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dom
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Posted by: @ignant666

[Sorry if this appears twice- i posted, and then edited to add two more sources, and the post disappeared- aha, the "too many links" problem!]

Who in Russia acknowledged this conspiracy? I bet he is in trouble. I am sure Putin would have preferred to keep that quiet.

He isn't doing such a good job then. Here are some sources to get you caught up:

https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2016/10/trump-putin-alt-right-comintern/506015/

https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2017/01/putin-trump-le-pen-hungary-france-populist-bannon/512303/

https://www.rightwingwatch.org/report/the-rise-of-the-traditionalist-international-how-the-american-right-learned-to-love-moscow-in-the-era-of-trump/

https://www.nybooks.com/daily/2018/03/16/ivan-ilyin-putins-philosopher-of-russian-fascism/

https://www.algemeiner.com/2019/07/25/putins-rasputin-helps-spread-fascism-in-europe/

I see that the traitorous fool Flynn was pardoned by Idiot Number 1. How did the Great and Mighty Adept Wasserman fit into all this?  Did he get swept up by the rise of the American Black Lodge's hold on power in the last four years?  How?  What did he do?

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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Shiva
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Posted by: @dom

I see that the traitorous fool Flynn was pardoned by Idiot Number 1.

Why are you rummaging around in USA politics?  I'm sure you can find fine examples of "traitorous" "idiots" in your own country.

You are trending today towards stirring the pot with your condescension. Say, you aren't drunk this morning, are you? Your ability to ties several unlinked events together in a coherency is rather feeble. You are using the curse word, idiot, overmuch ... perhaps committing some soul to the asylum every other post or two.


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dom
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Posted by: @shiva
Posted by: @dom

I see that the traitorous fool Flynn was pardoned by Idiot Number 1.

Why are you rummaging around in <other people's>

Threads?  

 

Either contribute OT or move on. 

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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Shiva
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Posted by: @dom

Either contribute OT or move on. 

I will move on to try to get you to realize that your posts, in general, reflect that of a conceited know-it-all who (often) makes really dim-witted conclusions based on your personal "like/dislike" mode of the moment that very often includes derogatory terms like "idiot" or "nut job."

Although these demeaning, imitation of Crowley in poisonous pen mode, outbursts can be entertaining (sometimes), it still drags the tone of the post down to gutter-level, second circuit demonstrations. People who swear, curse, or otherwise use low-level terminology constantly are considered "dirty-mouthed." You are one level above those, but you are still stuck in a condescending rut whereby your opinions show everyone how opinionated you have become. Words like "idiot," etc, can be useful at times, but when uttered every other post, it paints a dim picture of either your upbringing or your developed vanity.

That's all.

Since I have been bugging you repeatedly to try to refine your rapture, I see it is of no use, and I will now stop. Others have ceased to point out the ridiculous pattern of your thought processes, and I can do no better than join their indifference.


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dom
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Posted by: @shiva
Posted by: @dom

Either contribute OT or move on. 

I will move on to try to get you to realize that your posts, in general, reflect that of a conceited know-it-all who (often) makes really dim-witted conclusions based on your personal "like/dislike" mode of the moment that very often includes derogatory terms like "idiot" or "nut job."

Although these demeaning, imitation of Crowley in poisonous pen mode, outbursts can be entertaining (sometimes), it still drags the tone of the post down to gutter-level, second circuit demonstrations. People who swear, curse, or otherwise use low-level terminology constantly are considered "dirty-mouthed." You are one level above those, but you are still stuck in a condescending rut whereby your opinions show everyone how opinionated you have become. Words like "idiot," etc, can be useful at times, but when uttered every other post, it paints a dim picture of either your upbringing or your developed vanity.

That's all.

Since I have been bugging you repeatedly to try to refine your rapture, I see it is of no use, and I will now stop. Others have ceased to point out the ridiculous pattern of your thought processes, and I can do no better than join their indifference.

Hey Shiva do you watch the news?   The "idiots" in question are the greatest threat to American democracy since Joseph McCarthy, apologies if you don't think that's significant or worthy a little bit of emotive description.    Last time, police someone else I want to stay OT, cheers.    

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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Shiva
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Posted by: @dom

The "idiots" in question are the greatest threat to American democracy

And you are stirring the pot by bringing in something in a country other than yours and making claims, and denouncements, of a political nature, and your understanding of the war taking place behind the scenes seems to be limited to what you read in the news. Who owns the news outlets?


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dom
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Posted by: @shiva
Posted by: @dom

The "idiots" in question are the greatest threat to American democracy

And you are stirring the pot by bringing in something in a country other than yours and making claims, and denouncements, of a political nature, and your understanding of the war taking place behind the scenes seems to be limited to what you read in the news. Who owns the news outlets?

I don't appreciate your "deep state" conspiratorial dumb nonsense.  Keep it OT, where I or anyone else resides is irrelevant.  

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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Shiva
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[indifference]


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dom
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Posted by: @shiva

[indifference]

Really? If only.

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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dom
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Re; "Alt-right" recruitment?  Brilliant clear thinking video studies about how modern internet-savvy "Alt-right" recruitment pans out; first one circa 7 minutes long the next one longer;

 

The Alt-Right Playbook: Introduction - YouTube

The Alt-Right Playbook: How to Radicalize a Normie - YouTube

 

 

 

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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wellreadwellbred
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Good and evil described as illusory ideas, and as what The Black Brothers "only see",  "and often [with] little grey between":

"Crowley termed these individuals [individuals that in "crossing the Abyss" remain attached to their ego-self] the Black Brothers, the counterpoint to the Great White Brotherhood of egoless adepts. The Black Brothers only see good and evil, and often little grey between, while those that successfully make the transition through the Abyss understand the subjectivity of good and evil—and that these ideas are in fact illusory."

(Source: Chapter 2 Philosophy, Thelema: An Introduction to the Life, Work & Philosophy of Aleister Crowley, by Colin D. Campbell, with foreword by Don Milo Duquette, Llewellyn Publications, 2018.)


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ignant666
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So some guy i never heard of says Crowley says...

And why again do we care?


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Shiva
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Posted by: @ignant666

And why again do we care?

In this case, "we" don't. The point of non-attached interest, to me and "not-you," is that people continue (2018) to ride Crowley's coat-tails, and this one has a foreword by Don Milo, who I hear is a nice guy but he's also a member of the One True Order of Duplexity, which "we" all know is listed under the Title Topic of this very thread.

With such profound synchronicity afloat, this now becomes a phenomena, an unusual happening, and "we" are "sworn to interpret it ..."

Therefore, I will take up the burden of interpretation for "us" and say ...

All popular prophets set out a core philosophy. This is the white zone.

All popular prophets, after they are dead, have followers, or adherents, or commentators, or critics who make profits (in money or status) by explaining the prophet (or his message) to the general public of common dorks, including "us." This is the Black Zone.

So the prophets are Good (Godly), while the Profits are Evil (dual)(D-evil).

Anyone among "us" who has a fixed box in which their mind dwells can easily see and agree to this linear thesis (cited above) that people who ride the Prophet's coat-tails for Profits are bad black lodge brothers.

But those among "us" whose minds are open will diligently search amongst the copy-cat coat-tails to see if they can discover something NEW. These searchers and re-searchers, along with any NEW material they find, are the GRAY zone.

And those among "us" who neither view any Prophet as white, nor any Profiteer as black, and have already seen the infinite shades of gray, don't care about these distinction, knowing by experience that ...

It depends on the circumstances

U.G. said, "It's okay to steal. Just don't get caught."

He also said, "You should beat your parents thoroughly for getting you into this mess." 

Keeping all this wisdom in "our" minds, but only temporarily, "we" must return to the first line of this post where is says, "In this case, "we" don't." [care]


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dom
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Posted by: @wellreadwellbred

 

"Crowley

..........(the most egotistical self-aggrandizing child-man) ............

 

 

Posted by: @wellreadwellbred

 

 termed these individuals [individuals that in "crossing the Abyss" remain attached to their ego-self] the Black Brothers, the counterpoint to the Great White Brotherhood of egoless adepts.

 

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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wellreadwellbred
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(The following quotes from me and JJB, are taken from page 2 in this thread:) 

[Me:] "... via @Shiva :

I agree with this from Shiva’s REPLY #117337 in this thread:“… there is no such thing as a cohesive Black Lodge. With each member being dedicated to themselves, their profits, and their longevity, there can be no “common goal.” This does not mean individuals cannot “breathe together,” which any sensible business-person would do if they wanted to promote their business, agenda, or profits.”
Thus it is not beneficial to accuse groups of individual persons for having a common cohesive “Black Lodge” goal. As any individual person bound to be unsuccessful and/or bound to be lost in the abyss, or already lost in the abyss, will express this in an unique way.
"

JJB: "However the "common cohesive goal"would be to promote their "business, agenda and profits" in other words their interests, in terms of optimising as far as possible their mutual self-advantage (if this can't be seen as a contradiction in terms).  A sort of Black "United Nations", in other words. There must be a heck of a lot of double-crossing going on if so.
But in such an eventuality would this collective "breathing together" have some long-term ecological agenda as a goal also these days, I wonder?  In other words: a cost-benefit analysis of maximising profits for themselves versus fucking up the planet for everyone (with themselves included)."[:]

[Not sure if the following pertains to Examples of the black lodge?, but it does pertain to "... a cost-benefit analysis of maximising profits for" some, "versus fucking up the planet for everyone (with [all] included).""]

 

["]8 predictions for the world in 2030[:]

1 You'll own nothing. And you'll be happy[.]  Whatever you want you'll rent[.] And it'll be delivered by drone[.]

2 The U.S. won’t be the world’s leading superpower[.] A handful of countries will dominate[.]

3 You won't die waiting for an organ donor[.] We won't transplant organs. We'll print new ones instead[.] 

4 You'll eat much less meat[.] An occasional treat, not a staple[.] For the good if the environment and our health[.]

5 A billion people will be displaced by climate change[.] We will have to do a better job at welcoming and integrating refugees[.]

6 Polluters will have to pay to emit carbon dioxide[.] There will be a global price on carbon[.] This will help make fossil fuels history[.] 

7 You could be preparing to go to mars[.] Scientists will have worked out how to keep you healthy in space[.] The start of a journey to find alien life? 

8 Western values will have been tested to the breaking point[.] Checks and balances that underpin our democracies must not be forgotten[.]["]

(Source: [World Economic Forum:] "8 predictions for the world in 2030 (Based on the input of members of the World Economic Forum's Global Future Council") - - - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hx3DhoLFO4s, and "Global Agenda[:] 8 predictions for the world in 2030" - - -  https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2016/11/8-predictions-for-the-world-in-2030/?utm_content=bufferdda7f&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer[.])


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ignant666
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wrwb: Your posts are increasingly becoming totally incomprehensible. The layers of quotes of people quoting quotations are increasingly impossible to parse into any coherent meaning whatever.

If there is some point you are trying to make in this last post, it is utterly impossible for me to determine what it is, who you are quoting when, or why you are quoting these people. or what any of this has to do with the OT, AC, or any topic really.

Consider the possibility that future posts consisting solely of sentences written by you, with zero quotations, might better make your points.


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Shiva
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Posted by: @wellreadwellbred

[Not sure if the following pertains ...

Personally, I'm not sure what your point is, or what you are trying to say. There are multiple quotes (from me, JJB, and some pundit) that are so tightly woven with "quote" marks, asterisks, bold letters and italics to boot, that I can't tell who is saying what to whom, and even what they are saying.

Perhaps you could distill this post down into something a bit simpler?

Posted by: @ignant666

who you are quoting when ...

I recognized my own words, so I've got that part straight, but why I'm "via" instead of just "he said," I cannot figure out.

I believe the post under inquisition could be sent to one of the QBL threads for analysis. Unless wrwb can streamline it here for us dodos (Tao-taos).

Posted by: @ignant666

sentences written by you, with zero quotations

"Speak for yourself, John."  (Puritan aphorism).

 


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dom
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Posted by: @shiva
Posted by: @wellreadwellbred

[Not sure if the following pertains ...

Personally, I'm not sure what your point is, or what you are trying to say. There are multiple 

 

Maybe it's done in the style of Gurdjieff's Beezlebub book.

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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wellreadwellbred
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As already stated in the thread titled Christianity and Thelema, both AC's Thelema and Christianity proclaims ultimately obeying a higher authority than the state (pertaining to the authority of each individual[-s] will for AC's Thelema, and pertaining to the authority of God for Christianity).

 

What about Examples of the black lodge that oppose both AC's Thelema and (JC's) Christianity?

 

And what about Examples of the black lodge that both AC's Thelema and (JC's) Christianity oppose?


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Shiva
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Posted by: @wellreadwellbred

What about Examples of the black lodge that oppose both AC's Thelema and (JC's) Christianity?

These are dealt with under the title of "Slave gods." 

Unfortunately, Christianity has become a Slave God piece of work. However, quoting a quote that floated around Agape Lodge, "Many folks attain despite the church, not because of it." 

Posted by: @wellreadwellbred

And what about Examples of the black lodge that both AC's Thelema and (JC's) Christianity oppose?

You may list these examples, if you will.


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wellreadwellbred
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Me: "And what about Examples of the black lodge that both AC's Thelema and (JC's) Christianity oppose?"

 

Shiva: "You may list these examples, if you will."

 

A supressive and intrusive surveillance and police state like the one in the People's Republic of China?


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dom
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Posted by: @wellreadwellbred

 

 

A supressive and intrusive surveillance and police state like the one in the People's Republic of China?

Did any Chinese system ever not have an "intrusive surveillance (and) police state"? 

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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Shiva
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Posted by: @wellreadwellbred

A supressive and intrusive surveillance and police state like the one in the People's Republic of China?

I imagine NOBODY of any persuasion would like such a deal. I don't remember Jesus crying out against internet censorship, or AC decrying digital surveillance, but your point is made.

In fact, I will suggest that any religion or spiritual philosophy would oppose, or at least wu-wei, the machinations of the heathen Chinese Communist Party ... and that overweight guy up in No Korea, too.

 


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dom
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Posted by: @shiva

I imagine NOBODY of any persuasion would like such a deal. I don't remember Jesus crying out against internet censorship, or AC decrying digital surveillance, but your point is made.

In fact, I will suggest that any religion or spiritual philosophy would oppose, or at least wu-wei, the machinations of the heathen Chinese Communist Party ... and that overweight guy up in No Korea, too.

 

Y'know I hear that before The Boxer Rebellion every Chinese male adult who did not have a pony tail would be arrested because it was an act of disrespecting the Emperor.  You with me?  

https://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Aleister_Crowley_Timeline


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Shiva
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Posted by: @dom

Y'know I hear that before The Boxer Rebellion every Chinese male adult who did not have a pony tail would be arrested because it was an act of disrespecting the Emperor.  You with me? 

I am not "with" you, but I agree. It was a "pigtail" not a "ponytail." The funny thing is, the gov was Manchurian. Yeah, the Manchus marched in after the fall of the Ming dynasty (the "high point" of Chinese civilization), and they ruled for ~300 years. The Chinese guys were forced into pigtaildom while the Manchus enjoyed other harstyles.

The Boxer rebellion failed. It was stirred by the Ming dynasty martial arts Triad lineages. Shortly after the boxers, another rebellion didn't fail and the Manchus were deposed.


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sangewanchuck56
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Posted by: @dom

How did the Great and Mighty Adept Wasserman fit into all this?

This has been deeply puzzling for me as well, and he is by far not the only one.


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wellreadwellbred
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Shiva: "I imagine NOBODY of any persuasion would like such a deal [= A supressive and intrusive surveillance and police state like the one in the People's Republic of China?]. I don't remember Jesus crying out against internet censorship, or AC decrying digital surveillance, but your point is made. In fact, I will suggest that any religion or spiritual philosophy would oppose, or at least wu-wei, the machinations of the heathen Chinese Communist Party ... and that overweight guy up in No Korea, too."

 

The religion that is state sanctioned within respectively present time intrusive surveillance and police states like the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia, and the Islamic Republic of Iran, has little reason to oppose the intrusive surveillance and police state sanctioning it.


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sangewanchuck56
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Are we (as in the body of esoteric and occult practitioners) concerned with an objective and verifiable "dark lodge" with bonafide intentions as an order in society? I suppose if one were to exist we should be, but does one exist?

I suppose if a dark lodge were to exist, it is more likely than not that they view themselves as the opposite of a dark lodge.

I suppose if there was a dark lodge with the intention of bringing some sort of "balance" to the force, pardon my cultural lingo, then they would not really be considered a "dark lodge" at all, but merely actors, playing the part of dark magicians.

I suppose if there were a real dark lodge that would mean a group deeply invested within dualism, they would by definition be continually failing and under the control of intelligences that applied a more non-dual strategy.

I have found the myths and stories of dark lodges far more useful.

In the Southern Hemisphere, in the realm of sorcerers, shamans and curanderos, they have a very simple dilineation between "dark lodges" and "white lodges" (although they do not use those terms)

Dark lodges uses forces for selfish reasons, to compete with others.

White lodges are concerned with healing others.

In those terms, sheesh we have quite a large collection of dark lodges all over the place.

I don't predict this will conclude for them they way they hope.


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Shiva
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Posted by: @sangewanchuck56

but does one exist?

By definition, a coherent, organized Black Lodge would theoretically be impossible. Each member, being self-interested, would be incapable of "lodging" with other selfish dudes. 

This would not preclude temporary alliances (based on the stock market, the price of oil, or other tangible factors), but those would be subject to dissolution - depending on circumstances.

Posted by: @sangewanchuck56

Dark lodges uses forces for selfish reasons, to compete with others.

White lodges are concerned with healing others.

Exactly.

Most "white" lodges have a tendency to turn dark, as time passes.

Posted by: @sangewanchuck56

In those terms, sheesh we have quite a large collection of dark lodges all over the place.

Everywhere.

 


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