Glad my 120 helped out.

Thanks for this. I never noticed that the sum of the corresponding primes of the numbers of "numbers & the words" ( including their verse number ) equals the sum of "the numbers & the words" ( including their verse number )

76’ 4’ 6’ 3’ 8’ 2’ 4’ 3’ 24’ 89’ = 992 = 76 4 6 3 8 A B K 2 4 A L G O R 3 Y X 24 89 R P S T O V A L

which allows the numbers & the words to be reduced to the letter N spelled in full four times, which itself equals the finals spelling of the first verse of the chapter

:::: N = 992 = Nu! the hiding of Hadit = unveiling before the Children of men

and a clause from the 5th verse of the first chapter. If one of the meanings of Nuit is Night in French, Nu in the same language signfies "nude, bare, naked."

If we spell the letters of the numbers & the words using final values then it equals the non-finals sum of the first verse of each chapter as written in the manuscript

76 4 6 3 8 A B K 2 4 A L G O R 3 Y X 24 89 R P S T O V A L = 2192 = Had! the manifestation of Nuit 1 Nu! the hiding of Hadit 1 Abrahadabra! the reward of Ra Hoor Khut

In the verses preceding "Ever the King" equals 318, "Kings" equals 143, "long" equals 89, and "death" = 24. The primes corresponding to the CCXX numbers which appear on the manuscript page equal Prime 318.

The "Harlot" identity appears not only in 1 Corinthians 6:16 - PORNHI = 318 - a verse variation of Genesis 2:24 - but also in the sum of verses II 75-77 ( without verse numbers ) which equals the Greek of Revelation 17:5

AL II 75-77 = 7679 = βαβυλων η μεγαλη η μητηρ των πορνων και των βδελυγματων της γης

the words inscribed on the forehead of the woman clothed in purple and scarlet, "BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND OF THE ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH"

JG

Dwtw

I hadn't thought of just isolating the 76th prime along with the ordinal primes of the Cipher. Your 992 is not only interesting from the Hebrew perspective of equaling verse 2:1, but 992 equals 496 x 2, where 496 is a 'perfect' number and the sum of 1-31, thus finally working 31 as a key into this thing…sort of 🙂

I also like that II:75-77 equals the words on the forehead of Babalon. These multiple references to babalon, the Beast and Chaos are pretty intriguing.

And I must confess yet another stupid mistake on my part. The Serial Greek values of the prior 'translation' are actually 168, not 169 🙁 I would have noticed this if I hadn't gotten so hung up on the second half equaling 93 (which it still does). But this actually works out even better; not only does 168 = HLION, the Sun, but also the Serial Greek, plus the numbers is 168 + 143 = 311 = letter-name of Beta, Zodiacal letter of Aries, the Exaltation of the Sun. And if we cheat a bit and add both the Serial and Alexandrian values of the Cipher letters we get 667 + 168 = 835 = LEO in Greek, thus indicating the Beast whereon The Scarlet Woman rideth, as well as the zodiac sign of Leo, the Rulership of the Sun. Thus the letters indicate 'The Scarlet Woman (hiding) the Sun produces the Lion' 🙂 So this consolidates the solar terms quite nicely, even if it destroys my whole idea of the Supernal Triad being referenced.

So if we can't include the Supernals, we still have Will involved, as well as the Sun and the Lion.

The whole Cipher = The Scarlet Woman + Love

Divided up it equals the letters ON

Removing the numbers = Equal and Manifest

The whole Cipher in Serial Greek = BETA

The sum of Standard and Serial letters = Lion

The two rows of Standard letter values = Magic and Goetia

The two rows of Serial letter values = alt. letter-name of Xi and Thelema

From these we might get something like: B, The Scarlet Woman of ON, conjoined with the Sun, Manifests the Lion X through Magic, with Equal Love and Will.

The possibilities of course, can be manipulated many ways. There is no clear-cut sentence to be derived from all this, it's all a matter of artistic approach.

Another thing I noticed is that the three letters which are are the most problem to transliterate, (and thus the most debatable) are Y, X and V, here shown as Gamma-Xi-Nu = 113 = 24 + 89. So perhaps this is added evidence that the transliteration is correct.

So what do we get if we cheat and add the whole Standard cipher to the Serial values of the letters? 810 + 168 = 978 = H EKLEPsIS = The Eclipse.

Litlluw

RLG

Dwtw

I have finished my essay on the various solutions to the Cipher. It can be found here:

http://www.scribd.com/doc/229766781/Secrets-of-the-Cipher-Naughts

I will update it whenever I find more solutions. Enjoy 🙂

Litlluw

RLG

Thank you very much for this, RLG! I am particularly grateful for the fact that you've listed so many previous solutions. Your essay is truly an excellent resource.

Well done!

Markus

*Listen*” to the numbers and the

*words*” (II:75). At first glance, there are numbers but no words there, only letters. In Hebrew, one can consider a letter to also be a word (for example, the letter “Aleph” [value, 1] consists of the word ALP [value, 111]). But as far as I’m aware, this doesn’t apply in

*English*(- or does it? Maybe someone will oblige with an exposition?)

Dwtw

Well, there certainly are letter-names in English. Of the 'solutions' I surveyed, a couple are phonetic, but none used the approach of letter-names to stand in for the Cipher letters. Since the names are merely phonetic, and don't mean anything, you can only get numbers out of using them.

The full list of English letter names is thus:

A - BEE - CEE - DEE - E - EF - GEE - AITCH - I - JAY - KAY - EL - EM - EN - O - PEE - CUE - AR - ESS - TEE - U - VEE - DOUBLE U - EX - WYE - ZEE

The three main variants are ELL, WY and ZED.

For the letters in the Cipher, using the list below, the TEG has a total of **472**, though there are variants possible. The numbers of course add to **143**, so you get the following:

4 - 6 - 3 - 8 - A - BEE - KAY - 2 - 4 - A - EL - GEE - EM - O - AR - 3 - WYE -

EX - 24 - 89 - AR - PEE - ESS - TEE - O - VEE - A - EL

143 = The Book of the Law

472 = it is revealed by Aiwass the minister of Hoor-paar-kraat.

and as an encouragement:

143 = Thou knowest!

472 = tell them this glad word. O be thou proud and mighty

And to sum it all up:

615 = Success is thy proof: argue not; convert not; talk not overmuch!

This is probably the best advice of all 🙂

Those who know the transitional method of TQ will get this - given any two numbers, you can find a third one that is a transition between them. So changing from 143 to 472 results in the interim hexagram 558, thus:

143 = 012022

472 = 122111

558 = 202200

558 = 4 6 3 8 AB K 2 4 A L G M O R 3 Y X 24 89 R P S T O V A L. What meaneth this, o prophet?

The import of these results is that the 'glad word' is The Book of the Law *en toto*, not the contents of the Cipher. This seems to be exactly what is meant from the context, because if the Prophet is not to know the Cipher, then as the Chosen One the 'glad word' he tells unto men can't be the so-called solution to the Cipher; so it must be the totality of the Law. And regarding this, he is to let success be his proof.

Whether the above 'solves' anything or not, it still provides a message that is apropos.

Litlluw

RLG

Markus

Dwtw

You'res welcom, and i appreciate the compliment. i hope people get some use out of it; i'd be interested to know what people's favorites are.

One thing I noticed about the various solutions is that aside from a couple which deliberately built on previous work, almost all of them take a unique approach to deciphering it. One has to wonder when all approaches will have been tried! But even work that doesn't seem viable on its own may offer a methodology that can be used from a different angle. All in all, it was interesting to compile all of them.

Litlluw

RLG

Leo, I read your summary of the various solutions, but I fail to see how it accomplishes anything except to insure the subject remains a muddled mess. I recently penned a list of criterion that would narrow the field of competition and produce work of a much higher quality; I list them here as food for thought:

Given the influx of exponents attempting to compete for the coveted title of *child of the prophet*, standards are needed that narrow the field of solutions to the riddle in verse II:76 of *Liber L* if progress is to be made in determining his identity. By implementing stringent criterion, most of the solutions so-called are eliminated ipso facto. Such criterion can only be generated by those engaged in the work; accordingly, the following standards are suggested as a means of both qualifying and disqualifying efforts to solve the riddles of Liber L:

The first criteria requires that standard qabalistic techniques be used to produce solutions to the riddles without inventing techniques that serve the sole purpose of producing solutions. The author of Liber L was free to include whatever he deemed necessary in the book; if his goal is to see the riddles solved, he will have designed them using techniques known at the time the book was dictated.

The second criteria requires a new set of symbols accompany any gematria system used to generate a solution, as directed in verse II:55 of Liber L; without companion symbols, systems touted as significant should be deemed incomplete and disqualified.

The third criteria requires a level of evidence that exceeds the typical one-dimensional solutions that permeate the field. Any gematria system applied to the letters in the riddle of verse II:76 will generate a value that can be equated with words; in order for corresponding words to carry any weight, they must be shown to be significant to the content of the verse, and any numeric results verified by some means. A multifaceted solution would be ideal, one that reflects the creativity and intelligence of a divine being, with the correct enumeration of the letters in the riddle confirmed, and the purpose of its numbers explained.

The fourth criteria requires the claimant satisfactorily solve the other alphanumeric riddles in Liber L. In the event there are aspects of Liber L not meant to be addressed by the follower/child, he should at the very least be able to explain the majority of the riddles.

The fifth criteria requires the follower/child predicted in Liber L be able to prove his identity; if Aiwass has the divine power stated in Liber L, then he should be able to provide the child with the evidence needed to confirm his authority.

Those thoughts aside, i have a few issues with your list of solutions. From 1999 until 2009, all of my attempts at solving the riddles in Liber L were experimental efforts aimed at exploring the possibilities; I will be the first to admit that everything I did during those years was essentially shit, as are most of the solutions in your list. That being the case, why bother with them?

The important aspect of my activities during the years noted consisted of honing my programming skills by writing advanced software that has enabled me to explore Liber L with the Tahuti Key, work that I consider my only valid efforts to date.

One of your criticisms of the solution generated with the Tahuti Key is that by ignoring the only lowercase letter in the riddle, an arbitrary choice was made, which is not true: I enumerated the riddle both ways, with and without the lowercase letter, which is actually a comprehensive approach.

Your leave your readers dangling with a supposition that is not only speculative, but irrelevant in respect to the subject at hand. You state that surely there is someone else whose name, city & state, and street address are hidden in the riddle using the gematria system of the Tahuti Key, when the real question is whether out of the few thousand people on the planet interested in Thelema, the personal information of one them can be found hidden in the riddle in the same manner as mine is; the answer is probably not. Even it were possible, my successful efforts at solving the other riddles in book sets my case apart from others.

The solution to the riddle of verse II:76 referred to in Leo's summary of solutions can be read here in its entirety: http://www.thelima.org/signature.html :

I have recently authored another solution to the riddle of verse II:76 using the Tahuti Key that is equally remarkable as the one documented in *Signature Solutions*. I introduce it here for the first time: it's called* The Gematrikon Solution*: http://www.thelima.org/Gem-solution.html

The simple key to the riddle is the fact that its design makes a real answer impossible. The riddle is empty. We've already gone over the "hole" part.

This is so because no one actually knows how the riddle was constructed. If it was just some random writing of Crowley in the middle of the MS, or what. And, if it is indeed some kind of riddle or cipher, no one really knows which system and values were used to create it. Due to the circumstance of Crowley saying not even he knew, the exact answer or cipher can never be known. For even if one devises the 'correct answer', there is still no way to check the legitimacy of that answer.

So, the question is hollow, and has no direct point or ending. There will be as many 'ciphers' are there are those who will endeavor to create/uncover one.

Indeed, Azidonis. Belmuru's earlier insight seems under-appreciated. Future qabalistic techniques are out, but the future street address of the Chosen One in. Apparently.

Thanks arthur. I wasn't trying to be coy; I too have scribbled countless pages trying to figure out the string of numbers and letters. I was only trying to emphasize that the text itself gives no basis for the idea that it is a "riddle" in the strict sense - a cleverly phrased question with only one possible clever answer. It is of course a riddle in the sense that it is not clear what it is saying. I do believe, however, that it is saying something, and that, with rational parameters for interpretation, we, or some of us, can come to a consensus on a basic understanding.

Thank you RLG for bringing together your succinct account of the various interpretations proposed. I was only vaguely familiar with a handful (Crowley-Achad, Hulse, NAEQ), so this a rich collation of the tradition for the interpretation of this verse.

I haven't attempted this subject for years; I only came at it in the last few weeks again because of this thread, and realized that I had a point of view about the writing of the text, and that it might be able to shed light on this apparently random sequence.

The first general principle is that people can't really write a random sequence of numbers and letters - there will always be a reason for the first and each succeding choice of symbol, even if that reason is subconscious. There is a logic to it, but one must question the writer thoroughly (or attempt to get inside their head as best we can, as in the case of someone dead but who left a lot of writing, like Crowley) to begin to form an idea of why such and such a list resulted.

Taking as my clue that Crowley was in an intense, blissful (sort of body-orgasmic) trance, and at II,69 feared he had lost the voice (before the hour was up), he aimed his will at staying in the inspiration and made one final push, this section to the end of the chapter (see his notes on the Vision and the Voice, 2nd Aethyr (p. 243 note 1 of the Weiser edition for his account that he even "fainted" at this part of the writing).

By my estimation, vv. 69-79 were written in the last 5 to 7 minutes of the hour. The "numbers and the words" in about 15 seconds (or less, given Crowley's speed; try it for yourself). I fully accept that he was writing at top speed and wasn't making conscious calculations: his calculating or "Cabalistical brain" was working on autopilot, both from habit and immediate obsession. Compare his solution to the problem of Had's name being 11 in II,15-16 - I think this is an example of his solving a Qabalistic problem at this automatic or inspired level.

This example of Had is a reason I can't agree with princediamond's requirement that the solution should be clear to "anyone". The solution to Had=11 (since "My number is 11, as all their numbers who are of us") demands a lot of "intellectual" work, in particular a deep acquaintance with the GD Tarot attributions and their reasoning. Nuit as 11 required a "trick" as well - Theosophical Addition (NV =56; 5+6=11); Ra-Hoor-Khuit is just easy - his name has 11 letters. But "Hadit" or "Had" just doesn't work on those levels.

He is not "The Empress (Daleth=4) and the King (Heh=5)", which results in 9, his number "by the fools" (dimwits). So it seems that, like in I,57 when the mention of the House of God brought to mind (instaneously) the letter Peh, then it followed with Tzaddi, which for some reason threw a wrench into the works - it is not the Star! - the mention of the Fool(s) brought to mind Aleph, and then Lamed (as natural follower and complement), with Justice and the number 8, which of course changes places with XI in the GD Tarot order (traditional Tarot has Strength as XI and Justice as VIII). But "Heh" is still "the King", and IV by Tarot, but the Hierophant is "V" by Tarot, and the Empress III, so together they are VIII (Lamed-Justice-XI), which is switchable with XI (Teth-Strength-VIII) in the GD Tarot. (it also seems to me that the "H" of Hierophant stands in for "Heh", so that the Hierophant, although Vav in Tarot, now gives the word Had a hybrid English-Hebrew spelling - Hד (H-Daleth)).

Too intellectual? I didn't make it up - that's Crowley's explanation, and it is a clear indication of the methods his mind used at top speed, instinctively, in this writing.

(more later)

I estimate it took about 2 minutes for Crowley to write vv. 69 to 76 (to the end of "the numbers and the words", not the whole verse). So I figured there might a way to test at least part of the theory that there is no true randomness in human choices, even when attempting to be random.

Call it the "Two-minute test".

The subject is given some blank pages and asked to clear their mind as much as possible. Then, for one minute and 45 seconds, write whatever comes into their heads, their inner dialogue, stream of consciousness, whatever. Tell them that it doesn't matter what it is, and you won't require reading it unless the person allows it. You might only be interested in the last few words, phrase, or sentence, if necessary. At 1:45, say "numbers and letters" - tell them beforehand that you will be doing this - and have them write a string of numbers and letters in any way, singly or in groups, as quickly as possible, as many as possible, for 15 seconds. Then you will say "stop".

The person obviously should not know Crowley much or at all, or at least have no clue about II,76.

I have only tested one subject so far, my wife, and her results were -

"6 AB 2565 A 26666747 C D E"

The last phrase of her 60 words was "But it's too hot and I'm too lazy. Boy that". The last sentence was unfinished and she began writing the numbers and letters.

She noted that it was good that the stream of consciousness writing came first, since it left the mind open and relaxed when the numbers and letters came to be written; there was no thinking about them beforehand (don't count the time to the subject).

She attaches no particular symbolism or associations with numbers and letters.

She had no explanation for her choices. She said 6 isn't even her favourite number (that's 5).

Why so many 6s? Perhaps because "feels good to write".

Early letters because "couldn't imagine starting 'deep in the alphabet', like with Q".

I would be interesting to see others do this experiment or a form of it, keeping us apprised of the method used and the results.

Obviously it is not possible to recreate the conditions of the Cairo Working, but with enough data we might be able to see the kinds of patterns and reasons people have when making quasi-random strings of numbers and letters.

I should add that this single example of my wife's response gives a good example of how easy it is to read into things - she mentions the Sun and heat a few times (it was a hot sunny day), and if I hadn't known her at all, I might jump to the conclusion that 6 represents the Sun. She of course makes no such association, even on an unconscious level I have to imagine. I never mention it, and it is not part of general knowledge.

How do you keep a Qabalist busy for years? Toss a bunch of random numbers and letters into a text, and call it holy.

The verse has helped to foster some beautiful Qabalahs, and some very useful ones, though.

Dwtw

If the field is a muddled mess, it's because plenty of qabalisits left it that way. My purpose was not to winnow the results down - Ive done that for myself, and others can too. My purpose was to do a survey. I gave my opinions on each, but the facts are there for everyone else to come to their own conclusions.

*child of the prophet*, standards are needed that narrow the field of solutions to the riddle in verse II:76 of

*Liber L*if progress is to be made in determining his identity. By implementing stringent criterion, most of the solutions so-called are eliminated ipso facto. ...

Personally, i think the 'Child' was Fr. Achad. The fact that he seems to have screwed up is not a disqualification. The one to 'follow' and 'expound' is obviously a different person, since Achad did not do that (assuming this prophecy is going to come true - that's a big IF). Still, an approach toward criteria is a good idea.

I bother because it's an historical survey. Somebody could do a survey of all the ideas floated during Holycram and find lots of crap there - including mine. Hell, I made a rookie mistake just a couple days ago, and I've been at this for two decades. This is the curse of putting things on the Internet.

If I have misrepresented your solution, then I will amend it in the update; thanks for pointing this out.

I don't dispute that street numbers and the like pertaining to you are found with the Tahuti Key. I only question the odds. And it's fair to ask how many other people this could relate to, or how unusual the result is. It's quite possible that finding the Tahuti Key was a bit like the Higgs boson, it had to be there or the Standard Model failed, just as your name had to be in the Cipher for your model to succeed. For all I know, CERN created the Higgs out of pure wish-fulfillment, and you gravitated toward a gematria that would leo create what you wanted to find.

Also, if it were up to the solver to decide that they had 'successfully' gotten the solution, then everybody would be right. And if they are, then your special case is ingenious but not unique. If they aren't all correct, then surely it is up to others to decide if you have actually solved it?

Still, I can see what you mean that of the thousands interested in AL, how many align with those numbers? OK, fair enough, so try this on for size. It wasn't until I messed with the Greek stuff this week that I bothered to enumerate my last name in Greek. I had always done it in Hebrew, even before I ever heard of Crowley, and there it adds to 143.

But in Greek, GILLIS is 283. Now using the TEQ Gematria, the very first verse of the book is the same number:

1. Had! the manifestation of Nuit. = 283

Even better, the number 1 is the value of the letter L, so in effect the first verse translates as L. 283 = L. Gillis.

On top of that, the hexagram of 283 is made up of the letter E trigram under the letter O trigram. So in effect L. 283 also spells L-E-O. Now of those few thousand people you're talking about, how many of them match up to that verse? And do you think the above is conclusive of anything about me and my relation to Liber AL? I don't think it is for me to say one way or the other; all I can do is present the facts, much as you have done in your own analysis. And this is not a case of 'mine is better than yours'; it's a case of similar kinds of results cropping up - so what are we to make of them?

*Signature Solutions*. I introduce it here for the first time: it's called

*The Gematrikon Solution*

Great, I look forward to reading it. This thread has already produced some interesting speculations; there's always room for more.

Litlluw

RLG

This is so because no one actually knows how the riddle was constructed. If it was just some random writing of Crowley in the middle of the MS, or what. And, if it is indeed some kind of riddle or cipher, no one really knows which system and values were used to create it. Due to the circumstance of Crowley saying not even he knew, the exact answer or cipher can never be known. For even if one devises the 'correct answer', there is still no way to check the legitimacy of that answer.

So, the question is hollow, and has no direct point or ending. There will be as many 'ciphers' are there are those who will endeavor to create/uncover one.

Dwtw

I agree for the most part. It seems the design makes it 'almost' impossible, if not actually so, to solve it conclusively. I can only imagine three scenarios where it will be indisputable:

1: - The glyphs reveal a message that says in effect, you've found the secret message. Then the real 'meaning' of the glyphs might simply be the method used to discover the message.

2: - The glyphs reveal a pattern that somehow ends up making the string of glyphs itself the answer - the ultimate in recursive thinking. Again, this may prove that the real meaning is the method used to get the result.

3: - The glyphs somehow create a pure equation whose derivation is beyond dispute, and whose answer is equally so. This would not only prove the method correct, but the answer would have to be meaningful as well.

#3 is what I tried to approach with my solution that started this thread. The first part of the equation is certainly beyond dispute; the second half with the derivation of the letter-values is what is contentious. But they originally came from Crowley, and if they're correct, then the whole Book is tied together by the equation. That certainly transcends any limited message those 28 glyphs can create. Essentially, my equation is saying that the glyphs are a check-sum for the entire document.

All of this, however, does not prevent the glyphs from having meaning for anyone attempting to crack them open. If nothing else, it exposes all the crazy methods of exegesis we qabalists can come up with. So i agree with your last statement. There may be innumerable possibilities.

Litlluw

RLG

Call it the "Two-minute test". ..

Dwtw

This whole idea is very worthwhile. I hope some others can try it out. It's always to good to remember the actual manuscript, and how it got that way.

Each man is a prophet to his own god.

I take the 'words' and 'numbers' (AL II v76) to be a variable, to stand in as a meaningless (to anyone else) name or glyph to act as a container to house the nature of the prophet's True Will/true nature. But also the prophet's own qabalah, unique to himself.

There cometh one to follow thee: he shall expound it (HadIT or the NOT or the Word)

That is the HGA. The HGA is to be relied upon solely.

...

4 6 3 8 A B K 2 4 A L G M O R 3 Y X 24 89 R P S T O V A L represents (for me) the Word / True Will of each individual. It is nonsensical (can not be known) to anyone but the individual.

Perhaps, the corollary of this observation is that each suggested solution forms part of each individual's own qabalah.

Excellent post that seems to overlap some other ideas presented here about the wealth of possibilities.

Litluw

RLG

IIRC you (i.e. RLG) stated that the grid found in Liber AL was drawn in later. Do you know who drew the grid, and roughly when it was drawn?

Cheers,

Markus

Dwtw

abn53 would be the man for that info. IIRC it was sometime around 1925. It most certainly was not in the first publication of the 'original in the writing of the Beast' found in the Equinox.

Litlluw

RLG

Dwtw

I read the latest Tahuti Key solution, and it seems elegant. The Hebrew transliteration of S and T are of course variable, and poor little letter X is left out in the cold, but you didn't jump through hoops to get the result. I confess that I've never tried a notariqon approach, but it seems worth looking into.

The first criteria requires that standard qabalistic techniques be used to produce solutions to the riddles without inventing techniques that serve the sole purpose of producing solutions. The author of Liber L was free to include whatever he deemed necessary in the book; if his goal is to see the riddles solved, he will have designed them using techniques known at the time the book was dictated.

I agree that methods created just to solve the 28 glyphs are illegitimate. However, I think new methods might be used that also solve other aspects of AL; since Aiwass supposedly can prophesy the future regarding a follower, he must also know what methods that person will use, and may have deliberately encoded things so only that person could discover them.

I agree with this in regard to the English Alphabet, insofar as efforts in that direction should conform to II:55; but clearly we can't expect that if Hebrew, Greek or Arabic are involved.

This is all sensible. I would add that the cherry on top is to identify why the 28 glyphs are in that particular order. The order may or may not be important, but if it is, the 'real' solution will explain why it is. But I'll still eat the sundae without the cherry.

This one I have problems with only because the Child mentioned elsewhere may not be the same Follower related to this verse. For example, what if the Cipher was a set of geographic coordinates? or simply an explication of the Death theme so prominent in the prior verses? It may be so narrowly focused that it doesn't relate to much of the rest of the Book. Or it may relate to the whole Book, as the TEG solution does.

This is by far the toughest nut to crack. Just as an example, the name Markus = 567 in Hebrew letters, so is he related to the puzzle of 61, 8, 80, 418? We don't know the method needed to solve the 28 glyphs, nor do we even know what the content is supposed to be. So it is far from certain whether an identity will be garnered from it. Yes, it would be nice if the identity was verifiable, but I don't think that's a given.

As far as identity goes, doesn't it stand to reason that the if the Follower 'expounds' the solution that carries 'immediate conviction', then ipso facto their identity is proven at the same time? Or are you saying that showing an identity is part of expounding with 'immediate conviction'? I think one could provide the solution and not be named in the Cipher, but could one be named in the Cipher and not provide the solution?

For example, someone else could have come up with the TQ gematria, like Norman Mudd. It uses AC's letter-attributions after all. But the first verse would still be equal to my name in Greek, even if I never read Liber AL. And there are surely other people with the first initial L and a last name that equals 283. But so far, I'm the only one who noticed the connection, because I study the book. So perhaps the trigrammaton of L-E-O is simply the import of the first verse, making it somehow relate to that zodiac sign, Tarot, etc. without having anything to do with me personally. Still, it IS pretty strange that someone with that given name was the first to notice it, don't you think? Those kinds of odds can't even be calculated. Just like it's pretty strange that someone who took the time to investigate the least-value English gematria ends up finding his name and address in the Cipher with it.

Suffice to say that the criteria for finding an identity should be just as stringent as that applied to the Cipher as a whole.

Litlluw

RLG

76’ 4’ 6’ 3’ 8’ 2’ 4’ 3’ 24’ 89’ = 992 = 76 4 6 3 8 A B K 2 4 A L G M O R 3 Y X 24 89 R P S T O V A L = 31[sup:32vu8cto]st[/sup:32vu8cto] rectangular number = 31 x 32 = AL 31[sup:32vu8cto]2[/sup:32vu8cto]

Being the sum of the first 31 even numbers, 992 is the 31[sup:32vu8cto]st[/sup:32vu8cto] rectangular number, one of a number of types of figurate numbers ( triangular, square … ) important to the Pythagoreans.

Dropping the number 76 the simple sum of “the numbers & the words” equals the sum of the squares of their first number and last letter,

4 6 3 8 A B K 2 4 A L G M O R 3 Y X 24 89 R P S T O V A L = 916 = 4[sup:32vu8cto]2[/sup:32vu8cto] + L[sup:32vu8cto]2[/sup:32vu8cto]

If we sum the numbers & the finals spelling in full of the words it equals the sum of the squares of their first number & last number

4 6 3 8 A B K 2 4 A L G M O R 3 Y X 24 89 R P S T O V A L = 7937 = 4[sup:32vu8cto]2[/sup:32vu8cto] + 89[sup:32vu8cto]2[/sup:32vu8cto]

In the last two cases then the square root of the respective sum is the hypothenuse of a right triangle

These three identities use sub-structure to reference total structure, although the structure is very simple, and remains internal to the “numbers & the words”. The finals spelling in full of “the words” alone references lexicological structure of the text also quite simple although in part external to “the numbers & the words”, for it equals the number of alpha-numeric characters including verse number characters which span from the end of the first word of the second chapter to the beginning of the first word of the third chapter

A B K A L G M O R Y X R P S T O V A L = 7794 = Nu-Abrahadabra Alpha-Numeric Characters

These identities reference the structure of the work itself and need not be other than formal indications of identity. In measuring a static structure like a monument or a textual work explicitly characterized as embodying literal Qabalistic structure, outside of semantic identities of concepts internal or external to the work, the only touchstone is the actual mathematical and lexicological structure of the work. It is for this reason that the literal Qabalistic analysis at work here always references the latter in addition to its references to key concepts of Qabalah external to the text, and identities within the text. If we break the numbers & words into groups of numbers & words, their finals sum using beginning capital A's, equals the names of the letters

4 6 3 8 ÄBK 2 4 ÄLGMOR 3 YX 24 89 RPSTOVAL = 3394 = ABKALGMORYXRPSTOVAL

It is possible to derive the Hebrew Tree of Life from the first 27 numbers & words of the cipher by including all 27 Hebrew letters in the sum of its Alphabet. These 27 Hebrew letters equal ADM x 111, which when added to the 2868 sum of the 10 Sephiroth equals the sum of the first 27 numbers and letters spelled in full

4 6 3 8 A B K 2 4 A L G M O R 3 Y X 24 89 R P S T O V A = 7863 = 10 Sephiroth of Tree of Life & 27 Letters of Hebrew Alphabet

If the final L is also spelled in full as LMD - and read as the verb to Study or as the directive article L joined to the verb MD - To Measure, then this particular reading of the cipher is simply an injunction to Study or Measure the Tree of Life - which in the modern world is accomplished not primarily through the Hebrew of the Tree of Life - but through Art and Science.

Reading alpha-numerically, and spelling in full, the cipher equals verses 3 to 7 of the first chapter without verse numbers

4 6 3 8 A B K 2 4 A L G M O R 3 Y X 2 4 8 9 R P S T O V A L = 7847 = AL I 3-7

The first four numbers of the cipher equal in value the 4 letters of the four gates or paths which enter the Supernals of the Tree of Life – Daleth, Vau, Gimel, Cheth – with all their attributions. One of the meanings of Daleth is Door or Gate. The product of these letters, as remarked by Rama, equals 24[sup:32vu8cto]2[/sup:32vu8cto].

The sum of the first six numbers & words 4 6 3 8 A B = 24, and their product equals 1152 = 24[sup:32vu8cto]2[/sup:32vu8cto] + 24[sup:32vu8cto]2[/sup:32vu8cto], the square of the hypothenuse of a right triangle whose legs each equal 24.

These first 6 numbers & words when read as letter values are 6 paths which unite the first 6 sephiroth of the Tree of Life – the hexagram Kether, Hokmah, Binah, Hesed, Geburah, Tipharath.

The names of the first two letters equal the names of the first two rivers of Eden ALP BYTh = 523 = PhYShVN GYChVN

If we sum the numbers as letters the first six equal the number of years in the Egyptian Sothic cycle

Daleth Vau Gimel Cheth Aleph Beth = 1460 = 4 * 365 = Days in Leap Year Cycle

The first seven letter/numbers = Daleth Vau Gimel Cheth Aleph Beth Caph = 1560 – the product of the name inscribed on the Star of the XVIIth Atu of Thoth and the Name of its Letter. These 7 letter/numbers are paths of the first seven Sephiroth of the Tree of Life.

The value, if any, of the above as a Qabalistic analysis along the "regular pattern" can really only be evaluated in light of the 'magical' alphabet employed to analyse it, and its application to other key passages of the text, the cluster of verse I 46, those of the second & third chapters, first verses, global sums, and the like.

JG

Dwtw

Excellent post, as usual. Lots of interesting things. I had forgotten about rectangular (pronic) numbers. So that nicely works the number 31 into the mix.

The part about the 27 Hebrew letters and Tree is intriguing; this may explain why the final letter L is set off more than the rest of the letters in the ms. It also supports Stein's use of the letter Lamed twice in his Quantum Tree solution.

Litlluw

RLG

Dwtw

Jamie's question about 'listening' to the numbers and words reminded me of an old idea. Since the Cipher was dictated, Crowley must have heard the names of the numbers, such as four, six, etc. So perhaps the number-names also provide some insight into the Cipher?

The number 89 is significant not only for being the 24th prime, but for being a Fibonacci number. As we know, each successive pair of these approximates the Phi ratio of 1.618034. Well the first four numbers 4+6+3+8 sum to 21, also a Fibonacci number, the next one being 34. This pair gives us the ratio 34 / 21 = 1.61904, only .00101 away from the Golden Number.

In the Trigrammaton Gematria, the letters of the Cipher sum to 208, plus the numbers 143 total 351. The number-names equal 61 + 21 + 52 + 36 + 27 + 61 + 52 + 142 + 115 = 567. This of course is the sum of the numbers in verse I:46, viz. 61 + 8 + 80 + 418. But more importantly for the present purpose is the fact that 567 = 21 x 27.

Now if we add the gematria of the number-names to the total of the Cipher, we get 567 + 351 = 918. Note that 918 = 34 x 27. So when we look for the Golden Ratio, we find it easily: 918 / 567 = 1.61904, precisely the same ratio as 34 / 21, since the numbers involved are multiples of them. Taking it a step further, the ratio of 567 / 351 is the same as that of the Fibonacci pair 21 / 13, though this is less accurate, since the Fibonacci pairs get closer to the Golden Ratio as the numbers increase.

Thus we can say conclusively that the ratio of the whole Cipher to the number-names, and the ratio of the number-names to the whole Cipher plus the number-names, is the Phi Ratio. But we can only get there by adding in the words that Crowley heard while he was listening to 'the numbers and the words'.

13 x 27 = 351 = 4 6 3 8 AB K 2 4 A L G M O R 3 Y X 24 89 R P S T O V A L.

21 x 27 = 567 = Four + Six + Three + Eight + Two + Four + Three + Twenty-four + Eighty-nine

34 x 27 = 918 = the sum of the above

This ratio is perhaps reinforced by the fact that the remainder of verse II:76, i.e., everything from "What meaneth this…glad word." = 2268 = 4 x 567, precisely four times the value of the number-names. And as if to reinforce the legitimacy of using these names, the significant number 'twenty-four' has the gematria of 142, and the Cipher is the 142nd verse of the Law.

On a related note, summing the numbers and the number-names of the Cipher results in 143 + 567 = 710; this is the entirety of verse II:73, found on the Cipher page:

710 = Ah! Ah! Death! Death! thou shalt long for death. Death is forbidden, o man, unto thee.

710 also has another interesting feature - it equals 5 x 142, and 142 in turn equals the gematria of 'twenty-four'. So symbolically 5 x 24 = 120, which could lead us to ON. But for now, let's just say that this 5 x 24 symbolizes the five times that 24 is indicated in the numbers of the Cipher, whose values, plus their names, equals 710. I think that wraps this whole thing up quite Hermetically.

Litlluw

RLG

I don't know how this will affect your thinking, RLG, but from what I can tell Crowley insisted the number 1 was a prime number, making 89 the 25th prime, not the 24th.

In the "Table of Factors" in *Sepher Sephiroth*, including prime numbers, 1 is listed as such. In the dictionary of *Sepher Sephiroth*, he puts the prime number symbol *π* (pi) to indicate 1 is a prime, and in the "Brief Essay Upon... The Magical Alphabet" (*777 and Other Qabalistic Writings*, Weiser, 1973, p. xxii), Crowley says "... the numbers 0, 1, 2, 3, 5, and 7 are primes."

With 0 (zero) as a prime, 89 is even the 26th prime.

It's clear that 2, 4 and 24 are important, (the 2 as duality is implicit throughout the NW ("Numbers and Words")), x as the 24th letter might be suggested, etc. The GD 5=6 Ritual develops the 120 symbolism quite fully (including 5x24 and 1x2x3x4x5), and Crowley's commentary on it in *Equinox* I,3 (pp. 210ff) develops it much, much further. But is there any reason to think that Crowley thought of 89 as the 24th prime?

I tend to think that 89 meant to Crowley in the NW what it meant to him in the Qabalistic Dictionary - Silence, Shut Up, Body. See Liber CCCXXXIII Chapter 89 commentary for a good discussion of it. It is the "end", the embodiment to which he has tended in the NW, and which the final eightfold word of Had RPSTOVAL "redeems".

I hope to get a few more results from experiment this weekend (it is not so easy to find suitable people, or suitable people in the right situations).

In the meantime, I know it's stupid methodology to generalize from a single instance, but I think my wife's result - 6 AB 2565 A 26666747 C D E - in comparison with Crowley's in II,76, might suggest that a mind devoid of symbolic associations and trying to be random will result in strings of the same symbol for a time (the four 6s, the attempt to break it with 7, then 4, then back to 7, then bored with that and on to letters), whereas the lack of that in Crowley shows a mind at work trying to say something with those symbols.

I think that symbolic mind, the calculating mind on "autopilot", is that part of himself Crowley heard as Aiwass, and that one part of the string of numbers and letters shows Crowley's more normal mind breaking in once, ever so slightly, with the distinct second "a", which is the way he signed his name at the time and seems to be his predominant form of the capital letter (compare II,37-44 and 69). He seems ambivalent about which form to use, though, sometimes.

My *ad hoc* theory is that the sharp A is the distinct, commanding voice of Aiwass, while the round capital a is a more muted and less sure voice, less Aiwass and more Crowley as aleister and perhaps achiha ("a" is certainly his favourite letter, as he played with it (including forms with "al") for much of his life - from Alick to Alastor, identifying with Ankh-f-n-Khonsu, Al-A'in, Alain Lutiy, Al-Istar, Alys, Al-Qahar, Al-Malik, etc.).

In the context of NW (as I call the "Numbers and the Words"), then, with other considerations to be posted later, this appearance of "a" suggests that, to be useful in a meditative-ritual context, the magician (the King "who desires death much") should substitute his own letter here. So in my case, the 6-letter word aLGMOR would read RLGMOR (R for Ross).

*777 and Other Qabalistic Writings*, Weiser, 1973, p. xxii), Crowley says "... the numbers 0, 1, 2, 3, 5, and 7 are primes."

With 0 (zero) as a prime, 89 is even the 26th prime.

It's clear that 2, 4 and 24 are important, (the 2 as duality is implicit throughout the NW ("Numbers and Words")), x as the 24th letter might be suggested, etc. The GD 5=6 Ritual develops the 120 symbolism quite fully (including 5x24 and 1x2x3x4x5), and Crowley's commentary on it in *Equinox* I,3 (pp. 210ff) develops it much, much further. But is there any reason to think that Crowley thought of 89 as the 24th prime?

I tend to think that 89 meant to Crowley in the NW what it meant to him in the Qabalistic Dictionary - Silence, Shut Up, Body. See Liber CCCXXXIII Chapter 89 commentary for a good discussion of it. It is the "end", the embodiment to which he has tended in the NW, and which the final eightfold word of Had RPSTOVAL "redeems".

Dwtw

Yes, he definitely thought 1 was a prime, as that was common for the period. Modern mathematics doesn't see it that way, for specific reasons. I'm not sure how important it is that Crowley thought it the 25th prime, (or 26th); nor am I sure that it's important to consider that he related it to being 'shut up' etc. We have to consider that the verse immediately goes on to state that Crowley does not know the meaning of the glyphs, nor will he ever know. So if that is the case, he could reflect all he wanted to on the fact that 89 in S.S means 'shut up, silence', etc. but that wouldn't give him the meaning.

As a matter of fact, taking that concept to its logical conclusion, it could be said that of all the things that 89 means, 'silence, shut up' etc. are precisely what is NOT indicated in the cipher - because that's what Crowley would think it meant.

Likewise, if he thought 89 was the 25th prime, he would clearly miss the 'meaning' of 89 on that level, because it is really the 24th prime. So his ignorance of a more modern view of mathematical functions would preclude him from knowing the import of that 89. So it actually makes *more sense *in terms of the verse that AC would consider 89 the 25th prime, thus insuring he would never know its meaning.; or t least that level of its meaning that is germane to my consideration that 5 x 24 = 120.

Of course, if I'm wrong and 89 is not the 24th prime, or being the 24th prime has nothing to do with its function in the cipher, there is still the 'X' next to the 24, which can be considered the 5th (veiled) reference to 24.

Now I know some advocates of 'annihilation' will claim that AC really understood the cipher as Not or Naught, since "Thou knowest not." and because of that negation, he actually did know what the cipher meant. If that is the case, then the solution I offered to begin this thread is the best candidate for the 'real' answer, since it is the only one (that I'm aware of) that accomplishes reducing the cipher to Zero. Yes, others have said the cipher 'doesn't mean anything', or 'has no meaning', but no one else has claimed it equals Zero.

Is it possible he could both know the meaning and not know it? I don't think so. But he could know it, and know it 'not'. As always, the trick wording of AL can be a minefield, and turn any idea on its head. That's partly why there are four ordeals to understanding this Law.

If 1 is not a prime, then the sum of the 24 primes from 2 to 89 = 963

This number is famous as being Unity (AChaD) spelled in full: Alef-Lamed-Peh / Chet-Yod-Tau / Dalet-Lamed-Tau

The numeration of the *The Treasure House Of Images* is Liber 963, so this number was important and well-known to Crowley. And it spells out the name of his 'child' 🙂

But the Achad referenced by 89 could also indicate the 'one to follow thee' who shall 'expound it'. Not Frater Achad, but that the interpretation of 89 as the 24th prime (not the 25th), would be part of expounding the cipher.

if we include 1 (and 0), then the total is 964, which is far less interesting - the name of Metatron, and of something called a "memorial of jubilation"?

If, however, AC's Greek gematria dictionary was good enough, he would know that 964 in Greek is the phrase

AI EPTA KEPhALAI = The Seven Heads (of the Beast).

If this is indeed the import of 89 as the last in the string of primes starting with 1, then I expect that the solution to the cipher includes 7 sections that are cognate with the heads of the Beast. This is certainly not far fetched, when you consider all the references to the beast i already found using Greek gematria methods.

So I have no doubt you're right, AC thought 89 was the 25th or 26th prime. And he may have even added them all up in an attempt to decipher these glyphs. If 1 is not a prime, we still get a significant result with 963, but in a different sacred tongue.

Litlluw

RLG

Just to throw it out there, RPSTOVAL could spell a Hebrew phrase -

RP "Terror"

ST (reading Shin Tav) "Seth"

O - Ayin (with all its associations)

VAL - "and God"

"Terror of Set, Devil and God" or

"Terror of Set, 0 (Nothing) and God"

etc. (for preferred reading of Ayin)

I wasn't comfortable that Crowley would use the Vav as "and", even subconsciously (thereby sort of "thinking" in Hebrew), but I note that he has the phrase "Aba ve-Ama" - "Father and Mother" - under 52 in the dictionary, so he could have used it as such.

Note also, more generally, that taking the Tarot values of ABK - 0+I+X = 11; ALGMOR - 0+VIII+II+XII+XV+XIX = 56;

RPSTOVAL has five readings, depending on S as Samekh or Shin, T as Teth or Tav, and L as VIII or XI (Crowley could switch them, as in Tarot, as needed).

Reading Resh, Peh, Samekh, Teth, Ayin, Vav, Aleph, Lamed =

XIX+XVI+XIV+VIII(XI)+XV+V+0+XI(VIII) = **88**, 8x11

(the other values are 94, 98, 101 and 107)

I tend to prefer this to the Hebrew phrase explanation, since it is Had's "just" number multiplied by 11, which is a fitting close to the phrase.

I leave the letters as they are written since they are actually listed as words in all English dictionaries, and sum the names of the 68 letters of the numbers & the words

four six three eight A B K two four A L G M O R three Y X twenty-four eighty-nine R P S T O V A L = 10602

Notice two easy discernable appearances of the number 68 which Crowley evidently left as bread crumbs when he designed and executed the writing of the manuscript of the Book of the Law

[/align:16sh1oii]

The first occurence is interleaved in the writing of the 4 6 3 8 creating two new numbers 43 and 68 which equal 111 one of the base numbers of Crowley's literal Qabalah. The second follows from reading the curly cues above and below 24 and 89 as "comic" graphics' prompts to rotate the numbers. Remembering the 24 of the first word of the rotation of the manuscript at verse I 16 ( which verse by the way Leo equals το θηριον κοκκινον an appropriate commentary on the verse which precedes it ) we can then read the inverted series X 24 89 as 68 For X, which 418 letter of art is exactly how the letter X is transliterated in the Key of B in accordance with the final verse of Liber B vel Magi. The number 68 as the value of the unknown variable X ( in this system ) then doubles down as the actual number of letters of the cipher when the numbers are spelled through their names. Although as a general rule I do not spell out the numbers, in this instance we can make an exception.

It is possible to relate the sum of the numbers and words above, 10602, to the first Fibonacci number with a prime subscript which itself is not prime, Fibonacci[sub:16sh1oii]19[/sub:16sh1oii] = 4181 = 37 * 24 89, by remembering that the number of words, ampersands, and number characters in AL I II = 4181, and the number of words, ampersands, and number & circle squared characters in AL III = 2147

AL · 666 · 2147 ÷ 4181 = 10602 = 4 6 3 8 A B K 2 4 A L G M O R 3 Y X 24 89 R P S T O V A L = 31 · 666 · AL III ÷ AL I II

So by this method of the names of the numbers, the names of the letters ( Liber 777 Column II ) of the numbers & the words equal the product of the nickname of the author of the text, and his maternal number nickname, and the word/number character ratio of the three chapters of the chap's magnum opus, his "Cross" and "Calvary." ( EOG 7 1 ) In this last respect observe the identity of the finals spelling of the names of the letters of the cipher and its rectification with a gospel verse ( evidently Crowley was brain washed in youth with the Old & New Testament - so you may conceive this writing as a washing out of the grime and an examining of the despised *prima materia* ) Matthew 10:38 from the Scrivener1894 Textus Receptus

A B K A L G M O R Y X R P S T O V A L = 7794 = καὶ ὃς οὐ λαμβάνει τὸν σταυρὸν αὐτοῦ καὶ ἀκολουθεῖ ὀπίσω μου, οὐκ ἔστι μου ἄξιος

Here the rectification of the rose cross is simply the Nu-Abrahadabra alpha-numeric character measure. The first part of the verse ὃς οὐ λαμβάνει τὸν σταυρὸν αὐτοῦ καὶ ἀκολουθεῖ ὀπίσω μου = 5907 the number of words, numbers, and ampersands of AL excluding verse numbers. Are we to think that Crowley explicity embodied this non-cross bearing as one of the ultimate numbers of AL when he created his book? In the sceptical words of the Nasadiya Sukta of the Rig Veda

कॊ ।आद्धा वॆद क।इह प्रवॊचत् कुत ।आअजाता कुत ।इयं विसृष्टि: ।

अर्वाग्दॆवा ।आस्य विसर्जनॆनाथाकॊ वॆद यत ।आबभूव ॥६॥

But, after all, who knows, and who can say

Whence it all came, and how creation happened?

the gods themselves are later than creation,

so who knows truly whence it has arisen?

इयं विसृष्टिर्यत ।आबभूव यदि वा दधॆ यदि वा न ।

यॊ ।आस्याध्यक्ष: परमॆ व्यॊमन्त्सॊ आंग वॆद यदि वा न वॆद ॥७॥

Whence all creation had its origin,

he, whether he fashioned it or whether he did not,

he, who surveys it all from highest heaven,

he knows - or maybe even he does not know.

As an amusing aside in reference to the sum of the first 27 numbers & words of the cipher equal the 10 Numbers & 27 Hebrew Letters of the Tree of Life, the idea of finding your name and address in the cipher as a *sine qua non* of deciphering AL, ought not to be laughed at, for a further identity of this 27 lettered Tree of Life and the first 27 numbers & words is Revelation 20:15 "And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire"

4 6 3 8 A B K 2 4 A L G M O R 3 Y X 24 89 R P S T O V A = 7863 = καὶ εἴ τις οὐχ εὑρέθη ἐν τῇ βίβλῳ τῆς ζωῆς γεγραμμένος, ἐβλήθη εἰς τὴν λίμνην τοῦ πυρός[/font:16sh1oii]·

The Greek sum above from the Scrivener edition includes the two tiny iotas which appear under the Eta and the Omega of τῇ βίβλῳ - The Book.

Since 2147 is also the finals sum of the 9 Letters א ד ג ט ל ן ף ר ת[/font:16sh1oii] of the 777 Flaming Sword of the Tree of Life, and 666 is the value of the Hebrew of Genesis III "And the Flaming Sword" these ideas can be worked into the product ( see the Ritual said to be recited prior to writing the work where many of the essential Qabalistic ideas of Abrahadabra and the Flaming Sword designed into the text are sketched out )

וְאֵת לַהַט הַחֶרֶב[/font:16sh1oii] = 666

Interestingly, the phrase immediately preceding in the text "And He placed at the East of Eden" equals the value of the Golden Dawn Flaming Sword

וַיַּשְׁכֵּן מִקֶּדֶם לְגַן-עֵדֶן[/font:16sh1oii] = 777

The 666 & 777 "Flaming Swords" which trace the aright and averse paths of the Tree of Life ( numbers of CCXX = 233 = עֵץ הַחַיִּים[/font:16sh1oii] = Tree of Life/Lives ) appear not only prominently in the structure of the Key of B of Alphabet of AL, but also in Genesis I where it is written concerning the creation of the macrocosm "Let there be Lights in the Expanse of the Heaven"

666 = יְהִי מְאֹרֹת[/font:16sh1oii] - "Let there be Lights"

777 = בִּרְקִיעַ הַשָּׁמַיִם[/font:16sh1oii] - "In the Expanse of the Heaven"

In the song of Willie

*Brother johnHave you seen the homeless daughtersStanding thereWith broken wingsI have seen the flaming swordsThere over east of edenBurning in the eyes of the makerBurning in the eyes of the makerBurning in the eyes of the makerBurning in the eyes of the makerOh river rise from your sleep*

The number 89 is significant not only for being the 24th prime, but for being a Fibonacci number. As we know, each successive pair of these approximates the Phi ratio of 1.618034. Well the first four numbers 4+6+3+8 sum to 21, also a Fibonacci number, the next one being 34. This pair gives us the ratio 34 / 21 = 1.61904, only .00101 away from the Golden Number.

Thus we can say conclusively that the ratio of the whole Cipher to the number-names, and the ratio of the number-names to the whole Cipher plus the number-names, is the Phi Ratio. But we can only get there by adding in the words that Crowley heard while he was listening to 'the numbers and the words'.

13 x 27 = 351 = 4 6 3 8 AB K 2 4 A L G M O R 3 Y X 24 89 R P S T O V A L.

21 x 27 = 567 = Four + Six + Three + Eight + Two + Four + Three + Twenty-four + Eighty-nine

34 x 27 = 918 = the sum of the above

If you remember the ordinal values of the letters of Trigrammaton also have a relation to the golden ratio, and the cipher, where the letter of the golden ratio actually appears written in the manuscript of the verse of the cipher

[/align:16sh1oii]

As one can see the "o" of "o chosen one" looks like the Greek letter ϕ as it has a vertical curving line drawn through it. The ordinal Trigrammaton sum corresponding to the trinary or ternary sum of 267,696, using the identical letters and numbers is 304,377. If we take advantage of the "chance shape" of the letter "o" and read it as the letter "o" with a little number one drawn through it, the ordinal sum will equal 304,378. Now following a similar methodology of dividing numbers & words by numbers alone, we will divide the complete sum of numbers and words by the ordinal sum of the English letters through the letter "o" of "o chosen one" which equals 188116 and we get

304378 ÷ 188116 = 1.618034 = ϕ = golden ratio accurately rounded to 7 digits = AL 220 ÷ AL English Letter ϕ = ϕ

Another chance shape of a letter in the cipher itself mirrors less accurately the identical division. Using ordinal Trigrammaton the cipher equals 376, however, let us add the little upright line which appears to written attached to the K of "ABK" in the manuscript as equaling the number 1, then the total sum will be 377 the 14th Fibonacci number, the sum of the letters equals 233 the 13th Fibonacci number, and the sum of numbers will be 144 the 12th Fibonacci number, so that

4 6 3 8 A B K1 2 4 A L G M O R 3 Y X 24 89 R P S T O V A L ÷ A B K A L G M O R Y X R P S T O V A L = 377 ÷ 233 ~ 233 ÷ 144 = A B K A L G M O R Y X R P S T O V A L ÷ 4 6 3 8 1 2 4 3 24 89 ~ ϕ

This golden ratio derivation is one of the principle global derivations of AL using the ordinal values of Trigrammaton; they also derive PI in a couple of ways.

On the topic of the smallest prime see the essay WHAT IS THE SMALLEST PRIME? where the authors write "There does not appear to be any period of time during which most mathematicians deﬁned one to be a prime".

You already beat me to the punch of sharing the sum of the first 24 primes equaling 963 the spelling in full of Unity אחד[/font:16sh1oii], the adopted name of the "magic kid" of Crowley. There are a few other choice 963 identities. It is the spelling in full of the name of the first letter spelled in full, and it also equals the first clause of Genesis I 4 "And the Gods saw that the Light was good"

א = אחד = וַיַּרְא אֱלֹהִים אֶת-הָאוֹר, כִּי-טוֹב[/font:16sh1oii]

JG

Dwtw

As a means of communing ideas from both previous posts, one could find the Phi Ratio by adding to the Hebrew transliteration that Belmurru proposes; if the Y is a Yod, then:

A-B-K-A-L-G-M-O-R-Y = 1 + 2 + 20 + 1 + 30 + 3 + 40 + 70 + 200 + 10 = 377, a Fibonacci number.

The Tarot keys of the top row would then be 0 + I + X + 0 + VIII + II + XII + XV + XIX + IX = 76, the number of the verse.

If we then consider the X as Tzaddi we can have the numbers 4 + 6 + 3 + 8 + 2 + 3 + 90 + 24 + 89 = 233, another Fibonacci number.

Since 89 is specifically included in the numbers, we then have the 89 / 144 ratio for the numbers (including X = 90); and we have 233 / 377 ratio for the numbers & Tzaddi vs. the letters of the top row (thus accounting for all glyphs up to and including 89).

Unfortunately, I cannot see a way that RPSTOVAL could equal 610 to continue the Fibonacci sequence, unless the R, S, or T were a Greek letter instead, but that seems rather inelegant.

Litlluw

RLG

....

Unfortunately, I cannot see a way that RPSTOVAL could equal 610 to continue the Fibonacci sequence, unless the R, S, or T were a Greek letter instead, but that seems rather inelegant.

I do not think Crowley intended a regular progression of Fibonacci numbers, the various patterns discernible through different systems ( in so far as one is able to differentiate between serendipity and design ) appear to incorporate a variety of heterogeneous techniques with no over arching algorithm. Why he chose to incorporate a few golden ratio identities, if indeed he did, would seem to be related to the "five pointed star" of chapter one, as the golden ratio is integral to the basic lineal geometry of the pentagram. In reference purely to verse numbering and the cipher the Fibonacci numbers are 89, 144, 233; in reference to word/number-character divisions the principle Fibonacci numbers appear to be 1597, 2584, 4181; and in reference to to the Key of B the principle numbers appear to be the 26th and 27th Fibonacci, 121393, and 196418

If we whirl the letter of the wheel of fortune by adopting its final letter value 500 as was done in the identity of the cipher equal the names of its letters,

4 6 3 8 ÄBK 2 4 ÄLGMOR 3 YX 24 89 RPSTOVAL = 3394 = ABKALGMORYXRPSTOVAL

the sum of the first 14 numbers and letters equals the 14th distinct Fibonacci number 610, which when divided by the 144 number of numbers of CCXX which precede the beginning of the cipher, equals the cube of the golden ratio accurate to six digits

4 6 3 8 A B K 2 4 A L G M O ÷ 144 = 610 ÷ 144 = 1.61803[sup:mi7k1aik]3[/sup:mi7k1aik] = Φ[sup:mi7k1aik]3[/sup:mi7k1aik]

The golden ratio also appears through the sum of all alpha-numeric characters other than 8 & 9, as it equals the product of the Greek letter of the golden ratio and the golden ratio itself

RPSTOVAL 4 6 3 8 ABK 2 4 ALGMOR 3 YX 2 4 = 809 = Φ[sup:mi7k1aik]2[/sup:mi7k1aik] = Φ x Φ = 1.618 x 500 = טפ = טף[/font:mi7k1aik]

The value 1.618 for the golden ratio is quite close to the value of the golden ratio derived from the total number of alpha-numeric characters divided by the number of alpha-numeric characters through the letter of the golden ratio written in the manuscript

23525 ÷ 14962 = 2 ÷ √1.61800.. = 2 ÷ √Φ = AL Alpha Numeric Character Count ÷ AL Alpha Numeric Character Count through Φ

This occurrence of the final and non-final sum, 809 = 89 = טפ = טף[/font:mi7k1aik], in the Hebrew word for Child, mirrors the Arrow of the Prime 98 sum of AL 1 and the Prime 908 finals sum of its Alpha and Omega verses

Had the manifestation of Nuit = Prime 98 = Prime חצ[/font:mi7k1aik] = Prime חץ[/font:mi7k1aik] = Prime 908 = AL AΩ[/font:mi7k1aik] = 7069 =

Had the manifestation of Nuit. The ending of the words is the word Abrahadabra. The Book of the Law is Written and Concealed. Aum. Ha.

Prime 908 is the hypotenuse of a rectangle of width 4181. The idea of reading the numbers & the words in a circle appears through the last four letters

4 6 3 8 A B K 2 4 A L G M O R 3 Y X 24 89 R P S T O V A L = OVAL = 4[sup:mi7k1aik]2[/sup:mi7k1aik] + L[sup:mi7k1aik]2[/sup:mi7k1aik]

The sum of the names of the letters of OVAL spelled in full equals the sum of all the numbers & the words, identically the squares of the beginning number and end letter.

The squares of the first and last number equals the numbers & and names of the letters, as well as the names of the letters spelled in full when Samekh Teth is replaced with the Shin Tau

4 6 3 8 A B K 2 4 A L G M O R 3 Y X 24 89 R P ט ס[/font:mi7k1aik] O V A L = 7937 = 4[sup:mi7k1aik]2[/sup:mi7k1aik] + 89[sup:mi7k1aik]2[/sup:mi7k1aik] = A B K A L G M O R Y X R P ת ש[/font:mi7k1aik] O V A L

In his Pyramid Texts, James Allen states one of the primary non-divine meanings in ancient Egyptian of the word NWT is OVAL. There are a lot of readings of the cipher in an oval or circle but it tends to descend to minutiae, which can obscure the forest for the trees. I will end with a pretty cool derivation of the first two verses of the book using the golden ratio, the "secret key of the Book of the Law" Crowley states to be the letters Aleph Lamed in his commentary on the Adjustment Atu in Thoth, and the verse/cipher/number structure of the work.

I went over the edit time limit before I could finish the last post.

Here is a golden ratio derivation of the first two verses from the names of the letters of AL and its verse/cipher number structure

AL ÷ ( 233 ϕ - 143 ) = 521.00000001... ÷ 659 ~ 521 ÷ 659 = Had! the manifestation of Nuit ÷ The unveiling of the company of Heaven = AL 1 ÷ AL 2

AL = אלפ למד[/font:1bjdpjd6] the names of the letters of the title of the work, 233 is the number of numbers of the work, 143 is the sum of the numbers of the numbers & the words, identically the number of numbers which precede the verse number of the numbers & the words, 521 equals Prime 98 the sum of the first verse, and 659 is the sum of the second verse. So it is possible to derive the ratio of the first two verses to an accuracy of 11 digits through the golden ratio. If we take 521 and 659 exact and solve for the golden ratio it equals

196418 ÷ 121393 = Fibonacci 27 ÷ Fibonacci 26 = 1.61803398878... ~ 1.61803398874... = ϕ

These two numbers of the first two verses are mirror images of each other in ternary notation

AL 1 = 521 = 201022 220102 = 659 = AL 2

suggesting the as above so below principle of the Emerald Table of Hermes.

JG

Dwtw

That was an excellent post JG. The Phi Ratio is undoubtedly involved in Liber Al, to a very high degree of precision.

Litlluw

RLG

Dwtw

After much reflection on the results of the analysis of the Cipher using Greek qabalah, I did a tarot divination seeking guidance for an approach that will provide a coherent solution. The answer was the Fool and Art, Atu O and XIV. This led me to pursue the idea of Solve et Coagula, as well as AIN, the Nothing that is 61, since the two letters of those cards sum to 61.

The result of that meditation is a solution to the Cipher that involves aspects of verses I:24-25, I:46-48, and III:47. The full account can be found at my livejournal here, as the post is much too long to place in this forum.

http://threefold31.livejournal.com

However, the essence of the answer is simple, and can be summed up as Dissolution and the Night of Pan.

Briefly put, the solution requires analyzing the 28 glyphs twice, thus effectively utilizing 56 glyphs, which relates to vv. I;24-25. In the first part, as I have already shown, the solution boils down to the Greek letters Omicron-Nu, or ON. These may just as well be NO. In the second part, the Greek letters X and PAN are discovered in the Cipher letters, while the Greek word Katalusis, or ‘Dissolution’, is found in the numbers.

The means whereby these are discovered is a formula derived from verse I:46. In that verse, Nuit says that the Jews call Nothing 61, while she calls it 8, 80 400 & 18. That ampersand is critical. When you look at the numbers she chooses, it is clear that 61 = AIN, whose letters have the values 1, 10 and 50. On the other side, the numbers 8, 80 and 400 are all eight times greater than the letter-values of AIN. After the ampersand is the number 18, indicating that this number is added on after the multiplication.

Thus we have a formula in the form of **8N + 18 = X**. I call this the Formula of 26, since we first multiply by 8, then add 18. Its first instance is in Liber AL:

{61 x 8} + 18 = X

488 + 18 = 506

As Frater Achad noticed, 506 is the value of the Hebrew word ShUR, meaning ox, the name of the zodiac sign Taurus. He also felt this number 506 was a symbol of “six and fifty”. Taking a clue from that, we enter the number 56 and see the result:

{56 x 8} + 18 = 448 + 18 = 466 = NUIT spelled in Hebrew

So we can use the formula to turn 56, the value of the name NU, into 466, the value of the name NUIT. Such a result leads one to believe that the formula is valid. When employed on the sum of the numbers of the Cipher, we have:

{143 x 8} + 18 = 1162 = KATALUSIS, the Greek word meaning ‘dissolution’.

When employed on the Trigrammaton Gematria sum of the Cipher letters we have:

{208 x 8} + 18 = 1682 = Greek letter-names of Chi - Pi - Alpha - Nu, or X PAN.

Adding these on to the results of the original Greek transliteration, we arrive at Catalysis - NOX - PAN, or Dissolution - the Night of Pan.

This result is in conformity with the context of the verses preceding the Cipher, which revolve around Death. And along with Death, there is Dissolution, a word that appears twice in Liber AL, both times referring to death and the afterlife.

What is interesting in relation to this is that in Liber 1264, Crowley and Hirsig’s abortive attempt at a Greek qabalistic dictionary, the entry for the number 1072 is quite revealing, (CH indicates notes by Crowley & Hirsig):

1072

pi-alpha-nu CH: 8 + 80 + 418 + 61 = 567

+ 31 + 474 = 1072

CH: none and two (N39)

ED:"everything"

Here Crowley specifically combines the numbers of verse I:46 with the Greek letter-names of PAN. 567 is the sum of all the numbers related to ‘Nothing’, therefore they stand for ‘None’. The word KAI in Greek means ‘and’, with a value of 31. The word DUO in Greek means ‘two’, with a value of 474. Thus he translates ‘none and two’ into 1072 = the word PAN spelled in full. Thereby he equates 0 = 2 with the All.

The fact that Crowley specifically conjoined the numbers in verse I:46 (which give us the 8N + 18 formula), with the word PAN spelled in full, is validation that this approach to the Cipher is sound, with a basis in Crowleyan qabalah and the Book of the Law. But ultimately, the solution must speak for itself.

There is a great deal more to be said about this solution. The methodology used to derive it may also be applied with a finer grain of resolution, to discover even more detail within the 28 glyphs. But along with all the mentions of the Beast, Chaos and the Scarlet Woman found in the Cipher by using the Greek qabalah, the essence of the solution is the six Greek letter-names that spell **NOX PAN**, and one Greek word - **Catalysis**. This is the ‘Solve’ half of the Solve et Coagula formula. I have ‘solved’ the first half of that equation. I will leave the second unattacked.

Litlluw

RLG

Dwtw

The appearance of the word NOX in the solution to the Cipher of AL II:76 can be independently verified when considering the nature of the Formula of 26, and its repetitive series.

Using the formula 8N +18 = X on the number-line of integers, we begin at zero, and thus (8 x 0) = 8 = 18. The value of X simply increases by 8 for each unit, so that (8 x 1) + 18 = 26, (8 x 2) + 18 = 34, and so on.

What we find when we look at the continuation of this sequence is that the final two digits of the number for X will repeat after every 25 numbers. and since we begin with zero, this first series is completed at the number 24, which becomes (8 x 24) + 18 = 210.

The number 24 has been shown to be a crucial part of the Cipher. And the number 210 is traditionally the value of the word NOX, as Crowley notes in several places (Nun-Ayi-Tzaddi). So the Formula of 26 not only connects the key number 24 and the word NOX that appear in the Cipher, but this is precisely the place in the sequence where the repeating series is completed. This can be easily seen in the chart below, where the number on the left is the integer value of N, and the number on the right is the integer value of X:

Integer N; Result of (8N) + 18

00 - 18

01 - 26

02 - 34

03 - 42

04 - 50

05 - 58

06 - 66

07 - 74

08 - 82

09 - 90

10 - 98

11 - 106

12 - 114

13 - 122

14 - 130

15 - 138

16 - 146

17 - 154

18 - 162

19 - 170

20 - 178

21 - 186

22 - 194

23 - 202

24 - 210

25 - 218

26 - 226

27 - 234

28 - 242

29 - 250

30 - 258

31 - 266

32 - 274

33 - 282

34 - 290

35 - 298

36 - 306

37 - 314

38 - 322

39 - 330

40 - 338

41 - 346

42 - 354

43 - 362

44 - 370

45 - 378

46 - 386

47 - 394

48 - 402

49 - 410

50 - 418

Litluw

RLG

Dwtw

In my continuing exploration of the cipher using Greek qabalah, I have come across a rather unique coincidence.

As noted in an earlier post, the words of verse II:76 that occur after the Cipher have a TEG value of 2268. This happens to be 4 x 567, where 567 is both the value of the number-names of the Cipher, and the value of the numbers mentioned in verse I:46. But there is another occurrence of 2268 that I have discovered.

If we consider the numbers of the Cipher to be the ordinal positions of the Greek letters, and then spell those letters in full, we get the same number.

Two things should be considered: first, note that the number 24 would normally be considered the letter Omega , as the 24th letter, in Serial Greek. But when the Greek letters are used strictly as numbers, there are 27 of them. The obsolete letters of Digamma (for 6), Qoppa (for 90), and Sampi (for 900) are employed for numeration, but not used to spell words in the lexicon.

When these letters are used, the full range of number values 1-9; 10-90; 100-900 are available. At any rate, with the full numerical alphabet, the number 24 refers to the 24th letter, Chi, with a value of 600. I have already shown that Chi, or X, is a ‘key’ to the Cipher. In the present case it is integral to the result. Also integral is the obsolete letter Digamma for the number 6, (rather than using the 6th letter of the standard alphabet, which is Zeta).

The last problem is what to do with the number 89. Obviously this does not correspond to a single letter position. So we will simply add it to the rest of them and the result will speak for itself. The chart below shows the Cipher number at left, the corresponding Greek letter, and the value of that letter ‘spelled in full’. (FYI, trying this in Hebrew results in nothing interesting whatsoever):

4 - D - DELTA - - - 340

6 - F - DIGAMMA - 99

3 - G - GAMMA - - - 85

8 - H - ETA - - - - - 309

2 - B - BETA - - - - -311

4 - D - DELTA - - - -340

3 - G - GAMMA - - - 85

24 - X - CHI - - - - 610

89 - * - * - - - - - - 89

Grand total is: - - - 2268

2268 = 4 x 567

2268 = What meaneth this, o prophet? Thou knowest not; nor shalt thou know ever. There cometh one to follow thee: he shall expound it. But remember, o chosen one, to be me; to follow the love of Nu in the star-lit heaven; to look forth upon men, to tell them this glad word.

Now there is a (literal) synchronicity here; this is found in the gematria equivalents of this total. When we split it in half we find:

1134 = SUGKURIA = synchronicity, coincidence, by chance

1134 = BAPhH MHTEOS = ‘Baptism of Wisdom’ - a rendering of the name Baphomet.

So ‘by chance’ we have an equivalence between the English gematria of the non-coded section of verse II:76, and the Greek gematria of the Cipher-numbers, considered as letters spelled in full. This ‘chance’ total of 2268 is also precisely four times the gematria value of the English number-names, which sum to 567.

So in English, the nine number-names are 567, while in Greek the eight letter-names (plus 89) sum to 2268. Precisely why this is the case is obscure. I do not claim this is a ‘solution’ to the Cipher. But the result is derived from the Cipher, and therefore has a resonance with it. And the coincidence it presents would appear to be yet another confirmation of the validity of the TQ Gematria.

Is it merely ‘chance’ that the term for ‘chance’ has presented itself here? If it was merely by ‘chance’, then it proves itself as a coincidence by the word for ‘chance’, SUGKURIA, being an equivalent. Either way, a coincidence is involved.

My question regarding this result is simple: what are the odds that the Greek letter-names indicated by the numerals of the Cipher are precisely the same gematria as the English of the remainder of the verse?

Mr Moss, in his attempt to provide a solution for the Cipher, made this claim:

“The usefulness in placing Hebrew letters in the riddle is it provides a numeric constant by which English gematria systems can be evaluated. If an English system of merit can produce an enumeration that matches the Hebrew sum of the letters, it can be concluded the English system was known of and incorporated while constructing the text of the riddle.”

Now he enumerated the letters as Hebrew equivalents, and then looked for a way to have his English gematria match that. He found it by using Notarikon on the rest of the verse. In the case of the Trigrammaton gematria, we have done something similar - we have enumerated the numbers as Greek letter-names, and found an equivalent with English gematria in the remainder of the verse.

So I would challenge Mr. Moss to determine exactly what are the odds that this is happening by ‘chance’? The result for turning the numbers 4, 6, 3, 8, etc. into 2268 using Greek letter-names is beyond dispute. With that total as a ‘constant’, what are the chances an English gematria will match it in verse II:76? The parameters must be that an English gematria system values the remainder of the verse at 2268, and simultaneously values the number-names of the nine Cipher numbers at 567.

I have serious doubts that another gematria system could be found that accomplishes this, let alone provides the grand total of 267,696 for Liber CCXX, which is also revealed in the Cipher, as noted in the post that began this thread.

Litlluw

RLG

*attempt*( ::) ) to provide a solution for the Cipher, made this claim:

“The usefulness in placing Hebrew letters in the riddle is it provides a numeric constant by which English gematria systems can be evaluated. If an English system of merit can produce an enumeration that matches the Hebrew sum of the letters, it can be concluded the English system was known of and incorporated while constructing the text of the riddle.”

Now he enumerated the letters as Hebrew equivalents, and then looked for a way to have his English gematria match that.

I just happened to add the sum of the numbers in the riddle to the combined gematria/notarikon result for verses 75-76 and realized it matches the enumeration of the letters in the riddle when treated as Hebrew letters: there was no conscious goal or lust of result involved.

He found it by using Notarikon on the rest of the verse. In the case of the Trigrammaton gematria, we have done something similar - we have enumerated the numbers as Greek letter-names, and found an equivalent with English gematria in the remainder of the verse.

So I would challenge Mr. Moss to determine exactly what are the odds that this is happening by ‘chance’?

There is no need for a challenge; my software routines are available to anyone engaged in serious research.

The result for turning the numbers 4, 6, 3, 8, etc. into 2268 using Greek letter-names is beyond dispute. With that total as a ‘constant’, what are the chances an English gematria will match it in verse II:76? The parameters must be that an English gematria system values the remainder of the verse at 2268, and simultaneously values the number-names of the nine Cipher numbers at 567.

I see no valid connection between the numbers 2268 and 567 as values produced by enumerating different strings of letters using gematria. While I realize per your post that 2268 is a multiple of 567, such connections should be avoided for the sake of maintaining continuity and stringency in the work. If every number produced through gematria is linked to other enumerations through mathematics, the effective result is a chaotic bloat of numbers in which everything is connected to everything else by the thinnest of threads, robbing the process of defining qualities that might actually demonstrate truth or proof.

With those thoughts in mind, I determined the odds of the TEG system enumerating the words in verse II:76 as the value 2268 randomly; they are the same as the odds of the ALW system enumerating the words as 2783. The odds are 1150:1 against the enumerations being random. That the ALW system produces the same odds as the TEG system is not necessarily a reason to dismiss the results achieved by the TEG system, it's just that nether are statistically significant when compared to other systems.

The gematria system of the Tahuti Key, being derived from the letter counts seen in the Book of the Law, is simply in a league of its own when it comes to statistical weight. A simple but impressive example relates to the sum of the numbers in the riddle of verse II:76, which add to 143.

There are only two sentences in the Book of the Law that produce the enumeration 143; one is the sentence *But exceed! exceed!* The other one is the sentence that immediately follows the text of the riddle in verse II:76, *What meaneth this o prophet? *

The initial conclusion a skeptic might draw is that with two sentences producing the value 143, both are probably random occurrences, yet the location of the second sentence is placed so perfectly that it leaves the impression it was designed to enumerate as 143 deliberately, so as to resonate with the sum of the numbers in the riddle. The results of a software analysis of the two sentences indicate that both were probably created intentionally to enumerate the value 143; the first sentence serves as a control for comparison, while the second sentence produces extraordinary statistical results.

The odds of the first sentence producing the value 143 at random are 208:1 against, a typical result for most sentences enumerated with ordinal value gematria systems: the value carries no statistical weight. To evaluate the sentence that follows the riddle, nothing in the software was changed except the text analyzed. The statistic returned is nothing short of astonishing: the odds of *What meaneth this o prophet* enumerating as 143 at random are 516,000:1 against. Given the convergence of coincidences, the only intelligent conclusion that can be drawn is the sentence that immediately follows the riddle was not only designed to produce the enumeration 143, but also created using a choice of letters in the words that makes it highly improbable the enumeration is random. This is the type of remarkable gematria work I expect from the minister of the Sun god.

Dwtw

My point wasn't to show you had any 'lust of result', even though all of us working on this sort of thing are trying to find an answer. The bottom line is that you found an equivalence. But to stay on point, you said (in a nutshell) that if the English system could match the Hebrew, it was proof of design intent. So in a similar manner the TEG matched a Greek equivalent, which should be proof enough according to your standards.

That's good to know; I'd love toy work with them sometime.

What is valid is that the same numbers that produce 2268 by Greek letter-names, also have 567 as their English letter-names. Furthermore, 2268 matches the remainder of the verse. So my 'challenge', I should have said 'request', was to calculate odds against BOTH the letter-names and remainder of the verse equaling 567 and 2268. It seems that you avoided doing that because you think it's not valid. But whether you agree that 567 and its multiple 2268 are connected really wasn't the issue.

Normally, I don't concern myself too much with multiples of gematria sums, because I agree that it can make too many tenuous associations. But in this case, 567 is a number that appears in Liber AL - I didn't just pull it out of a hat. If the number-names of the Cipher equalled 732 and the rest of the verse was 2928, I wouldn't think too much of it as an equivalence.

There are lots of multiples of gematria in AL that are not even worth mentioning. I don't think this is one of them. However, if you can show that the odds against these two results - together - are insignificant, then it would bolster your case that the connection is meaningless, and also weaken my argument. The reason I asked in the first place is because I don't know what to make of such a result. It seems tantalizing, but it may be nothing. My instinct is that this is highly unusual.

But let's put the argument another way - using the numbers of the Cipher, the Greek letter-names sum to 2268, as I showed. Now are there any gematria sets out there that match this? Yes, there is one, a well established set. There are certainly hundreds of others which have never even been explored, but we don't need to find them, since we already have one. The question becomes - is the TEG special in this regard? Well it certainly is in the context of known gematrias of English, but it may not be in the context of septillions of serial gematrias.

so you're saying that 1 out of every 1150 serial gematrias arrive at this total? This seems reasonable - I wouldn't expect the sum of 2268 - by itself - to have statistical significance. There are surely thousands of gematria sets that would accomplish this. That is why I asked about the conjunction of that sum AND the sum of 567 for the number-names. This would multiply the two odds together.

*But exceed! exceed!*The other one is the sentence that immediately follows the text of the riddle in verse II:76,

*What meaneth this o prophet?*

... the odds of *What meaneth this o prophet* enumerating as 143 at random are 516,000:1 against.

This seems significant. So what you're saying is that out of 10 million serial English gematria systems, only 20 would come up with 143 for this sentence? Just how many of the 10^27 possible serial systems can your software check?

Litlluw

RLG

*But exceed! exceed!*The other one is the sentence that immediately follows the text of the riddle in verse II:76,

*What meaneth this o prophet?*

… the odds of *What meaneth this o prophet* enumerating as 143 at random are 516,000:1 against. Given the convergence of coincidences, the only intelligent conclusion that can be drawn is the sentence that immediately follows the riddle was not only designed to produce the enumeration 143, but also created using a choice of letters in the words that makes it highly improbable the enumeration is random. This is the type of remarkable gematria work I expect from the minister of the Sun god.

Dwtw

Thinking this over some more, the fact that you can estimate odds of a half-million to one against the sentence "What meaneth this o prophet?" = 143 seems statistically significant, in comparison with other English gematria systems. But the fact is that the rarity is built into the system. Not only is 143 very rare, but I'm sure many other sentences are as well; indeed, they should be much rarer than those occurring in other systems.

Using a system based on letter-frequencies, where the most common letter has the smallest value and the least common has the highest value, will unquestionably result in a serial gematria that provides the lowest possible total for the entire contents of Liber CCXX. Such a system is unique, because it is deliberately chosen to be. The only other unique system is the opposite, where the most-common letter has the highest value, and the least common letter has the lowest value. These are the two ends of the spectrum. Between them lie millions of possible systems with various totals for Liber CCXX.

The difference between the highest and lowest totals is 310,620. There are therefore that many possible totals for CCXX, (though possibly not all are realized). But in context, 26 items such as English letters, can be arranged in 26! ways, which is 403,291,461,126,605,635,584,000,000 or 403.3 septillion. If each grand total was equally possible, which they are not, then there would be about 1 sextillion systems for each total.

As it is, I suspect the totals are in a Gaussian standard distribution, with the median values taking the bulk of the systems, and then tailing off toward the unique systems that manifest the lowest and highest values, which have only one exemplar each. Since none of the letter-frequencies in Liber AL are factors or multiples of each other, I don't think shifting around a couple values will create other systems with the lowest and highest totals, so these, at least provisionally, must be considered unique.

Given the plethora of possible gematrias, perhaps it is not fair to compare any one system's performance against all possibilities, because there is almost assuredly another system, in fact many other systems, that will perform the same way. Rather they should be compared against other gematrias that are at least derived from or related to Liber AL in a meaningful way. NAEQ would be one, so would HADTEMNU, (the order of the letters as they appear in AL). Those based on letter-frequency would also be candidates, as would TEG, since it is based on Crowley's letter-attributions to the trigrams.

(This is tantamount to agreement with Mr. Moss on the idea that, e.g., rather than compare finding one's name and address in the cipher against all people on earth, it makes more sense to only compare it to Thelemites who are likely to be involved in deciphering the Book).

The total of Liber CCXX generated by the TEG, (and NAEQ as well), is squarely in the midrange of values for all possible grand totals; therefore one would not expect it to be nearly as rare as some other possibilities. This is why I think that ultimately, statistical analysis may not be the answer to determining a correct gematria. The method has to rely more on internal consistency. Does the system embody several distinct but overlapping examples of significant numbers?

The TEG encodes a value of 267,696 for Liber CCXX. Surely many other gematrias do as well. But in addition to that, it also reveals this total in at least six places in the text, and this number is actually revealed in the Cipher without reference to gematria, as noted in the first post of this thread. Its most simple example is found in perhaps the most significant verse of the book. Keeping in mind that the Greek word Thelema is 93 by Alexandrian values, but 44 by serial values, we have the following:

39. The word of the law is Thelema.

This can be broken up into the verse number, the English, and the Greek thus: 39 - 156 - 44. From this we simply multiply: 39 x 156 x 44 = 267,696.

This is the kind of internal evidence of consistency that will not likely be found in other gematrias - even if they give the same total for the whole text. So when you have a least-value gematria that provides a total of 154,938 for CCXX, the question is - does this number appear hidden anywhere else in the text? The same is true for the NAEQ total, or any other total generated for CCXX.

I'm sure the computer program could find a gematria that would give 267,696 for the whole text. But to match how the TEG encodes that value elsewhere it would have to also generate 283 for the first verse, 208 for the Cipher letters, 176 for the value of the words 'sixty-one' and 'nothing', and 156 for the phrase 'the word of the law is'. That's four different places where the total is hiding. And it can also be found when the value of the English of chapter two is 85,210, or when the title 'The Book of the Law' is 143, multiplied by the 39 words that precede it at the end of the Book, which equal 1872. All of these narrow down the possibility of other systems performing the same way, by a considerable margin.

The point is, I don't see these kinds of recurring numbers happening with any other gematria system I've looked at. If we are to make something significant out of 143 being equal to "What meaneth this o prophet? ", it would have to lead somewhere else, otherwise, it seems like an artifact of the rarity of the gematria system itself. And I am sure there are many other examples like that when using the least-value system.

There's no question that something that happens only twice in a million times, and located in that position, should be scrutinized. I wonder where it leads? Perhaps it would be most appropriate to compare this not with other gematrias that are in the median-value of the grand total, such as TEG or NAEQ, but the highest-value system, which is also unique. If we find significant numbers in that system that are equally as rare, then I think it would show that the manifestation is an artifact of the nature of the system, rather than any evidence of design intent.

Litlluw

RLG

Okay, the odds are 200,000:1 against.

so you're saying that 1 out of every 1150 serial gematrias arrive at this total?

Yes, and that applies to the figure posted above.

*But exceed! exceed!*The other one is the sentence that immediately follows the text of the riddle in verse II:76,

*What meaneth this o prophet?*

... the odds of *What meaneth this o prophet* enumerating as 143 at random are 516,000:1 against.

This seems significant. So what you're saying is that out of 10 million serial English gematria systems, only 20 would come up with 143 for this sentence?

Correct.

Just how many of the 10^27 possible serial systems can your software check?

I can write a program that will check them all, but it could take days or even weeks to do so given the current speed of my fastest computer. There is really no need to check all of the possibilities, only an accurate sampling of them. By generating gematria systems at random, all of the possibilities are being tapped, whereas a sequential search of all possible systems might not yield an accurate ratio until most of the systems have been analyzed.

An accurate sampling is obtained when the ratio of systems that will and will not perform stabilizes. Typically several million systems are generated before an approximation is determined.

Dwtw

Thank you for taking the time and checking that figure. It shows that simply adding one more parameter increased the odds against by almost two hundredfold. I imagine that adding the further parameters I indicated would increase the odds quite a bit more.

But let's say that all half a dozen parameters are met, and the odds against the TEG being random are 10 million to 1. There are two ways to look at that. One the one hand, those odds are pretty substantial when seen in isolation. One the other hand, it is possible that there are a quadrillion gematria systems that could do that. The problem is, you can only find one of those by number-crunching.

It does not take many items to create an astronomical number of possibilities. If I shuffle some tarot cards, say the Ace to the 10 of Wands, put them face down and then try to guess the sequence, the odds are 3.6 million to one that I will find the right answer! But if I attempt to guess the sequence a quintillion number of times, (representing the numerous possible gematrias) obviously I will get it right quite often.

I think there needs to be a balance in mind when looking at these statistics. Naturally, the rarer something is, the more it piques one's interest; but at the same time very few gematria sets are really 'rare' in the grand scheme of of all possible sets. Given that, as I said earlier, it seems more sensible to compare gematrias that are actually related to the Book of the Law, and the numbers found therein. In my OP, I showed that the TEG total of CCXX can be found in the Cipher numbers. Now it doesn't really matter how 'rare' the TEG is; the point is that this total appears independently. We are then justified in looking to see if a gematria matches it. And out of the millions of such possible systems, there is already one in place, which originated with the Prophet, and was enumerated by one who followed him. If, as has often been surmised, the Cipher is a test of a possible English qabalah, then the TQ passes the test.

Litlluw

RLG

Dwtw

To return to the topic of the original post, and with an eye for wrapping up this thread, what follows is an interesting variation on my original formula. This version does not require the use of the 24th glyph, the letter T (which equals 9) in the second half of the formula, and generates the grand total of CCXX using the Cipher glyphs only once. This solution is arguably more 'purist', and applies to the Cipher regardless of the sequence of the glyphs.

As noted before, the first equation generates the value of Liber CCXX using only the numbers of the Cipher: (4 * 6 * 3 * 8 * 2 * 4 * 3 * 24) - {89 * 24 * (3 + 4 + 2 + 8 + 3 + 6 + 4 )} = 331,776 - (89 * 24 * 30) = 331,776 - 64,080 = 267,696 = grand total of Liber CCXX using the TEG.

This total is very strong evidence that the TEG is the correct gematria for Liber CCXX. It provides a 'target-value' matched by no other extant gematria system. And it does so using there numbers of the Cipher only. We can then proceed to the next step and incorporate the letter-values of this gematria in the next equation.

The sum of the numbers in the Cipher is 143. The sum of the letters (by TEG) is 208. But the letters appear in four groups of 3, 6, 2 and 8 members, (numbers which themselves appear in the Cipher). We will leave them in these groups, but sum the groups and then multiply them, then discover the difference between these products, which is then multiplied by the sum of the numbers.

(4 + 6 + 3 + 8 + 2 + 4 + 3 + 24 + 89) times

{ (A + B + K) * (R + P + S + T + O + V + A + L ) } minus

{ (A + L + G + M + O + R) * (Y + X) } equals

(4 + 6 + 3 + 8 + 2 + 4 + 3 + 24 + 89) times

{ (5 + 20 + 17) * (14 + 4 + 15 + 9 + 10 + 22 + 5 + 1 ) } minus

{ (5 + 1 + 11 + 21 + 10 + 14) * (18 + 6) } equals

143 * {(42 * 80) - (62 * 24)} = 143 * (3660 - 1488) = 143 * 1872 = **267,696** = grand total of Liber CCXX.

In other words, (**ABK * RPSTOVAL**), minus (**ALGMOR * YX**) times **143** = Liber CCXX.

We can consider these two equations to stand alone as separate instances of generating the sum of CCXX from the Cipher numbers, and from the numbers and words, in which case they equate to each other:

(4 * 6 * 3 * 8 * 2 * 4 * 3 * 24) - (89 * 24 * 30) = 143 * {(42 * 80) - (62 * 24)}

O r we can 'unite by thine art so that all disappear', and subtract one from the other:

(4 * 6 * 3 * 8 * 2 * 4 * 3 * 24) - (89 * 24 * 30) - 143 * {(42 * 80) - (62 * 24)} = 0

331,776 - 64,080 - 267,696 = 0

The combination of these two equations is a definitive solution of 'the numbers and the words' in the light of a new English gematria, as required in verse II:55.

Litlluw

RLG

The one problem with most of these explanations is that it uses Crowley's typescript interpretaion, Liber 220. It differs in many ways from the original manuscript Liber XXXI.

I don't come on here often enough. I'm kind of preoccupied these days with other projects. However, thanks Jamie for highlighting my findings (looking at it 18 years on, I wish I'd written it differently but, hey, the folly of youth). I am still no further forward in understanding what any of it means, but for those who are interested, I've provided a link to my work which dates back to 1996.

I'll also include links to some additional pdfs of work undertaken by someone I talked to online for a while (I forget his name now, as it was a few years ago) who correlated quite extensively some additional values based on my findings.

I'd like to emphasise that whilst I am philosophically still a Thelemite, I like to remain Agnostic with regards to believing in anything whatsoever. Make of these findings what you will. I'm just throwing them out there.

http://www.media-underground.net/ebooks/The_Key_Of_It_All.pdf

http://www.media-underground.net/ebooks/Liber_AL_-_By_Alphabet.pdf

http://www.media-underground.net/ebooks/Liber_AL_-_By_Number.pdf

http://www.media-underground.net/ebooks/Values_-_By_Alphabet.pdf

http://www.media-underground.net/ebooks/Values_-_By_Number.pdf

http://www.media-underground.net/ebooks/Values_-_C7_D7_CD.pdf

Also, here's an online cipher calculator based on my "key":

Thanks!

Dwtw

I included a condensed version of the Mortimer solution on page 20 of the second version of my essay on solutions to verse II:76 called Secrets of the Cipher Naughts. I have since collected a few more from other qabalists that will be included in the next updated version.

Litlluw

RLG

The thread which refuses to die!

I will be uploading ( إن شاء الله ) to Abraxadabra.WordPress a summary of Trigrammaton literal "theoretical" Qabalah results ( primarily analyzing global, cipher, and first verses ) using both the Trigrammaton ordinal values ( IU = 1-26 ) and the Trigrams read as base 3 values, of Crowley's Class B ? ordering of the letters of the English alphabet, which he assigned to the Trigrams of Trigrammaton.

By the way Leo, what actually was the date Crowley finally fixed his ordering of the letters? Trigrammaton dates to 1907 yes? and the order of the letters?

I think it right to give a summary of these principle results using two relatively self-evident different value systems based on Trigrammaton, as I intend to give an account of two other valuing systems of the English alphabet - one based on the Phonecian/Assyrian values, and the other based on the Boetian/Greek values - each phonetically and historically founded. These "classical" specific fixings of the values of the English alphabet spring from following up on multiple hints of AC to use the "tried and trusty values" and to "change them not". It is my belief, based upon extensive research, that the oldest known values mapped perfectly to the English, are the primary values of the literal Qabalah of AL- and that the Greek, and Trigrammaton values are supplemental, although quite rich in their own right. But "who shall shall determine the value?"

With literal Qabalah, you never know, given the "Thirteen Fountains of Magnificent Oil flowing down the Beard of Macroprosopus" - is it not even the case that all of the letters of Crowley's versification of the Stele which he directly included in AL, equals, using the Key of B, the product of 13 and 1779 - which is to say 13 times the spelling in full of אראריתא – identically the number of verses in each chapter of Ararita times the number of words of Ararita?

Twain his forces = 1 Had the manifestation of Nuit

::: Twain his forces = 23,525 = alpha-numeric characters of CCXX

:::: Twain his forces = 13 * 1779 = Stele Versification in AL

To get the ball rolling, ( it is amazing how I am able to resist sharing every little Qabalistic tittle with the community - not so much because there are not Qabalistic party poopers – and there are – and rightfully - the literal Qabalahs of Crowley have abounded like bastard sons - allow me Leo to share one wonderful one discovered today which unites the ordinal and Trigram values in one fell swoop with the Greek values - using the last eight letters of verse II 76 - "glad word." Using the digamma Crowley uses to transliterate Aiwass equal 418

γλαδ ϝορδ = 218

This is a basic number from classical "Key of B" literal Qabalah, as it equals "Sixty-one" - "Zero" - and "Empty Set" – and also rich in the Qabalah of the Work of Creation – בראשית – however – what interests us here is not the simple sum of "glad word" in Greek - but rather its spelling in full three times - a technique originally developed using the Key of B ( ::B = ABC ... XYZ - "Why does the Torah begin with a B - so that it begin with a Blessing" ) following the example of Crowley and the opening of Genesis:

::: γλαδ ϝορδ = 301 * 283

301 = Had the manifestation of Nuit

283 = Had the manifestation of Nuit

which is as is always invariably the case the cipher equal the first verse identically the book ... in the first case using the values 1-26 of the letters of Trigrammaton, and in the second, using the base three values of the Trigrams. Anyway, I thought it was pretty cool. Very few people get off on this kind of stuff, outside of Leo, and maybe one or two others, but, nonetheless, I thought it interesting enough to share, given the rich results of the elementary application of Trigrammaton to AL …

A final question Leo - have you ever looked at cipher, first verse, and global results, when the Trigrams are read base 3 not bottom to top but top to bottom? That may be the true key! I have been meaning to look at it these last couple of years, but have never got around to it.

Dwtw

Liber Trigrammaton was written on December 14, 1907. The letter attributions to the trigrams are mentioned in the Old Comment found in the Equinox Vol. 1 No. 7 from 1912, so they predate that. An incomplete version of them appears in the Windram copy of Thelema, so they are possibly post 1909, unless this is an aborted attempt at a revision of an earlier version, which seems likely.

I have looked into reading the trigrams from top to bottom, instead of the traditional way, but nothing of great significance seems to derive from that approach. The Cipher however, totals 418 when read upside down, and then converted into its antigrams.

Litlluw

RLG

My latest work with the cipher of verse II:76 can be found here:

Secrets of Verse II:76

testing testing one two

Here are a couple of early fairly diffuse expostions which I am absolutely not satisfied with from a literary point of view

abraxadabra.files.wordpress.com/2016/03/global-local-sums-landscape.pdf

abraxadabra.files.wordpress.com/2016/03/introduction.pdf

abraxadabra.files.wordpress.com/2016/03/cipher-wander.pdf