thrown against a wall" at a seance with Blavatsky;

I'll check this podcast out! I do recall reading of the event decades ago in Yeats autobiography.

 

Posted by: @belmurru

"Mad - bad - and dangerous to know"

This sounds sexy. But it could also be a most apt description of, say, Ted Bundy. Not so sexy.  

Posted by: @wellreadwellbred

Crowley's poetry appears to be aimed at a particular audience, as it requires many keys to be understood

Beyond vocabulary and the same educational background Crowley had (i.e the classics, Qabalah, occult references etc), what, precisely, are the keys you find needful to "unlock" Crowley's poetry? Yes, Yeats can speak to the man on the street but his own work also requires some critical background knowledge to fully penetrate, as well. What keys are unique to the task of unlocking what Crowley offers in his Collected Works? 

 


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kidneyhawk: "... what, precisely, are the keys you find needful to "unlock" Crowley's poetry? [...] What keys are unique to the task of unlocking what Crowley offers in his Collected Works?"

 

In Volume One, the poem 'The Temple of the Holy Ghost', introduces Golden Dawn allusions, Sanskrit yoga terms, qabbalistic terms and Egyptian mythology.

And as belmurru on the first page of this thread states that Crowley's poetry, requires a key, or many keys, to be understood, what are the key or the keys, to "unlock" Crowley's poetry, according to this belmurru? And what keys are unique to the task of unlocking what Crowley offers in his Collected Works, according to said belmurru?

 

> I suggest that (a background understanding of) AC's ideas about Horus, are among the keys unique to the task of unlocking what Crowley offers in his Collected Work:

" "Here lies Horus dead, There Isis slain. We have no leader left." (Source: The Fatal Force written in 1899, contained in Collected Works -VOLUME I - - - https://hermetic.com/crowley/collected-works/i/the-fatal-force ) "

" "Hail! Hail to Thee, Lord of us, Horus! All hail to the warrior name! Thy chariots shall drive them before us, Thy sword sweep them forth as a flame. Rise! Move! and descend! I behold Thee, Heaven cloven of fieriest bars, Armed Light; and they follow and fold Thee, Thine armies of terrible stars. The Powers of Mars!" (Source: written in 1900, contained in Collected Works -VOLUME I - - - https://hermetic.com/crowley/collected-works/i/carmen-saeculare ). "

" "I hardly dare hope the sun. I seek the darkness, not the light. O Lord Harpocrates [which the 'Aiwass' in Aleister Crowley's later The Book of the Law is "the minister of"], be still The moveless centre of my will. [...] O Nuit, the starry one arise, And set thy starlight in my skies! In darkness, in the void abyss, I grope with vain despairing arms. The silence as a serpent is, The rustle of the world alarms. O Horus, Light in Darkness, bless My failure with thine own success!" (Source: The Soul of Osiris. A History, published in 1901 - - - https://www.100thmonkeypress.com/biblio/acrowley/books/soul_of_osiris_1901/soul_of_osiris_text.pdf ) "

( Source:  Was the HGA also the actual initiator in the Order in which AC started on his path as an initiate? - - - https://www.lashtal.com/forums/thelema/was-the-hga-also-the-actual-initiator-in-the-order-in-which-ac-started-on-his-path-as-an-initiate/paged/2/ )

 

>> I also suggest that (a background understanding of) AC's ideas about Nuit and The Book of the Law, are among the keys unique to the task of unlocking what Crowley offers in his Collected Work:

As both 'Nuit' and 'The Book of the Law', are terms used in the satire titled 'Ambrosii Magi Hortus Rosarum' in The Works of Aleister Crowley Volume II

 

>>> I addtion I suggest that (a background understanding of) AC's ideas about "Qabalistic knowledge", are among the keys unique to the task of unlocking what Crowley offers in his Collected Work

'Ambrosii Magi Hortus Rosarum', is dated by AC to 1902, and defined by the latter as a "remarkable document", where "The Qabalistic knowledge is as authentic as it is profound".

( Source: Correspondences between Crowley´s pre-1904 works and Liber AL - - - https://www.lashtal.com/forums/thelema/correspondences-between-crowleys-pre-1904-works-and-liber-al/ )


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Posted by: @kidneyhawk

If one takes such a view, then Yeats must appear as a figure of impertinence and opposition on the unfolding path of the Messiah.

Well yeah WBY tried to harm AC with a curse...(according to Colin Wilson see above reference) due to his denied jealous recognition that AC was the superior poet.....  <as perceived by AC>

I mean we're not exactly talking Herod the Great (or even Judas Iscariot) to Jesus but yeah there was animosity.   

 

Posted by: @kidneyhawk

.

 

It is my view that Yeats was as much a “Prophet of the Aeon” as Crowley (whose role as such I do not doubt). Blake was fond of quoting the Bible: Would that ALL the Lord's people were Prophets. Thus, I see many around this central event taking such a role: from Walt Whitman to Philip Dick. But these are heralds of the English language. In the meantime, what of the scientists, computer technicians etc? Stephen Hawking, Child of the Aeon. What of Tesla catching the wave and manifesting Magic thru Science? Kenneth Grant regarded Dali (born in 1904) as one of the first born artists of the New Aeon. In fact, Yeats gets a name check when Grant mentions Dali on p. 34 of OTCOT. According to Grant, Yeats suggests that Mathers used techniques similar to those of Dali (who, himself, described one of his methods for generating subject matter as “witchcraft” in his book on the Secrets of Magic Craftsmanship) to go beyond the rational into the New Gnosis. Rimbaud certainly did.

 

Sounds like Carrot Childe's blurb but yeah I can roll with that, I guess prophets have disagreed historically....can't think of any examples (in the Hebrew tradition) mind. 

 

 

From Yeat's prophetic "Second Coming" poem

TURNING and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer

i.e. the (Falcon-headed) Child is breaking free of it's guardian/ minder and is running (well, flying) amok perhaps.  

 

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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