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Posted by: @aleisterion
The death of Anne Leah, nicknamed Poupee, immediately preceded that of the fetus, which was half-alive when they aborted him.
Posted by: @aleisterion
The death of Poupee was too much for Leah, who was far along in her pregnancy when it was aborted.
The following references are taken from the Magical Record of the Beast 666, Edited by Symonds/Grant.
Page 281: 14 October. 3.30 p.m. Alostrael is back, Poupee died this morning…
17 October. Three days of silence. Annoyed by a …..? boil.
18 October. Leah very much in danger; made her rest still more completely. She got a lot better; but at night pains and haemorrhage became unmistakable.
11:40 pm. Went over and got Ninette.
19 October. 12.30 a.m. Ninette off to the town with the old peasant next door.
2.00 a.m. A competent Wise-Woman is here (The Midwife: Symonds/Grant note)
8:45 a.m. Leah at ease but bar miracles, a miscarriage is certain. In the afternoon, we had a second thunder storm with hail. It broke windows, tore and uprooted trees, made the hillside a pocket Darjeeling!
Page 282: 20 October. I notice that ‘Oh, so much!’ (The Word of the current Equinox: Symonds/Grant note) requires little exegesis. 1. Our baby dies; 2. Our next baby isn’t born; 3. I have a bad boil; …… In the month more has happened than in any one year of my life.
21 October. We go on suffering and affirming our Oath to perform the Great Work.
22 October. My Boil burst this morning; I have given it a Number One clean ….. It – and the two shocking disasters to my Race – have depressed me unspeakably; I am simply a poultice on the physical plane….
Page 283: 23 October. …. Death’s night [?] -and left at my girl summer-sojourning and at my boy birth-barred struck me as Job was stricken. (The baby, Anu Leah (Poupee) had died and Leah had miscarried.
Just to note that the word aborted does not appear in the MRotB666, just the words Miscarriage/Miscarried.
Posted by: @jamiejbarter
I hope it travels safely. Please remember to scour it well when it arrives (being the only source for your information as follows) for the references to: the Absolute (and irrevocable?) Authority of the 'Oath of Obedience'; Leah 'fully officiating' at the 10=1 Ritual; and the transfer of power on to her and her 'lineage' beyonder that.
Posted by: @aleisterion
I can provide the references very soon, as my new copy of the book will be ordered tomorrow.
As I said in an earlier post. The Vow of Holy Obedience (not Absolute Holy Obedience) was made 1 year before (1920) Crowley entered the Temple to take the Grade of Ipsissimus (1921).
The Oath in question is also in the Magical Record 666, it does not bestow Absolute Authority on Alostrael. There is no transfer of power on her and her ‘lineage’ beyond that. It was made during a time when Crowley was questioning himself about his life. Cocaine played a large roll in all this. It was just another Ordeal for him to endure. He was to be her slave and had to follow all her Commands. Pages 228 onwards gives descriptions and thoughts.
No details are given as to what Occurred during the Ipsissimus grade, which as I have said was performed 1 year later. My understanding is that Leah was the witness to the Grade and nothing more. Unless the Diary for Leah is published covering this Initiation, then factually no one will ever truly know what happened.
Please forgive me if the formatting is a bit skewed in this post. I am out of practice.
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the Ape of Tahuti,
Thoth is the same divinity, the point being that Crowley actually refers to Leah in Confessions as the 'Ape of Thoth', meant to be not a form of the deity itself but the inhuman companion who babbles incessant nonsense - a metaphor for the normal everyday human consciousness chattering away. I would have thought his use was either intended as derogatory/ condemnatory in terms of what came out of Leah's mouth or at least jokey rather than, ahem, an allegation or a suggestion of her divinity!
It was dying; and I suppose, it soon died. "He"? We don't know, unless it's in the diaries.
It was you who mentioned a "him" earlier. But you were also saying A.C. was going to use the hitherto mentioned ether to finish it off (so if it wasn't dead before, it would be soon afterwards)?
a major ritual was performed to make this baby no less than the incarnation of Aiwaz.
Again, where is this documented/ your source for this?
Un, Therion was a 9=2.
On, Yes, but are you saying this was Crowley's state of consciousness at that time by Leah's bedside? (Not exactly on a plane of samadhi unless you could call "being out of it" that; the question also being would a fully functioning 9=2 have forgotten the ether
The Oath in question is also in the Magical Record 666, it does not bestow Absolute Authority on Alostrael
Nevertheless Aleisterion has declared and verified TKOTSR to be verily & amen the one and only source, so let's wait for him to explain these matters.
My understanding is that Leah was the witness to the Grade and nothing more. Unless the Diary for Leah is published covering this Initiation, then factually no one will ever truly know what happened.
That's my understanding too. And thank you for all the relevant supplemental information.
N Joy
It was you who mentioned a "him" earlier. But you were also saying A.C. was going to use the hitherto mentioned ether to finish it off (so if it wasn't dead before, it would be soon afterwards)?
Actually the way AC writes about it in the Confessions, he was thinking about the child's suffering....he knew it would die already.
As regards.
the point being that Crowley actually refers to Leah in Confessions as the 'Ape of Thoth', meant to be not a form of the deity itself but the inhuman companion who babbles incessant nonsense - a metaphor for the normal everyday human consciousness chattering away. I would have thought his use was either intended as derogatory/ condemnatory in terms of what came out of Leah's mouth or at least jokey rather than, ahem, an allegation or a suggestion of her divinity!
Yes where does AC say this about her in the Confessions?
Posted by: @aleisterion
The death of Anne Leah, nicknamed Poupee, immediately preceded that of the fetus, which was half-alive when they aborted him.
Alrighty then! before taking these excellent points, let me first thank you for posting that reference on the previous page.
All that these points really show is that I made a good choice in selecting Aliana to mastermind this project rather than trying to take it on myself.
Okay, obviously there was no abortion. The baby died soon after being exposed. Also, the death of Poupee preceded that of the fetus by a week, not "immediately" -- so what? The cause of miscarriage, clearly, remains the same: the tragedy that befell poor little Poupee.
The Vow of Holy Obedience (not Absolute Holy Obedience) was made 1 year before (1920) Crowley entered the Temple to take the Grade of Ipsissimus (1921).
Here my mistake was rooted in feeling ("beware feelings"): my dedication to Alostrael clouded my thinking; but it remains irrelevant, as the lineage in this case derives from both parties, Beast and Scarlet Woman. All that is needed, of course, is that of The Beast.
I remain certain, of course, that Leah Hirsig not only witnessed, but officiated the Ipsissimus Ritual, and that an Oath such as that I described was sworn, but the basis of that conclusion remains invalid, being circumstantial (albeit studied) analysis. Nonetheless, it remains in the book, though with a footnote of course.
Thoth is the same divinity, the point being that Crowley actually refers to Leah in Confessions as the 'Ape of Thoth', meant to be not a form of the deity itself but the inhuman companion who babbles incessant nonsense - a metaphor for the normal everyday human consciousness chattering away. I would have thought his use was either intended as derogatory/ condemnatory in terms of what came out of Leah's mouth or at least jokey rather than, ahem, an allegation or a suggestion of her divinity!
Each of the Scarlet Women, as many of us know, had magical titles in addition to their magical names -- or many of them did have, anyway.
Leah Hirsig's magical name was Alostrael (31-666-31); and her title was "The Ape of Tahuti" (i.e. Thoth).
In the Confessions, of course, he refers to her as "divine" -- and his intent very clearly is to honor her, not to make light.
It was you who mentioned a "him" earlier. But you were also saying A.C. was going to use the hitherto mentioned ether to finish it off (so if it wasn't dead before, it would be soon afterwards)?
The ether would have been to ease the baby's suffering until its inevitable demise. It was "half-dead", Crowley wrote -- my guess would be that below the heart it was dead, for otherwise it would have been totally dead. I made a mistake when I referred to it as "him". Again, I'm not the head of this project! And Aliana is going to break out the lash when she founds out how I bungled this.
Again, where is this documented/ your source for this?
Yes, in the pages shown/referred to on the previous page.
On, Yes, but are you saying this was Crowley's state of consciousness at that time by Leah's bedside? (Not exactly on a plane of samadhi unless you could call "being out of it" that; the question also being would a fully functioning 9=2 have forgotten the ether
I don't get your question. He was having a "panic attack" -- the only one of his life as far as we know. You're suggesting that a true 9=2 would never be so personally distraught? I do not agree: fully God; fully Man.
Nevertheless Aleisterion has declared and verified TKOTSR to be verily & amen the one and only source, so let's wait for him to explain these matters.
Not so; we're also going through the diaries, of course. But let's not forget the numerous letters, many of which only appear in that larger book.
But again: Aliana is the one working on all this, not I! My stroke-addled brain is unfit to do such complicated work anymore. It's Aliana's time to shine!
I'm so very sorry for making a mess of things! But thanks to all of you who contributed here one way or another. Our eyes have been opened to a few new integral facts.
This is developing into an amazing story! Is it fiction or fact? Let's wait for Soror Aliana to present her case by her ingenium (not mine), then we can decide.
In the meantime, as I promised, Aliana is working on teasers for the book -- oh, and I have to provide that picture of the writer which I offered before.
Cheers,
777
Okay, obviously there was no abortion. The baby died soon after being exposed. Also, the death of Poupee preceded that of the fetus by a week, not "immediately" -- so what? The cause of miscarriage, clearly, remains the same: the tragedy that befell poor little Poupee.
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Hi Aleisterion (Sorry I miss-spelled your name in my earlier post)
I would just like to add that the copious amounts of cocaine, opium, alcohol etc. being taken by Leah could have also been contributing factors to the miscarriage.
I hope I have used the quote button correctly, my apologies if not.
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Hi Aleisterion (Sorry I miss-spelled your name in my earlier post)
I would just like to add that the copious amounts of cocaine, opium, alcohol etc. being taken by Leah could have also been contributing factors to the miscarriage.
Oh, there's no doubt about it! Substance-abuse and grief combined to lethal effect, unfortunately.
Just to note that the word aborted does not appear in the MRotB666, just the words Miscarriage/Miscarried.
From what I have read here, yes, a miscarriage has occurred, not an abortion.
I find it interesting that Therion, et al, are described as performing a Moonchild operation, except it was to be an Aiwasschild, and this is extremely problematic (so get your smelly salts and have them handy). Aiwass has been assigned to Kether (by AC, me, and others). A monad at Kether will not be incarnating. He has severed all connections with the physical plane and moved out from under the authority of the (A.'.A.'.) hierarchy. As a magician, and a physician, I would have warned him before he trioed this stunt, but I wasn't borned yet.
Then, a bit later, he writes Moonchild. We've all read that.
Then, much later, Parsons and Hubbard start an operation to invoke Babalon ton visible appearance, and there is a Moonchild reference in here, but I forget the details (and the dates). AC hears about this and calls them Stupid or Foolish or Something Louts or Goats (various handwritten scribble interpretations.
Jamie will notice that is the old do as I say, not as I once did maneuver.
then factually no one will ever truly know what happened.
This is always a distinct possibility, especially considering the nature of the grade. But the team is hurling forward, penetrating the mysteries of Cefalu - to see who's currently carrying the one true lineage), and investigating the Initiation of getting out for good, with various interpretations saying this and that, yin and yang about things they have not experienced.
In Liber B vel Magi, it is written, "How shall he destroy himself?" There is something wrong here. The Magus does not set out to destroy himself (unless he is afflicted with mosochistic tendencies). He performs his work, sees that it is tidied up, then he lets go. This is not consciously performed as an oath or a ceremony. It occurs naturally, and the best (least painful) way to go is the just let it happen. The initiatory process then advances on its track, and the crisis comes of its own accord. Expect a complete blackout (while the circuits are re-wired).
There is no witness required, this part is made up by the imp Crowley who was playing the same eternal carrot-stick trick. However, there is a rather grand gathering of witnesses on the Monadic plane (Kether).
I'll stop now. I'm writing about these things in 10D, right now, and I'm just here this morning, tuning up for more writing on the other borG-unit .
Thank you very much for thequotations. I had not read those entries before, and they help immensely in finding and fitting the pieces together.
Again, where is this documented/ your source for this?
The documentation and the story have been announced as "coming in the mail" and "forthcoming." The scenario is unfolding rather nicely, like a bloody lotus. Patience remains a virtue.
On, Yes, but are you saying this was Crowley's state of consciousness at that time by Leah's bedside?
The Magus was being destroyed ... as he wished or Willed. He went through the same ordeal with Rose and his child, who died, and Rose went to the Far. Another round, on a higher level, at Cefalu. Departing Chokmah, via the only foolish thread out, is going to dissolve all attachments. It is finished !
unless you could call "being out of it"
Yes. If he had not hit the out phase, I would question the whole significance. As I said, there is a blackout during which time one is semi-conscious and vaguely aware of things being removed and new circuits are wired (metaphysically speaking).
I don't get your question. He was having a "panic attack"
He was invo9lved in the crisis point of his grade. These "points" can drag on for w hile ... until the candidate stabilizes at the new vibration, at which point Thr Rod of Initiation is applied (The Ipsissimus ceremony). All this was Therion trying to destroy himself. Note that rituals of self-initiation merely set the real crisis in motion, for some reason taking about two years to manifest fully on the physical plane.
In this case, it was 1924 (I think), in France, where he wrote: To put it simp0ly, I died."
You're suggesting that a true 9=2 would never be so personally distraught?
When the crisis sets in, nobody has control of anything. Attaining control (at a higher level), in the midst of swirling blackness, is prepatory to stabilization (and fixation) at the next level up. Yeah, this applies to all levels, and everybody here has been through one or more of them, so you know what a crisis in the midst of daily life is like, maybe not at the bloody level of Cefalu. Everybody will get stoned - multiple times. "Initiation is a series of directed energy impacts." The impacts always include a switchover, an upgrade, a rewiring, an initiation, and there's always a blackout, or equivalent form of anesthesia.
I would just like to add that the copious amounts of cocaine, opium, alcohol etc. being taken by Leah could have also been contributing factors to the miscarriage.
And the who9le paradigm shifts its focus. One really needs to approach the final gate in a "clean" state. The Oath of the I* OTO says I will not indulge in (list of drugs) to the point where I lose control of my Will (paraphrased).
I hope I have used the quote button correctly, my apologies if not.
Everything looks fine. You will not need a referral to a specialist, today. Try again next5 week.
The documentation and the story have been announced as "coming in the mail" and "forthcoming." The scenario is unfolding rather nicely, like a bloody lotus. Patience remains a virtue.
Nah...she has decided not to do it. But hey! what a thread! And it's not done yet! I know that I learned a great deal, and was entertained. Great fun!
Cheers,
Aleisterion
What was this "Hierophantic Movement" again, Aleisterion?
Leah Hirsig's magical name was Alostrael (31-666-31); and her title was "The Ape of Tahuti" (i.e. Thoth).
OK - they seem more or less the same and interchangeable except in a very close Egyptian v. Greek analysis which does not matter in this context. Or are you saying it does, in which case why would "Tahuti" be better than "Thoth"?
[T]he lineage in this case derives from both parties, Beast and Scarlet Woman. All that is needed, of course, is that of The Beast.
Yes, that would have made a significant difference had it been clarified earlier.
I remain certain, of course, that Leah Hirsig not only witnessed, but officiated the Ipsissimus Ritual,
But this is where wellreadwellbread's question earlier comes in - in the event of something happening to the Beast, would she have had Authority to have "taken over" the AA and more questionably (after Reuss had died also) the OTO.
I remain certain [...] that an Oath such as that I described was sworn, but the basis of that conclusion remains invalid, being circumstantial (albeit studied) analysis. Nonetheless, it remains in the book, though with a footnote of course.
This remains to be seen, although things seem to be getting more nebulous with each post..
In the Confessions, of course, he refers to her as "divine"
Well wasn't he just being flattering here? (especially as she was also taking down his dictation!) A bit like a bloke might say to his girlfriend in order to earn credit points and to charm her into coition: 'hey babe, you're a goddess!"
Okay, obviously there was no abortion. The baby died soon after being exposed.
OK, that's clear now. As I said, I thought it didn't seem to add up, especially re his principles on abortion etc. That seems to have been a bit of a time wasting red herring...
I'm not the head of this project! And Aliana is going to break out the lash when she founds out how I bungled this.
You like this, yes?!
Yes, in the pages shown/referred to on the previous page.
NO - there's no mention there of where this "Aiwaz Ritual" came from, or what it consisted of.
You're suggesting that a true 9=2 would never be so personally distraught
If by 'true' you mean 'fully functioning', I did say something of the sort. But I think some of it was Shiva's suggestion as well, with qualifications.
fully God; fully Man.
That shouldn't mean AC's mundane state of everyday consciousness would impede the effectiveness of Therion at 9=2 though.
Not so; we're also going through the diaries, of course. But let's not forget the numerous letters, many of which only appear in that larger book.
Earlier you said TKOTSR was your "only" source for Leah being given Absolute Authority, etc. Now it's changing to all the supplemental documents, diaries, letters & whatnot. {Never mind Aliana, I want to break out the whip!}
But again: Aliana is the one working on all this, not I! My stroke-addled brain is unfit to do such complicated work anymore.
OK, fair enough, maybe I was making too many demands/ was too demanding on your mental ability (and I don't mean that in a put-down sort of way). Nonetheless, questions & queries do need to be asked, addressed & answered.
This is developing into an amazing story! Is it fiction or fact?
Hopefully the latter! Kenneth Grant supplies more than enough of the former in historical stories (or should that more correctly be designated "Faction" in his case?)
Jamie will notice that is the old do as I say, not as I once did maneuver.
Sure do!
There is no witness required, this part is made up by the imp Crowley who was playing the same eternal carrot-stick trick. However, there is a rather grand gathering of witnesses on the Monadic plane (Kether).
What witnesses here?
The Magus was being destroyed ... as he wished or Willed. He went through the same ordeal with Rose and his child, who died, and Rose went to the Far. Another round, on a higher level, at Cefalu. Departing Chokmah, via the only foolish thread out, is going to dissolve all attachments. It is finished !
My original enquiry to Aleisterion was about the difference it would make if a "fully functioning" 9=2 was involved in the proceedings, but I think I see what you're getting at here: A.C.'s "out of it-ness"/ breakdown was actually a manifestation of the destruction or transmutation of the Magus Therion...
It is finished !
And there is THAT which remains (as in, "I am, that I am'" or as a Yorkshireman might have it, "I am that I am, me")
Yes. If he had not hi t the out phase, I would question the whole significance. As I said, there is a blackout during which time one is semi-conscious and vaguely aware of things being removed and new circuits are wired (metaphysically speaking).
So he had to have gone through the whole scenario revolving around him forgetting the ether as part of his initiation?
[...] "Initiation is a series of directed energy impacts." The impacts always include a switchover, an upgrade, a rewiring, an initiation, and there's always a blackout, or equivalent form of anesthesia.
What's with this definitive Absolute, emphasised twice for good measure? Also,presumably you were speaking from your own personal experience - or at least your own surmising of what would be entailed. But you cannot guarantee this will be the same for everyone, or at least any one other person in this most subjective of initiations ordeals crises.
One really needs to approach the final gate in a "clean" state. (paraphrased).
But it's not Leah that's approaching the final gate (in a drugged state) here, it's Crowley
The Oath of the I* OTO says I will not indulge in (list of drugs) to the point where I lose control of my Will (paraphrased).
And of course, one needs to discover what one's TW is before one can attempt to control its direction.
Nah...she has decided not to do it. But hey!
That's unfortunate, now everybody has had their hopes raised... Is it possible this is temporary, that she was not in the best frame of mind yesterday or something like that, and that she may reconsider again later? And if not, what is the explanation given?
Also hopefully although she has not decided to put anything down it does not mean that both of you will not still be able to divulge relevant information, and especially in your case regarding the information to be found within TKOTSR answering the matters raised earlier and to which you referred.
Hey ho,
N Joyo
... things seem to be getting more nebulous with each post..
This is due to the introduction of acts, oath, actions, concepts, and activities that are relatively, or completely, unknown in this unheard of part of the continuum.
We are all awaiting the revelation of the Oath of Absolute Obedience (no fiddling here), the concept of Absolute Authority (A.'.A.'.), and a lineage derived from the souls of two little childs who died very early.
While waiting, please consider the overall picture of a man who fathered several children, out of several mothers, and ALL the children died (except for the one you can count on one finger, or those who can be counted on one hand who claim the ancestry but have no lineal proof). This was also a man who openly stated that abortion was the big sin (paraphrased).
Move this consideration up a level. Consider the lifelong attempt by AC to have a magical child. "Trust not a stranger, fail not of an heir." Achad was the first poster child.There were others. In the end, there was only Germer, the Mortician of The Tong, named Saturnus, no less. There were leakages (Aquarius, Grant, eventually McM arose and triumpeted. Anyway, AC was semi-obsessed with having children and creating magical childs.
In other words, he was attached to the idea of the continuation of himself (on multiple levels). At Kether, all such attachments are cut, forever. Any other attachments will be also cut. The word "cut" is used extensively in the literature, and "snapped" is also an explanatory term that is used. By force if necessary, as we have seen in the movie in our minds of the Cefalu drama.
Kenneth Grant supplies ... "Faction" ?
I read somewhere where Grant advised a student to "read my books as novels."
What was this "Hierophantic Movement" again, Aleisterion?
That notion will be fully expounded by the proper parties at the proper time. Don't make a fuss of it.
why would "Tahuti" be better than "Thoth"?
It isn't better, just personally preferred. Don't make a big deal out of it.
Yes, that would have made a significant difference had it been clarified earlier.
So true; but then, I am just the babbler; Aliana is the genius.
in the event of something happening to the Beast, would she have had Authority to have "taken over" the AA and more questionably (after Reuss had died also) the OTO.
Certainly A.'.A.'.; she was 8=3; but O.T.O. is merely an outer order, one with which she was (at least) quite familiar, so that shouldn't be too difficult for a genius such as she, in my opinion.
NO - there's no mention there of where this "Aiwaz Ritual" came from, or what it consisted of.
Okay I'll answer that soon...right now I have to hurry.
If by 'true' you mean 'fully functioning', I did say something of the sort. But I think some of it was Shiva's suggestion as well, with qualifications.
Any 9=2 is subject to the possibilities of accidents/violence while embodied.
That shouldn't mean AC's mundane state of everyday consciousness would impede the effectiveness of Therion at 9=2 though.
Interesting.
Earlier you said TKOTSR was your "only" source for Leah being given Absolute Authority, etc. Now it's changing to all the supplemental documents, diaries, letters & whatnot. {Never mind Aliana, I want to break out the whip!}
Ha ha ha! No, I never said such. What I wrote, if I recall, was that as far as I knew, there was nothing said of it in any other biography. As for all other matters, we are using other sources as well.
OK, fair enough, maybe I was making too many demands/ was too demanding on your mental ability (and I don't mean that in a put-down sort of way). Nonetheless, questions & queries do need to be asked, addressed & answered.
No, you're absolutely right! But the Oracle here is my mistress, and I am but her chattering monkey! I do have some mental incapacity now, after the stroke, but things could have been much worse.
This is developing into an amazing story! Is it fiction or fact?
It is factual.
Nah...she has decided not to do it. But hey!
That's unfortunate, now everybody has had their hopes raised... Is it possible this is temporary, that she was not in the best frame of mind yesterday or something like that, and that she may reconsider again later? And if not, what is the explanation given?
Soror Aliana has to postpone her work on the book until a few books arrive this week. It is possible that this break is temporary. She was rather pissed that I had muffed matters a bit, but she is passionate about this project, so I think she might stick with it after the books arrive.
Cheers,
777
That notion will be fully expounded by the proper parties at the proper time. Don't make a fuss of it.
I sense an agenda in the aethyrs. With veils and hints of things to come.
I will make a small fuss of it and ask, "Why are you doing this future secrecy sideshow ?
So true; but then, I am just the babbler; Aliana is the genius.
But Aliana just quit. I'm sure she didn't quit the Great work, but she quit the Little Work that was destined to enlighten the LAShTAL readers ... so around here, she might have acquired the quitter icon. And now we find out that you are The Ape of Aliana.
Any 9=2 is subject to the possibilities of accidents/violence while embodied.
Correct. Any anybody of any grade is so subject to collision. The final, upper-class and bottom-line test of the higher grades is this: Wait and Watch - if the claimant is still standing alive after, say, one year, he or she might be the real deal come to play. I say might, as there are at least a couple of self-promoted Supernals (now RIP) who lived more than a year - it is noteworthy to note that both displayed signs of mental disorder, and both were avid consumers of ethyl alcohol, a medical poison, so they might be considered brain dead while walking.
There is a theory, widely repeated and generally known about, that says Do that and no other shall say Neigh. If we subscribe to the dogma, and I do in this case, a Magister or Magus' vehicle is not going to be in any accidental collision. He or she, as the vehicle, has subscribed to I will interpret all phenomenon as a particular dealing of God with my soul.
The claim-jumpers, always showing signs of skipping a lot of grades, often come to a quick conclusion (see Parsons, J), or they begin to exhibit mental disorder red-flags (see IMotta, M).
Violence is always a potential factor (I refer to "other people" - maybe animals). AC said that folks should pick the sport best calculated to keep one's vehicle in good condition. He choose mountain-climbing. I agree with him. I chose martial arts. Other people chose marital arts. Of these three arts, including mountains, one is specifically designed to be "out of the way" when violence comes. I specifically recommend the martial arts as they include a grading system that has ten degrees, and what the exponent is supposed to demonstrate at each level matches right up on the Tree, and the levels of consciousness match up with One Star.
According to some Hindus, and a few adled Westerners, there are no accidents or acts of violence that are random. It is all part of one's Karmic Vision.
You know how some folks see things different than other folks? This is it.
That shouldn't mean AC's mundane state of everyday consciousness would impede the effectiveness of Therion at 9=2 though.
Al.'. replies: Interesting.
AC goes to lengths to cite that these are two different beings: "The Magus that works through me is so high above me ..." (M w/o Tears, I hope and pray). The Angel, the Magister, and the Magus are states that one gets into, or come over one - they are not daily clothes that are worn in public.
There is always the possibility that all the supernals were fucked up on continuous usage of drugs, and that Therion had no interest no Crowley's shenanigans. It should also be noted, as AC has pointed out, that a Magus has the power to do "his" Will, and nothing else. A 9=2 is out to make a specific change - he is, of course, one-pointed, which is why his true symbol is a lance.
Don't make a fuss of it.
Don't make a big deal out of it.
Nothing to see here, move along!
I don't know whether this is just simply a manifestation of the "rebel response", but whenever I receive this sort of instruction it nearly always has the opposite effect, i.e. it makes me want to look more closely into the matter, with its suggestion of possibly covering something up (even if that is not ultimately or actually the case). Far more effective would have been reverse psychology, which would deter the casual enquirer who would make up the majority of your readers.
What's so hush-hush about this "Hierophantic Movement" it can't be summarised in a couple of short pithy sentences? It's this sort of mystery that gives rise to superstitious & erroneous garbage about it
around here, she might have acquired the quitter icon
Hopefully she will re-consider & produce a wonderful product (soon)
There is a theory, widely repeated and generally known about, that says Do that and no other shall say Neigh. If we subscribe to the dogma, and I do in this case, a Magister or Magus' vehicle is not going to be in any accidental collision.
But it might happen when the Magister/Magus is not in charge - that is (you seem to be saying) not all of the time.. An unfortunate demise would presumably occur during such times before supernal control could be re-established (similar to the example where In the film Avatar a physical vehicle is entered from higher up/ outside)?
He or she, as the vehicle, has subscribed to I will interpret all phenomenon as a particular dealing of God with my soul.
I always try to live by this anyway - without all the formal and karma-invoking swearing - and would unhesitatingly recommend any others to follow suit as well, as an excellent preparatory training if nothing else (if they are not doing so already.)
AC goes to lengths to cite that these are two different beings: "The Magus that works through me is so high above me ..." (M w/o Tears, I hope and pray).
I think it is from there, it reads like an explanatory note from one of his letters.
There is always the possibility that all the supernals were fucked up on continuous usage of drugs
I don't see how so, especially if "they shall not harm ye at all" is considered.
The Angel, the Magister, and the Magus are states that one gets into, or come over one - they are not daily clothes that are worn in public.
You mean states of consciousness, to clarify - but how much so Trance states?
The Angel, the Magister, and the Magus are states that one gets into, or come over one - they are not daily clothes that are worn in public.
Do you consider these states of consciousness are all separate rather than say blending into each other like a continuum of colours on a spectrum? Plus no wo/man [state of being] is an island and there are 'All is One' considerations of Unity (please don't say I'm a fool with all this)...
his true symbol is a lance.
Which is why the woman is not girt with it, arguably (touched upon earlier) since she cannot be a Chokmah characteristic. Or so we re told. Plus they are rather big.
Z Joy
I read somewhere where Grant advised a student to "read my books as novels."
Yes, I read that too, but that's not to say it's true. I knew Kenneth Grant from the mid 1970s until his death, and from the early 1980s was his right-hand man in the Order. He never suggested that to me. After his death, Steffi gave me access to his papers and correspondence, and he doesn't appear to have said such a thing to anyone else.
whenever I receive this sort of instruction it nearly always has the opposite effect, i.e. it makes me want to look more closely into the matter
Oh, that happens to you, too.
Being antiphlogistic. I made a little deal and a fuss of these artificial tylers.
But it might happen when the Magister/Magus is not in charge - that is (you seem to be saying) not all of the time
Right. It can happen at the lower levels as well. The vehicle (in this case, probably the physical body with Id comprehension) can always consciously choose to not obey orders. I have documented a few of these (in the books) and they have been known to kill or severely mess up a defiant vehicular child.
As I am fond of pointing out ...
"An Adept is not an Adept
unless operating in the Light Body"
The Light body is built from above going downwards. The astral body is built from below, moving upward. The causal body is stable in between (Tiphareth). The Adept term is HPB's and Blavatsky's and Bailey's, where an "Adept" is their term for an 8=3.
When NOT operating in the Light Body, he or she is subject to the usual laws of physics as the uninitiated neighbors.
I always try to live by this anyway - without all the formal and karma-invoking swearing
Right. I will have that box of cigars abrogated from the charity and returned to you.
Let's face it. the Oath of a Magister Templi, 8=3. currently residing at the Binah Hotel, until cast out into some lesser sphere to act as its ruler ... is nothing more than a descruption of what would automatically be happening in samadhi. By subscribing to the Oath, one is merely saying, "Okay, I will pretend to be in samadhi according to these rules" ... which i will keep in my mind and thus be prevented from entering samadhi.
The Vow of the Bodhisattva is the same deal. Nobody attains by taking the Oath, but taking the Oath helps one to get into a life-or-death crisis they may not survive ... or they may survive, but their mind may suffer collateral disorder.
as an excellent preparatory training if nothing else
Ah, again you demonstrate the insight.
I don't see how so, especially if "they shall not harm ye at all" is considered.
"Strange drugs" are not addictive. If used regularly, they cease to function (except in micro-doses). The people at Cefalu (with Wolfe possibly abstaining and Russell making fun of Crowley's addiction) were at the higher limits of addiction to common drugs, that are not "strange" and can be obtained in pharmacies and street corners everywhere ... in violation of the I* Oath.
You mean states of consciousness, to clarify - but how much so Trance states?
Anybosy IS what they are in any given moment, which is identified by what they are doing. I have no idea what a trance state is. If you mean temporary catatonia, I have recently cited "blackouts" and such, but all the others are - yes - states of consciousness. I was able to enjoy one for several weeks, once upon a time. I went to work, taught infinitely technical courses, in a lab, where we did these dangerous things, in dental technology. Then, the afternoon being free, I drove home in a golden glow to get back to the Gr.'. W.'., you know.
During this period, not one problem, argument, disaster, or policeman appeared. Yeah, states of consciousness in full consciousness in a crowded city. The thing I have just described, sometimes called the beatific vision, is guaranteed to come along on its own terms and to pass away once the deed is done.
Do you consider these states of consciousness are all separate rather than say blending into each other like a continuum of colours on a spectrum?
It depends on the grade level. Maybe a PhD, or at least a Master's should be required.
I would say that in the early stages, any visions or states are going to be independent and widely-spaced.
A more experienced person, who has a degree of control over their mood, mind, vision, state should be able to switch switch states on demand, but shoulding is often easier than doing. But they'll get the hang of it.
Our Magister, et al, will make no such distinctions, since he or she is groking it all in samadhi, if they are in samadhi at that time, and there are no planes or differing states, brcause they are perceiving the situation before the planes separated.
Plus no wo/man [state of being] is an island and there are 'All is One' considerations of Unity (please don't say I'm a fool with all this)...
This is true all the way up the Tree. Dzogchen, The Great Perfection, then becomes available. Ultimately, you are a Foll, as Atu 0 is our only threat into the sigularity, and "no difference" is noted (in 777) at Ain Soph Aur.
Anywhere from Ip (the Fool, or beyond) and descending, your thesis holds true.
Which is why the woman is not girt with it
The Magus cannot do diddley with his Lance unless there is a Grail handy. At these levels, any distinctions other than Yin and Yang co-equal is doomed. Says so in the I Ching Scripture, and I'm saying it, two.
The preponderance of either yin or yang leads to destruction. So in this very thread, when I hear about switcheroos in Obedience, past, present, or future, with yin/yang components, I become concerned and wish to go to the Yi and be comforted by some other hexagram, but Noo, I must wind this transmission upand get to the isolated island computer where 10D is waiting patiently, but not much longer.
Yes, I read that too, but that's not to say it's true. I knew Kenneth Grant from the mid 1970s until his death, and from the early 1980s was his right-hand man in the Order. He never suggested that to me. After his death, Steffi gave me access to his papers and correspondence, and he doesn't appear to have said such a thing to anyone else.
I was hoping you would comment. Reading as Novels may drop below the threshold. People have assorted reactions to his work. I found them fascination, but only a few gems struck and stuck. That is, there are some objective elements that I hold to be true, but I could not explain his trilogies to another person.
What's so hush-hush about this "Hierophantic Movement" it can't be summarised in a couple of short pithy sentences? It's this sort of mystery that gives rise to superstitious & erroneous garbage about it
Well, that's owing to the fact that I don't know yet. I've a gift, at odd times, for paranormal premonition: I got 1975 as the year of Leah's death, before it was uncovered by Aliana; and I've gotten 2040 as the year of "revelation" -- I don't know what that means, but I do know that I won't be here by then.
Hopefully she will re-consider & produce a wonderful product (soon)
Yes she is writing it...but as I said she's waiting for some books to arrive to get on with it.
This circular notice from 1929 e.v. by Leah Hirsig to the various Thelemites that she had presented herself as the Scarlet Woman to, might be of interest to some here.
In it she declares that she at the time of writing this notice, not only did not have the right to the dignity of being the Scarlet Woman, but she also declares that she never did have this right, despite having represented herself as such in documents and personal relations.
Though Crowley considered her to have been one of those who held the office for a time, Hirsig at this point in her life obviously disagreed.
As far as I know this notice marked her final and official departure from Thelema. I certainly have seen no evidence that would contradict this conclusion.
The original notice is in the Warburg where this photo of it was taken by myself nearly three decades ago.
@patriarch156 First, I'd very much like to thank you for this wonderful document! There are one or two significant points I'd care to make about it, however.
Before that, though, one notes that the signature is definitely genuine: this is the work of Leah Hirsig.
Now then, Leah Hirsig was an incredibly intelligent, discerning, carefully calculating individual! When Aleister left her for Dorothy, Leah's foremost thought was to make a smooth transition from one Scarlet Woman to the next: her concern was for the future of the movement, not for petty, vengeful purposes.
However, what stands out to me, loud and clear, is her choice to capitalize the word "Dignity". She has clearly adopted Crowley's habit of capitalizing words to obtain different quality of meaning. By capitalizing that word, she is saying that the role of Scarlet Woman is important -- i.e. she continues to believe in Thelema. She is merely doing the right thing here, in order not to make waves.
I also think it's very interesting that she uses the original spelling of the Book of the Law (as do I).
Again, thank you for this. I think all that it displays is her wisdom, concern, and dedication to the Thelemic movement.
Fraternally,
777
I think the fact that she no longer used the thelemic greetings speaks volumes, but that is me. This IMO should not come as a surprise.
After all, at this point she had lived as a center of pestilence for several years after AC branding her and Mudd as such, as his first official act referencing the comment on the Book of the Law received in november 1925 e.v., where he ordered other thelemites to shun her and destroy her attempts at correspondence unread.
The original papers branding her as such and stipulating the conditions for her to return to the fold, which never happened, also survives in Warburg.
That she at this point in life, after being cut off from the community of Thelemites as governed by Crowley for several years, when she had managed to gain some sort of normalcy in Switzerland, wanted to distance herself from the whole affair is natural.
Given what she reputedly engaged in as the Scarlet Woman, as mentioned among other places in chapter 37 of Phil Baker’s City of the Beast: the London of Aleister Crowley, she was probably very self-conscious if not downright ashamed, to distance herself from the whole sordid affair.
I take her seemingly respectful tone as an attempt to distance herself from these Thelemites without making any waves, and thereby trying to ensure that they never mentioned her name in connection with Thelema ever again.
Now then, Leah Hirsig was an incredibly intelligent, discerning, carefully calculating individual! When Aleister left her for Dorothy, Leah's foremost thought was to make a smooth transition from one Scarlet Woman to the next: her concern was for the future of the movement, not for petty, vengeful purposes.
Your love and devotion for her is noted, but in the end we will never know. To me it makes no sense at all to revoke ALL SUCH REPRESENTATIONS and furthermore declare TO NEVER HAVE HAD THEM in the first place. This would be way over the top for making a "smooth transition", which in the end happened already 4 years earlier in 1925, although not "smoothly". On the other hand she also could have let everybody know with this memorandum, that she never had meant it to be smooth. I wouldn't put too much importance on the capitalization of "Dignity", if, at all, it was significant to her, it seems to be used here with a vangeance and not to be "smooth".
My personal impression is that she really and simply and once and for all wanted to end this chapter of Thelema for her. Sounds a bit like those letters the people in AA (not that AA, the Alcoholics Anominous I mean) are advised to send out.
Again, thank you for this. I think all that it displays is her wisdom, concern, and dedication to the Thelemic movement.
I think it doesn't. Quite the contrary to be exact.
I think the fact that she no longer used the thelemic greetings speaks volumes, but that is me. This IMO should not come as a surprise.
I didn't realize this, but yes.
Again, thank you for this. I think all that it displays is her wisdom, concern, and dedication to the Thelemic movement.
I think it doesn't. Quite the contrary to be exact.
We have two different views of this, clearly. "Dignity" says quite a bit, especially as this kind of capitalization was Crowley's trademark.
We do know, anyway, that she continued to serve Thelema for some years after this. In fact, she accompanied Aleister for some time as his personal secretary. If she didn't believe, she would not have stayed.
Of course, ultimately she did go another way. Again, that doesn't mean that she no longer believed. Let's not forget, her experience in the Work of Scarlet Woman went deeper than any other Oracle. Her magical intercourse with Aiwaz was, no doubt, life-altering. Let's not forget, too, that when he left her, she told him, "You can never take Aiwaz from me".
@aleisterion in december 1929 e.v. she had had no contact with AC for several years. She certainly did not serve as his secretary after this date. As always I may be mistaken, but please offer proof to the contrary.
the whole sordid affair
I think this echoes the perspective conveyed with my initial post(s) in this thread. It wasn't the glorious love-story, a romance for the ages, as presented by Aleisterion-nor will it continue on and on in the aethers based on "who knows what could happen?"
I take her seemingly respectful tone as an attempt to distance herself from these Thelemites without making any waves, and thereby trying to ensure that they never mentioned her name in connection with Thelema ever again.
This is how it reads to me-and for the reasons you gave.
Aleisterion, I do not wish to sound snarky or unfriendly with my assessment but your posts almost verge on feeling trollish at times (or desperate to hold onto a projected picture which doesn't square with the known facts). You gear shift from presenting information to odd interpretations of it which appeal to "what ifs" and "can't say but all will be revealed." Then there is the dodge of "Hey, I'm just a chattering monkey and boy oh boy is mistress gonna be mad now." Who is this mistress? The author of a book which is on and off and on again-all in matter of days. But then the "chattering monkey" announces certain psychic proclivities which don't seem to be substantiated by more than "I guessed a date right" and "AGAPE is coming" (which means WHAT?).
In my opinion (certainly subject to change), the Leah Hirsig story tells itself with the journals, docs and information we have. It is interesting, weird, sad and wretched. Kudos to her for having the courage to get out of what may have been a run of the mill ordinary life and aiming for something bigger, more exotic and bold. But it was a case of "crash and burn."
Perhaps there is a bit of sarcasm in her use of that word "Dignity" as she formally cast off that which brought her anything BUT-!
In my opinion (certainly subject to change), the Leah Hirsig story tells itself with the journals, docs and information we have.
Right, the question of what went down in Hirsig’s life is a historical question that ought to be answered using normal historical methods. It is not an ideological or even spiritual one that ought to be answered by sentiment or even «divine insight».
What we personally may make out of these historical facts may be open for spiritual and I suppose ideological interpretation, but ascertaining what those facts are is not.
We do know, anyway, that she continued to serve Thelema for some years after this. In fact, she accompanied Aleister for some time as his personal secretary. If she didn't believe, she would not have stayed.
Well, it seems you and Ariana know a lot more than us. Which would be really cool and make the wait for her book more easy. On the other hand, after 1929 it really would be astonishing to have new facts presented. AC did not leave England after 1929 (I think) and there is really no mention of Leah having been there after that date. I guess you have to tickle Ariana into letting out some more (fact-based) teaser for her book. Just being a Leah-fan doesn't seem to be enough.
@the_real_simon_iff I believe AC returned to England and never left in late 1932 after his brief stint in Germany between 1930-1932, but your point still stands.
Hirsig is mentioned as being present in no diary, nor any correspondence by Crowley or any of his compatriots from this time. It would truly as you point out be an astonishing find if there existed evidence to the contrary, particularly if she served as his secretary. It is a period where there exists a lot of surviving historical materials that documents ACs activities in detail.
I believe AC returned to England and never left in late 1932 after his brief stint in Germany between 1930-1932, but your point still stands.
Thanks, how could I - I! - forget his Berlin stunt?!?
Aleisterion, I do not wish to sound snarky or unfriendly with my assessment but your posts almost verge on feeling trollish at times (or desperate to hold onto a projected picture which doesn't square with the known facts).
My sincere apology, I don't mean to come off that way at all. I will refrain from such foolishness in future.
I'm really very sorry for being so obnoxious.
Well, it seems you and Ariana know a lot more than us.
Aliana and I are not any better-informed than anyone here. All we have is common knowledge and insight. (sorry for double-posting)
Aliana and I are not any better-informed than anyone here. All we have is common knowledge and insight. (sorry for double-posting)
Sorry for spelling her wrong.
Anyway, saying Leah was a secretary to AC after 1929 while saying not having more than common knowledge doesn't add up. Well, I guess we all have to wait for "the book" - aren't we great at that here?
I'm really very sorry for being so obnoxious.
Oh, come on! I do not think you are "obnoxious" and I do hope you keep posting here! You're one of the gang! I'm simply being straightforward in regards to how you back up and support your POINTS (or DON'T)!
Instead of "refraining," I would like to see you rise to the challenge of...having your statements challenged! 🙂
Anyway, saying Leah was a secretary to AC after 1929 while saying not having more than common knowledge doesn't add up. Well, I guess we all have to wait for "the book" - aren't we great at that here?
I thought that she was, but I was mistaken. Maybe the book would not be of much interest, it seems.
I thought that she was, but I was mistaken. Maybe the book would not be of much interest, it seems.
No! It will be of interest! We all need a book on Leah! She deserves it! If it shows she wasn't much of a Thelemite after 1929, who cares? I hope this one instance of Leah's 1929 notice does not affect your (Aliana's) work! Keep up the great work!
But be prepared when announcing it on Lashtal, we are a very hard-core skeptic gang to be convinced of anything! Ask @RTC or @herupakraath...
Leah is certainly worthy of a book!!! Write On!
Speaking of books, I just received Ben Fernee's new Caduceus Books catalogue, where at the top of the list is this item:
1st Editions issued by Crowley
The Equinox, Vol.I Nos 1 - 10, 1909 - 14 1st Ed. Standard edition with paper covered boards bearing coloured Equinox design, cloth spine.
Approximately 300+ words of annotations including 8 ownership signatures of William George Barron, 9 ownership signatures of a N. Armstrong dated 1941 and another illegible ownership signature dated 1909. The handwriting of the annotations are consistent with the Barron signatures including annotations to the Enochian material
William George Barron, became a Thelemite in 1925 and was with Crowley in in Tunis when the Beast received in a trance the Heart of the Master text. Crowley wrote in his diary that Barron saw an inverted cone of blue light in the courtyard just as Crowley nearly fainted. Barron practiced sex magick with Leah Hirsig, fathered her child and married her, though they soon parted ways. Most interesting is is the approximately 180 words or symbols which he has added to the Symbolic Representation of the Universe Enochian Material. Clearly Barron had been studying Enochian in depth. The annotations outline:- hidden significaces in the Holy Table; corrections to the seven Names of God (which not even the Angels are able to pronounce); the names of seven planetary beings, five corrections to the names of the Angels; elemental and astrological attributions of the Enochian letters and, apparently, an additional Enochian letter! There are also the 60+ words and number annotations to the Book of the Law. These include suggestions as the the word of Nuit (I, 23) and the nature os Asar and Isa (I, 49). Barrons handwriting is pretty legible most, but not all, the time.
Barron's bookplate features a pentagram and a phrase in Hebrew meaing "And their enemy was defeated".
The binding of the standard copies is notoriously weak so, as is usual, there is considerable wear especially affecting the labels and cloth with much weakened binding. Binding of one volume split. Tape marks affecting a number of volumes. There is occasional damp staining and also marks. Please see images. These will be supplied with mylar protection.
From the Clive Harper Collection
Order Reference CH-9-23-022 £4850
This looks like a real gem! Certainly one that hopefully a scholar might have access to such notes. The references to The Book of the Law may well have been influenced by Leah.
did not have the right to the dignity of being the Scarlet Woman, but she also declares that she never did have this right,
Soror Capricornus, the Grand Master Baphomet of Solar Lodge used to proclaim her humility and unworthiness continually, verbally, recommending on a regular basis that we, the students, should consider adopting a similar attitude as it was the key to success.
It doesn't matter what anybody says or writes, or thinks about becoming. A person is what they are doing [or being] in any given moment - other factors are superficial fluff.
Your love and devotion for her is noted, but in the end we will never know.
But A.'. has a direct, transcendental connection into the Cefalu Scenario, and he is trying to get the story manifested so that we all will know ... or at least believe, accept, or reject the tale, if it ever gets written or he breakks down and tells it simply, which (in his words) "would give it away."
letting out some more (fact-based) teaser for her book.
The fact-based part is apparently, as announced, dependent on certain gooks that are currently coming through the tricky supply-chain delivery system. The existence of any book at all is dependent upon the status of the Labor Stricke.
The word, if, iff, and iffy may be applied to this project. The term psychodrama may be applied to certain aspects.
never left in late 1932 after his brief stint in Germany between 1930-1932, but your point still stands.
Yes, I remember that. He started off praising Hitler. Then he found himself in Germany as Hitler was taking over. I believe he had some tricky times getting out before the big lockdown.
I guess we all have to wait for "the book" - aren't we great at that here?
You are also waiting for 10D? It contains the final secret of everything. I will deliver, and we are still waiting for RTC's Appenix or book or something along that line as promised, but I remember when he said "something else has come up" and the promised book with the promised appendix would be postponed. After that, no further anything has been presented - except for periodic appearances dripping with disgust at we old-aeon losers. Contrasting that, I'm sure Michael Staley has something in the works. There is also a "new system of magic" as directed by mysterious Egyptian Adepts. Pardon me for being off-topic, and I tried to contain the list of potential barn-burners in one paragrah. Dis I miss anything?
I thought that she was, but I was mistaken. Maybe the book would not be of much interest, it seems.
Then you will have to tell it simply, thus "giving it away," pr you must drop it. There may be other alternatives. I do not mean to present you with stern alternatives, but to continue, while "guarding" certain critical data, is the carrot-stick we know too well.
Dis I miss anything?
You simply forgot (no wonder, it is the longest wait of all) the Collected Letters, Collected Diaries, Even More Unabridged Confessions etc. by the OTO.
(the longest wait of all) ... by the OT ...
There's a rule or a guideline or a whim that says after 20 years, the promisor is labelled a liar who does not have the goods or the will (goodwill) to hold true to their word.
At that point, waiters are advised to stop waiting in order to avoid prolonged disappointment.
I am actually waiting for "a certain secret document," mentioned in One Star, regarding the Ip. I don't think liarism is involved, but the dangling of the carrot-stick is so o9bvious it might be considered obscene.
There seems to be a profusion of carrots these days.
2
the point being that Crowley actually refers to Leah in Confessions as the 'Ape of Thoth', meant to be not a form of the deity itself but the inhuman companion who babbles incessant nonsense - a metaphor for the normal everyday human consciousness chattering away. I would have thought his use was either intended as derogatory/ condemnatory in terms of what came out of Leah's mouth or at least jokey rather than, ahem, an allegation or a suggestion of her divinity!
@hadg: Yes where does AC say this about her in the Confessions?
I have 2 copies of the Confessions - the RKP hardback, and the Bantam paperback which contains all my notes, underlinings and annotations. I have spent a good twenty minutes searching for either of them, but both have chosen to go missing at the moment & I do not propose devoting any more time to the hunt. Maybe someone else can assist: I am certain AC used the term "The Ape of Thoth" extensively throughout when referring to Leah, in lieu of "The Ape of Tahuti". In fact I would lay bets he didn't use the latter term at all.
"Strange drugs" are not addictive. If used regularly, they cease to function (except in micro-doses).
The actual "strangeness" was not mentioned, but the point still holds: in that the supernals should not be affected (harmed) by any alcohol (wine) or drugs..
I have no idea what a trance state is. If you mean temporary catatonia, I have recently cited "blackouts" and such, but all the others are - yes - states of consciousness.
By trance I mean temporary (length to be determined & varies) cessation of thought/ thinking activity usually achieved (activated) by meditation - some trance states being more profound (longer, deeper) than others.
Yeah, states of consciousness in full consciousness in a crowded city. The thing I have just described, sometimes called the beatific vision, is guaranteed to come along on its own terms and to pass away once the deed is done.
You're saying it's possible to exist in several different states of consciousness at the same time but with the 'highest' being predominant, I take it?
Ultimately, you are a Fool, as Atu 0 is our only threat into the singularity, and "no difference" is noted (in 777) at Ain Soph Aur.
Yes I was getting at the point that beyonder this (Unity) there is the consideration of the 3 Ains, where something reduces into nothingness under its 3 forms.
The Magus cannot do diddley with his Lance unless there is a Grail handy. At these levels, any distinctions other than Yin and Yang co-equal is doomed. Says so in the I Ching Scripture, and I'm saying it, two.
Ha - nice!
Yes, I read that too [KG: "Read my books as novels"], but that's not to say it's true. I knew Kenneth Grant from the mid 1970s until his death, and from the early 1980s was his right-hand man in the Order. He never suggested that to me. After his death, Steffi gave me access to his papers and correspondence, and he doesn't appear to have said such a thing to anyone else.
@shiva: I was hoping you would comment. Reading as Novels may drop below the threshold. People have assorted reactions to his work. I found them fascination, but only a few gems struck and stuck. That is, there are some objective elements that I hold to be true, but I could not explain his trilogies to another person.
This is probably not the best place to go into this at any depth but KG's fictive-based approach is not very useful and actively unhelpful when it comes to giving supposedly historically based information, however.
If we're considering the Typhonian Trilogies they certainly seem devoid of any type of AA Class D 'how-to' instructive material, or magickal record of KG's own personal experience (curious, as that was his main tenet regarding admittance into his own ['Typhonian'] version of the OTO), or back-up supplementary evidence pertaining to his record of how (T)OTO meetings progressed, as outlined in e.g. Hecate's Fountain. There are however 2 major 'received texts' in their own right but which appear unrelated to the Book of the Law (i.e. did not come from Aiwass). All this is not to say his output was without any merit by any means, though. Er, back to the subject of Leah again...
First, I'd very much like to thank you for this wonderful document
Do you mean to say Aleisterion, with all your looking into Leah etc, you never came across this document before?!?!
Now then, Leah Hirsig was an incredibly intelligent, discerning, carefully calculating individual! When Aleister left her for Dorothy, Leah's foremost thought was to make a smooth transition from one Scarlet Woman to the next: her concern was for the future of the movement, not for petty, vengeful purposes.
What is your opinion as to why Fate decreed she was no longer A.C.'s S.W.? And without waiting for Aliana's book, is there just one solid piece of proof Leah continued with Thelema at any point after 1930?
[H]er choice to capitalize the word "Dignity". She has clearly adopted Crowley's habit of capitalizing words to obtain different quality of meaning
Like Crowley did with his essay on "Duty"?
I think the fact that she no longer used the thelemic greetings speaks volumes, but that is me.
You don't use them either! (What does that speak?)
Let's not forget, too, that when he left her, she told him, "You can never take Aiwaz from me".
Source again, please?
My sincere apology, I don't mean to come off that way at all. I will refrain from such foolishness in future.
I'm really very sorry for being so obnoxious.
This "Uriah Heep" type of refrain is becoming a little repetitive!
Aliana and I are not any better-informed than anyone here.
I thought that [Leah] was, but I was mistaken. Maybe the book would not be of much interest, it seems.
I really hope you are going to be able to back up your assertions re Symonds' TKOTSR too, without any sort of of these sort of prevarifications, excuses, apologies, etc!!
This looks like a real gem! Certainly one that hopefully a scholar might have access to such notes.
From the Clive Harper Collection
Order Reference CH-9-23-022 £4850
That's a bit steep to pay for a few pencilled annotations in a set that's literally falling apart. Clivey-baby's going to be coining it in, big stylee!
Er, has anyone tried to sell you the Brooklyn Bridge lately?
The references to The Book of the Law may well have been influenced by Leah
Well we just don't know do we - do you fancy paying just shy of five grand to "maybe" find out?
we are still waiting for RTC's Appenix or book or something along that line as promised,
I remember it was going to be called originally "The Governing Dynamics of Thelema". A snazzy, impressive sounding title for what are so far blank pages (cf. "The Wit & Wisdom of Ronald Reagan [or insert your favoured politican here]"
Dis I miss anything?
Wasn't @elitemachinery going to do something when I was last here (some spin on Aleice in Wonderland or something)? And Amado's famed "lost" Book of Desolation are 2 more that spring to mind.
N Joy
Maybe someone else can assist: I am certain AC used the term "The Ape of Thoth" extensively throughout when referring to Leah, in lieu of "The Ape of Tahuti". In fact I would lay bets he didn't use the latter term at all.
The generally excellent index contains zero mention of any "Ape of Tahuti". It does include "Ape of Thoth; see Hirsig, Leah."
On p. 791, he says that "Early in January, I received a visit from the lady hereinafter called The Ape of Thoth, and her elder sister." In fact, she is never referred to by any other name, and her "title", so to speak, is generally or perhaps always, after the first reference, abbreviated as "the Ape".
KG's fictive-based approach
How do you define "fictive based approach?" I would assume "based in fiction" but how do you mean, exactly? Is not Crowley EQUALLY "fictive based?" He has humanoids with animal heads and reanimated corpses with magical wee-wees and recommends not only the study of books filled with the most fantastical of comic book characters but constructing rituals of devotion to these same "fictives." Is Grant called to the carpet because he identifies similar factors in more modern works? In other words, Ancient Egypt is where it's at but Lovecraft need not apply. The biblical statement that "A Prophet is honored everywhere except in his hometown" might be re-written to state "in his timeframe." With Antiquity comes more..."Dignity."
If Crowley cautions the newbie to avoid attaching any objective value to the productions of his own mind then Grant follows suit with his pervasive Advaita-which, in my opinion, is key to understanding the Trilogies.
not very useful and actively unhelpful when it comes to giving supposedly historically based information, however
Kenneth's point was never to deliver
historically based information
for peer review and inclusion in an academic journal.
If he DOES appeal to such (whether it is shown to have integrity or to be dubious), it is for his larger purposes which go far beyond assembling "factual information."
Kenneth's work ultimately goes beyond "fact" and "fiction," making use of both to push the limits of the reader's Ontology and, thereby, their MAGICK).
the Typhonian Trilogies they certainly seem devoid of any type of AA Class D 'how-to' instructive material
They were never meant to be "instruction manuals" or "recipe books" (see above).
or magickal record of KG's own personal experience
He does share anecdotes from his own work throughout the Trilogies, whether that be stories of sharing ether with Crowley or working with Nu Isis Lodge to channel the material which is distilled in Wisdom of S'Lba.
All this is not to say his output was without any merit
Which is good because it is certainly filled with loads of merit for those who can grok and roll with his methodology.
Er, back to the subject of Leah again...
🙂
I had to take the bait. Couldn't help myself.
[H]er choice to capitalize the word "Dignity". She has clearly adopted Crowley's habit of capitalizing words to obtain different quality of meaning
Like Crowley did with his essay on "Duty"?
I do the same with my own writing quite often and believe it derives from my early readings and immersion in William Blake as a young teen trying to be a Prophet-Poet of the same ilk. I mention this because I do not think the capitalizing of words for emphasis and meaning is at all unique to Crowley.
Clivey-baby's going to be coining it in, big stylee!
I think he already sold all the material already and now it's being offered on the second hand market.
the point still holds: in that the supernals should not be affected (harmed) by any alcohol (wine) or drugs..
Of course not. They are up there, while the dense vehicle is poisoning itself with common drugs, taken regularly, in violation of the Oath of the I**. Yes, you will do as he says ... not does.
some trance states being more profound (longer, deeper) than others.
I see. Yes, you describe the process of slowing thought, which is usually prerequisite to stop, although that one (a full stop), would be reserved for Magisters and jum-claimers. Sometimes it seems like the jumpers are still thinking.
You're saying it's possible to exist in several different states of consciousness at the same time but with the 'highest' being predominant, I take it?
I was describing Tiphareth during the VIIIth Aethyr operation. There was no separation of consciousness between any levels. Everything wasb balanced and the balance flowed.
where something reduces into nothingness under its 3 forms.
Perdurabo tells us about that in 333, and he refers to the process of "coming in" (to manifestation) as a dude, dame, or dork. But on the way "out," he pretty much draws the line at pre-Ip, merely hinting further outward, or inward, depending on one's perspective. I believe Hadit (the monad) will be found within, not out there, as described in One Star.
You don't use them either! (What does that speak?)
Neither do I. As a matter of fact, I don't know anybody who ever used that greeting, except formally, in a rite, or before a meal. I only use it twice a year, these days. It was made-up dogma practice, intended to keep everyone's mind on the Will. Nobody in their right mind will use the Greeting in public or at the doctor's office or in court.
Further, how many people do you know that give AL tp everyone they meet? I did, once, for about a minute, as we were distributing copies at the publication ceremony. The public politely held its distance, but then they all got a copy. Note:" AC did not give copies to everyone he met. So much for that nonsense.
Wasn't @elitemachinery going to do something
Yes. I am in contact with Fr.'. Elite. I would not expect anything soon.
the Typhonian Trilogies they certainly seem devoid of any type of AA Class D 'how-to' instructive material
KH replies: They were never meant to be "instruction manuals" or "recipe books" (see above).
JB cites the difference between Grant and Crowley. KH cites that Grant's work was not intended to be practical, just like Bailey's works are filled with detailed explanations about what happens in an Initiation, but without any how-to-do-it. Both may provide a wealth of information.
KH cites that Grant's work was not intended to be practical
Now, I didn't quite say it as such, did I?
For those who can apply it, KG's work is remarkably and imminently applicable (i.e "practical").
I would say that he simply does not do "walk throughs" (which the majority of interested parties are looking for). Instead, Grant has constructed his writing to serve as an Induction Mechanism. This is why it is often said that Grant doesn't "write about Magic." Instead, his writings ARE the Magic!
That is not mere enthusiasm or adulation on my part. It is a matter of adjusting the dials within...of learning how to read in a new way. I know people who just cannot get or do this. I've tried to explain but even my explanations get routed into the default mechanisms for processing information and input.
Kenneth Grant's Trilogies, in my estimate, are a Sutra which functions as both a Mandala and a means to find the hidden doorways leading outside its purview. Sutras are not books filled with poetry and symbolism to be "decoded" into the lower rational brain. The symbolism therein becomes more than allegory and is intended to lift the Aspirant upward (or inward) into spaces which that lower brain cannot comprehend.
The Initiate has to let go of the lower mind's way of working and adapt to the conditions in the newly entered hyperspheric spaces.
I agree that Grant and Bailey are not forthcoming with the
how-to-do-it
but I will add that I do not see either author/guide/teacher as floating about for the "advanced crowd" who learned "how to" from previous sources.
Both writers speak to a depth within the human Being(ness) which can trigger a resonance or response even if the reasoning mind is baffled and befuddled. If that Depth-Being is stirred and begins to wink and blink, it will begin to find the "practical instruction" it needs.
Ergo, if anyone is so drawn in, I would encourage exploring the worlds of Grant (and Bailey), even if they seem incomprehensible. Certain things will stick and echo and endure. In time, they will evoke Change.
Instead, Grant has constructed his writing to serve as an Induction Mechanism. This is why it is often said that Grant doesn't "write about Magic." Instead, his writings ARE the Magic!
That is not mere enthusiasm or adulation on my part. It is a matter of adjusting the dials within...of learning how to read in a new way. I know people who just cannot get or do this. I've tried to explain but even my explanations get routed into the default mechanisms for processing information and input.
Kenneth Grant's Trilogies, in my estimate, are a Sutra which functions as both a Mandala and a means to find the hidden doorways leading outside its purview. Sutras are not books filled with poetry and symbolism to be "decoded" into the lower rational brain. The symbolism therein becomes more than allegory and is intended to lift the Aspirant upward (or inward) into spaces which that lower brain cannot comprehend.
The Initiate has to let go of the lower mind's way of working and adapt to the conditions in the newly entered hyperspheric spaces.
While I am not a big fan of Kenneth Grant's writings myself, having never gotten much out of them, I do get what you mean. You might find it profitable to look into Jung's concept of circumambulation if you have not already, in order to describe what you are thinking about. At least I have found it useful to express similar ideas.
In fact this is how I approach and I believe how Crowley intended to approach the initiations in the O.T.O. and the work as an aspirant in the A.'.A.'. The end goal is not to decode anything, or even master specific techniques. Though mastering techniques certainly is part of the process as an aspirant in the Outer College, both in terms of having a wide toolbox to produce the two crises on the path of the pilgrim, as well as in terms of being able to instruct and test those whom you serve, wcreating a e the chain all the way to the wrong in the beginning.
Hence the whole point of the Outer College in terms of attainment is not to master the techniques, but rather to achieve a systematic (Crowley would say scientific but as someone who work academically and clinically as a neuropsychologist I dislike that concept) knowledge of the nature and powers of ones own being as a Probationer. Then in turn to gain control of the nature and powers of ones being as a Neophyte, of the foundation of ones own being as a Zelator, the vacillations of ones own being as a Practicus, the attractions and repulsions of ones own being as a Philosophus, and finally the aspiration of ones own being as a Dominis Liminis. The temple being thus built in a balanced way in all the abysses in the east, west, north, and south, one may start as an Adeptus Minor without the work to encounter the Companion that awaits one in the abyss of height and depth. The tasks facilitates the attainments of those particular steps on the path of the Great Work, not the other way around.
Similarly with the secret of the Sovereign Sanctuary of the Gnosis, a secret that Crowley informs us in the initiatory system he wrote is incommunicable. The whole point of the system is to partake in various mysteries, first those of the lesser mysteries of incarnation, then the greater mysteries of redemption. All of these mysteries that one partakes of are in my understanding expressions of the central secret, allowing one to engage in what Jung referred to as circumambulation around something that is inexpressible until one, to use one phrase from the initiations sees with ones ears and hears with ones eyes, allowing the speech in the silence to start speaking truth in song.
It is this inner half of the part that is incommunicable and which allows one to IMO participate in the work of the Sovereign Sanctuary of the Gnosis. The outer part, the stuff is mostly nonsense dust in the eyes of the profane without this inner part, and would IMO to any relatively sane, grown up and educated person be silly. I believe that this is why Crowley in his extenuation on the Book of the Law III:52, points out that the sexual act is symbolic of the miracle of the mass, and not as many IME erroneously assume, the other way around. Indeed, Jung wrote regarding this process:
"The path then would be a circumambulation around a center that one can not reach or view directly, except through experiencing the various reflections (lies) that points towards this inner core (truth). Gradually the inner truth is veiled provided that one is open and humble enough to mistake the image of an image for that which can not be imagined. Hence the point is the centre of a circle that is created, so to speak, by the circumambulation of the soul. But at this point is the 'centre of all things', a God-image. This is an idea that still underlies the mandala-symbols in modern dreams."
Correction regarding the Jung quote at the end due to my careless editing of my response. The Jung quote consisted only of the following (the first part were my own words): «Gradually the inner truth is veiled provided that one is open and humble enough to mistake the image of an image for that which can not be imagined. Hence the point is the centre of a circle that is created, so to speak, by the circumambulation of the soul. But at this point is the 'centre of all things', a God-image. This is an idea that still underlies the mandala-symbols in modern dreams.»
I thought that she was, but I was mistaken. Maybe the book would not be of much interest, it seems.
Then you will have to tell it simply, thus "giving it away," pr you must drop it. There may be other alternatives. I do not mean to present you with stern alternatives, but to continue, while "guarding" certain critical data, is the carrot-stick we know too well.
Actually, I was being sarcastic. I think it is an appealing read. The genius behind the writing is what makes this interesting. It will be attacked from every angle, as absurd. But the literary force of this work gets it up the hill.
I have spent a good twenty minutes searching for either of them, but both have chosen to go missing at the moment & I do not propose devoting any more time to the hunt. Maybe someone else can assist: I am certain AC used the term "The Ape of Thoth" extensively throughout when referring to Leah, in lieu of "The Ape of Tahuti". In fact I would lay bets he didn't use the latter term at all.
No, he did not, simply because it's easier to say Thoth.
The actual "strangeness" was not mentioned, but the point still holds: in that the supernals should not be affected (harmed) by any alcohol (wine) or drugs..
Ultimately, they aren't harmed, as the "harm" is merely temporal and illusory: all of us are immortal. If you take the Law literally, you're going to wind up with superstition. This particular superstition is very dangerous, as it makes Thelemites think they can partake as desired, to their own eventual demise.
Do you mean to say Aleisterion, with all your looking into Leah etc, you never came across this document before?!?!
I've looked as far as means and opportunity allow, which isn't far.
What is your opinion as to why Fate decreed she was no longer A.C.'s S.W.? And without waiting for Aliana's book, is there just one solid piece of proof Leah continued with Thelema at any point after 1930?
Fate or destiny is simply the path of necessity; and necessity varies per individual. Leah's talents were many: was she the "greatest" Scarlet Woman? None of them was, as each had her unique qualities.
I never suggested that there was proof. I suggested that there are many reasons why one would renounce such a checkered past. Also, being back home in Switzerland, the last thing she would want is a horde of Thelemites wanting to see the sixth Scarlet Woman.
Let's not forget, too, that when he left her, she told him, "You can never take Aiwaz from me".
Source again, please?
It was a paraphrase from her desertion diary, which I do not have on hand (it's on an old laptop).
I really hope you are going to be able to back up your assertions re Symonds' TKOTSR too, without any sort of of these sort of prevarifications, excuses, apologies, etc!!
It arrives in the mail any time now.
I do the same with my own writing quite often and believe it derives from my early readings and immersion in William Blake as a young teen trying to be a Prophet-Poet of the same ilk. I mention this because I do not think the capitalizing of words for emphasis and meaning is at all unique to Crowley.
No, but capitalizing "Dignity" there illustrates how highly she holds the Office.
By the way, I agree with the assessment that each of Kenneth Grant's books is a magical adventure.
Cheers,
777
Aliana just gave me the go-ahead to reveal more info about the book. She is confident that, no matter what they know, they'll want to read this. It's just that good. Here, by the way, is the author, Soror Aliana:
Note that we have both sworn a Magical Oath to see this project through to completion. This magnificent book will see the light of day. It may be self-published, but that's better than not at all.
Cheers,
777
Let's not forget, too, that when he left her, she told him, "You can never take Aiwaz from me".
It was a paraphrase from her desertion diary, which I do not have on hand (it's on an old laptop).
Too bad that you always seem to be away of your sources. Thanks to this thread I read some Leah Hirsig stuff during the last weeks and I do not remember her saying this, even paraphrased. Anybody else?
It's a paraphrase (she didn't say "Aiwaz"), from the first letter to Crowley, I think. I think all that stuff got published in the recent book, Three Chapters in My Life by Jon Lange.
Here are some other interesting quotes from Hirsig following her independence.
Showing her determination to continue working in the G.'.W.'.B.'., of which she was a M.'.T.'.:
"I shall develop my own path." (Sept.21, 1924)
"Remember that Alostrael, Babalon, the Scarlet Woman, lives forever. Leah Hirsig dies but then I never knew her." (Sept.26, 1924)
"Understand that ye are not to think that Aleister Crowley deserted me. He did not. He liberated me." (Sept.26, 1924)
Cheers,
777