Not right now, it isn't. It appears you've exceeded your data transfer quota.

Crap.

...it works for me... Does it not work for anyone else?

Erwin: do you think it would be possible to perhaps upload a mirror of the PDF to your site (that is, if you want to and if you have the small amount of bandwidth).

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Well, it works for me.

http://www.erwinhessle.com/writings/jots.php

You rock.

It is now updated with a nice mirror, hosted by the generous Erwin.

That full-color printing really hoofed the price up for the sake of the solitary color page in there.

Yeah, its 5 dollars more. I dont htink theres a point to reproduce art if its in B&W (and not originally such). There will be more color photos/art in the next issues to make it "more" worth it. I personally enjoy print copies much more than internet, so I would (and did) buy my own personal copy.

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I tried to order the printed version, but the order form says my zip code doesn't match my state. Yes, it most certainly does. I tried several times and it continues to say I'm wrong.
Well there's obviously a glitch somewhere and I'm sorry to say I cannot complete the order.

If you place in the wrong ZIP it will give you corrections in the lulu.com form - try submitting with no zip code or an arbitrary one within your state, that worked the same for me.

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Thanks, I'll try that. However, the Zip I tried putting in is correct. I've lived in this zip code for 37 years. But I'll try again and leave it blank and see what happens. Thanks!

Did it work?

As a matter of fact, it did. Second time was the charm. Waiting for it to be shipped. Looking forward to it!

Thanks for the help.
Trina

I didn't think it was very good. Hessle's essay was mediocre at best, pouncing on the sort of stuff everyone that has spent more than 3 seconds thinking about TBOTL already knows. Del Campo reminds me of my old history teacher and the poetry included was simply horrible. I have no idea why anyone would even think that sort of pseudo-spiritual blabber can be called poetry.

Great!

Submit something yourself then, my friend. It does no use to criticize if you havent created anything yourself...

About your actual comments, its actually funny to think that 'everyone that has spent more than 3 seconds thinking about TBOTL alreayd knows this stuff' as the stuff in that essay caused a 140+ post thread on this site... its obviously quite controversial, and the fact that you find it 'basic' or easy to comprehend only means that you yourself have learned in the past. The fact is, what he writes is not generally accepted as true. About del Campo, thats your nice opinion. The Journal of Thelemic Studies wasnt founded to create some authoritative stance on Thelema, but share many often contradictory accounts of it. Once again, submit something yourself - you arent putting your thoughts up for criticism of hundreds of people....

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That must be one of the most amateuristic stances I've ever come across when it comes to criticism. So a film critic can only writes reviews when he's a movieproducer himself? Don't be ridiculous.

Has it ever occured to you that any succesfull writer or poet would likely not want to be associated with the thelemic circuit? It's not exactly 'good publicity' nor, I dare say, a very challenging audience.

About your actual comments, its actually funny to think that 'everyone that has spent more than 3 seconds thinking about TBOTL alreayd knows this stuff' as the stuff in that essay caused a 140+ post thread on this site...

That says something about this site, not about the quality of Hessle's essay.
His observations are in fact very basic. Anyone who hasn't observed these things from either reading TBOTL a few times or just looking at reality itself must live with soap in his eyes. So maybe for this audience it's a challenging essay, yes, but that's hardly a standard for criticism.

MM

93

I hear loud and clear that you don't like it but would prefer to read some more challenging analysis and well-argued critique to back up your emotive assertions, lest your remarks fall short of your own ideas of an adequate standard for criticism.

93 93/93

All the best.....

I have not the time and will to produce detailed criticism in this case. It's simply not interesting enough a subject to me.

That's sort of the thing with crappy stuff - nice to take a leak on, silly to discuss it in any serious sense. I couldn't for the life of me start to discuss the poetry in that zine in any serious way. Is there anyone here who would write a detailed critique of a teletubby episode? I'm not a postmodernist joker, so I prefer to pass the cup...

93

OK. You don't like issue of of the Journal of Thelemic Studies. Noted. Not much more to say then.
Now, about the Teletubbies.........!

All the best,

93 93/93

Note the details: I said I didn't like it much. However, compared to other 'thelemic' magazines it's probably one of the better ones. Hessles essay isn't bad given the fact that 90% of the readers here seem unable to grasp the misconceptions he discusses. I just thought the poetry bit was gruesome, but i find that gruesome in 99% of all thelemic poetry cases (but i have to say this guy seemed to deliberately confuse 'poetry' with 'sniffing glue and writing down incoherent dross full of 'spiritual theories'...)

Whoever said you cant criticize at all...? I was making the point that your criticisms hold little weight because I see nothing that youve created yourself - someone else echoed that statement above... If I were a movie critic, I think I would know a lot more and be able to criticize movies much more profoundly if I understood what went into making a movie myself. I never said your comments werent appreciated either... We listen to movie critics becuase they have a reputation of past work and publicity to respect them for...

I actually wholeheartedly appreciate that you took the time to read those essays, even if you found them 'basic' or 'un-poetic' or something. 😉

Has it ever occured to you that any succesfull writer or poet would likely not want to be associated with the thelemic circuit? It's not exactly 'good publicity' nor, I dare say, a very challenging audience.

This isnt a springboard for 'successful writers,' its talking about Thelema - the fact that you would think anything otherwise I cannot understand.

About your actual comments, its actually funny to think that 'everyone that has spent more than 3 seconds thinking about TBOTL alreayd knows this stuff' as the stuff in that essay caused a 140+ post thread on this site...

That says something about this site, not about the quality of Hessle's essay.

His observations are in fact very basic. Anyone who hasn't observed these things from either reading TBOTL a few times or just looking at reality itself must live with soap in his eyes. So maybe for this audience it's a challenging essay, yes, but that's hardly a standard for criticism.

I dont know how much good insulting the general populace at this forum will do for you... Honestly, feel free to skip over material you find basic - I dont know how else to say that something basic to you is not necessarily basic to the entire world.

There was poetry in that issue? I mustve missed it...

Are you referring to T Polyphilus' bit? I think thats actually a speech that happens to be somewhat poetic, but not a poem in itself...

Your comment I find actually ironic because I turned down about a couple poetry submissions because of hteir lack of any sort and I failed to see how they added anything to 'Thelemic Studies' (note: Im still open to you poets out there for some good poetry!)... In a word, I was pretty harsh about it. Either way, there was no poetry in Vol.1 No.1 of the Journal - poetic prose, perhaps....

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Aum418,

Not for the first time I feel obliged to poke my head round the corner to mention a few things in clarification...

"Caused" the thread? You may be exaggerating the impact of the essay or your journal here. I assume you're talking about "Does Evil exist? Or is it lack of knowledge?" That thread started September 29; you didn't promote your journal until this thread on October 3. There was no mention of Erwin's article in that older thread. Indeed, Erwin didn't even get involved until about the 31st post (also on October 3). The fact that the thread then became more directly concerned with the subject of Erwin's essay - "The Ethics Of Thelema", lest we forget - perhaps isn't entirely surprising, given that of the 140 posts, in excess of 60 were written by Erwin or you.

The Journal of Thelemic Studies wasnt founded to create some authoritative stance on Thelema, but share many often contradictory accounts of it.

Goodness knows, as owner, editor and co-moderator of LAShTAL.COM - which proudly boasts to be non-partisan - I sympathise with your role as editor. However, the fact that your posts in that thread were without exception directly supporting the perspective that Erwin presented - a perspective that you correctly describe as "obviously quite controversial" - the willingness of contributors to "share contradictory accounts" is likely not to have been enhanced.

I dont know how much good insulting the general populace at this forum will do for you...

To be honest, Aum418, there's been far too much of that on these forums already, but Mirrorman's comments can hardly be described as "insulting". He correctly drew attention to some of the poor quality material appearing on the forums of late. Visitors and Registered Members alike deserve better.

I turned down about a couple poetry submissions... In a word, I was pretty harsh about it.

Did you really? Honestly? Name names!

93,

For those interested in the Journal of Thelemic Studies, please visit the website:

http://www.thelemicstudies.com /"> http://www.thelemicstudies.com/

...

Paul: Why did you lock the Journal thread? There was no reason to close that thread! You did not even give me a chance to reply to you... What exactly is the problem? ? This makes no sense to me, Paul... I think other people should be allowed to comment on the Journal, but you locked the thread without any notification or qualification (not that you necessarily need to, but it might be nice...)

"Caused" the thread? You may be exaggerating the impact of the essay or your journal here. I assume you're talking about "Does Evil exist? Or is it lack of knowledge?" That thread started September 29; you didn't promote your journal until this thread on October 3. There was no mention of Erwin's article in that older thread. Indeed, Erwin didn't even get involved until about the 31st post (also on October 3). The fact that the thread then became more directly concerned with the subject of Erwin's essay - "The Ethics Of Thelema", lest we forget - perhaps isn't entirely surprising, given that of the 140 posts, in excess of 60 were written by Erwin or you.

I was saying his ideas caused the thread to go from about 15 posts maybe to 145... I dont think thats easily deniable... I didnt mean to say that the Journal caused anything in that thread, only Erwin's posts. You are misreading me entirely and spend a lot of time arguing about something I never claimed. The point wasnt accuracy of amount of posts, it was to illustrate teh point that the issues in Erwin's essay aren't elemen tary or basic (showing he agreed with them and found them extremely basic premises) to everyone, although they may seem so for him. It wasnt to illustrate the impact of Erwin or the Journal, just merely state that the ideas expressed are not easily agreed upon or 'simple.'

Goodness knows, as owner, editor and co-moderator of LAShTAL.COM - which proudly boasts to be non-partisan - I sympathise with your role as editor. However, the fact that your posts in that thread were without exception directly supporting the perspective that Erwin presented - a perspective that you correctly describe as "obviously quite controversial" - the willingness of contributors to "share contradictory accounts" is likely not to have been enhanced.

I think everyone can perceive there is a difference between the stance of the Journal of Thelemic Studies and my personal opinion. The very fact that there are many many ideas I completley disagree with within the actual Journal should show they are obviously not the same.... That is the Journal's view, to be non-partisan. On these forums, if I happen to say things that concur with Erwin's stances... so be it.

I dont know how much good insulting the general populace at this forum will do for you...

To be honest, Aum418, there's been far too much of that on these forums already, but Mirrorman's comments can hardly be described as "insulting". He correctly drew attention to some of the poor quality material appearing on the forums of late. Visitors and Registered Members alike deserve better.

Actually he said that because Erwin's topics are not "basic" on this site, it "says something about this site, not about the quality of Hessle's essay," implying the people at this site dont 'spend 3 seconds with TBOTL." He was not 'drawing attention to some of the poor quality material appearing on the forums of late" at all, but actually insulting the quality of your site...

I turned down about a couple poetry submissions... In a word, I was pretty harsh about it.

Did you really? Honestly? Name names!

Honestly, LAShTAL, is it that hard ot imagine that I didnt like people's poetry? Was there any point to your completely baseless speculation? It seems entirely malicious to me.

Is there any reason why you locked this thread, preventing any further discussion on any part of the Journal?

I hope someone will comment about the actual Journal as Mirrorman did. I wholeheartedly appreciated that he read it and actually took time to respond to it. This thread did not deserved to be closed I think. Anyone agree?

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Yeah I agree. Schoolbook example of a moderator with a triggerhappy finger.

But to reply to your statements earlier: I think the piece was announced as poetry, so I figured I should judge it as poetry.

The idea that someone doesn't have the right to criticize because he hasn't submitted any articles himself is very silly. You have no idea who I am so you can't possibly know whether I'm a schmuck or a famous critic or writer.

If you're really that keen on judging my writing qualities i can send you a copy of my next book which will be published april 2008. I personally don't see what the relevance of it is, though.

As to insulting members of this forum: the word 'insult' implies use of harsh language and personalized use. A general remark that doesn't use harsh language and isn't directed at anyone in particular can't therefore be said to be an 'insult'.

MM

My sincere apologies to you both.

I did not lock the thread but moved it to the correct location (ie Culture / Submissions). Unfortunately, it transpires that Culture / Submissions was itself locked, for reasons that are unclear to me at the moment.

Mea culpa! I made a technical error, not a moderating one.

I'll merge old posts into this thread.

All sorted now - and again I extend my apologies for the technical error.

Ah, I see: clearly my misinterpretation of your statement that "the stuff in that essay caused a 140+ post thread on this site".

I think everyone can perceive there is a difference between the stance of the Journal of Thelemic Studies and my personal opinion.

I speak with some authority when I say that "everyone" most definitely will NOT perceive the difference!

Actually he said that because Erwin's topics are not "basic" on this site, it "says something about this site, not about the quality of Hessle's essay," implying the people at this site dont 'spend 3 seconds with TBOTL." He was not 'drawing attention to some of the poor quality material appearing on the forums of late" at all, but actually insulting the quality of your site...

That's not how I interpreted his remark, but I'm not sure I followed your point here exactly. In any case, even if you're right, insults about the "quality of the site" are not going to make me lose sleep.

Was there any point to your completely baseless speculation? It seems entirely malicious to me.

Ah, that seems to have touched a nerve. 😉

This thread did not deserved to be closed I think. Anyone agree?

Me. I agree.

Much like the spam that floods my inbox each morning. There are better ways of promoting a product.

The people who really understand a topic are the ones who can give a convincing argument in just a couple of posts. As they say "the empty can rattles the most". 😉

I thought it was annoucned as a 'poetic speech.' My fault if it was not.

The idea that someone doesn't have the right to criticize because he hasn't submitted any articles himself is very silly. You have no idea who I am so you can't possibly know whether I'm a schmuck or a famous critic or writer.

Mirrorman! Please, cmon! Look at my post above, I already addressed this.

I did not say "You have no right to criticize." I said, "Your criticisms hold little weight, and personally, if you created something of your own I would have more reason to believe/listen to your criticisms." I never said you shouldn't criticize, and I repeated this point above.

If you're really that keen on judging my writing qualities i can send you a copy of my next book which will be published april 2008. I personally don't see what the relevance of it is, though.

If its related to Thelema (Im guessing its not since you mentioned above taht no successful writer would associate with Thelema), I would absolutely love to.

As to insulting members of this forum: the word 'insult' implies use of harsh language and personalized use. A general remark that doesn't use harsh language and isn't directed at anyone in particular can't therefore be said to be an 'insult'.

What is the word for 'insulting many people at once' then? I would use that word... I dont really care about that ocmment, I was just making a passing statement about it.

To clear up once & for all what I Meant by that:

Mirrorman claimed the ideas in Erwin's essay were 'basic.' I claimed they may seem 'basic' to him, but even these 'simple' ideas generated a huge thread... many of which were questioning Erwin's stance on the idea. To me, this illustrates that the issues talked about are not 'simple' or 'basic' or agreed upon in the least - thats the whole point. The whole point wasnt to advertise the Journal. The whole point wasnst to advertsise Erwin's ideas. The whole point was to show that the ideas in the essay are not as easily agreed upon as Mirrorman thinks. Is that clear for everyone now?'

LAShAL: It was baseless speculation on your part, not a nerve touched on mine. I thank you for reopening the thread.

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To clarify from my perspective, Mirrorman is entirely correct to state that the ideas in that essay are "basic". This should be self-evident. The essay is essentially a discussion on what "Do what thou wilt" actually means, and as far as Thelema goes, it doesn't come much more basic than that. It is and was from the beginning intended to be an basic essay on basic concepts.

I further agree that the posting population of these forums in general appears to have much greater difficulty in coming to terms with those basic ideas than might be considered to be "normal" or "expected". If you accept as a premise the non-existence of objective moral qualities (which is a rigorous and respected philosophical position in its own right that any serious student should be familiar with, wholly apart from the studies of magick and Thelema, and such a position can indeed be deduced "just looking at reality itself" as Mirrorman states) then the conclusions inherent in those ideas flow almost as a matter of necessity.

Although evidence appears to be that in this particular venue the ideas have in fact proved "quite controversial", I completely dispute the assertion that they "obviously" should be expected to be so, since any serious student should be already familiar with the underlying position as I have stated, even if it were not for the fact that the position figures prominently throughout Crowley's work and in the Book of the Law itself. It's always possible to dispute that underlying position, but the fact is that the ideas being advanced as a result of it should not prove "controversial" in any circles accustomed to dealing with theories of conduct such as this since the logic itself is sound.

Yet the fact remains that basic as those ideas are, they do not appear to have been clearly articulated anywhere in one place from a specifically Thelemic perspective, and as Aum418 correctly states they are not "widely held" by members of the "Thelemic community", even if they are much more widely accepted in the larger "occult" and philosophical communities. So I considered it useful to articulate those basic ideas clearly in a basic essay from a basic Thelemic perspective. It was not intended to be a "challenging essay", so any criticism directed to it on that premise is misdirected. The ideas are indeed basic, but they needed to be advanced nevertheless.

To me the whole idea of the possibility of anything not relating to thelema is presumptious. But if you want to know: it's a poetry volume of 66 poems, decribed by the publisher as a visionary work. It's a large publisher so I found that rather special - he takes a risk in doing so, since any work with such description is easily the target of cynic critics. So apparently he feels that my work can withstand that...

MM

But apparently you yourself don't feel that your work can withstand being the target of cynical critics such as me, who believes there are no such volume forthcoming until I see it. Like your experiences with people of various signs, I can't count how many times I have met occultists who were largely nobodys who lived in squalor, but pretended to be people of influence, with book contracts, being a D.A. and whatnot. It all turned out to be hot air in the end once someone demanded proof. Here is hoping that yours don't turn out to be the same. There is some truth to what Oscar Schlag said: Never trust an occultist!

Dude, you are funny.

, who believes there are no such volume forthcoming until I see it.

Fine with me. If only you'd do the same favor to the preaterhuman intelligences maybe you'd get somewhere.

Like your experiences with people of various signs, I can't count how many times I have met occultists who were largely nobodys who lived in squalor, but pretended to be people of influence, with book contracts, being a D.A. and whatnot.

Usually people tend to attract people who harmonize with their energy levels. That's one of the most basic magick laws out there, scientific or not.

MM

Which publisher? Whats the name of the book? If its a large publisher, surely there is something online about it...?

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Who said I didn't? In fact isn't this what A.C. himself insists that we do in Liber ABA?

Usually people tend to attract people who harmonize with their energy levels. That's one of the most basic magick laws out there, scientific or not.

Overlooking your "most basic magick laws" whose authority I have yet to know (yourself, your experiences, who or what makes you able to say that?), this one is rather easy to disprove: A social worker who lives a very stable life in socioeconomic and personal sense, will largely be involved with people on the opposite end of these variables. A medical doctor in perfect health will similarly mostly be involved with people who are not in perfect health.

There will be soon. They are designing the cover now. I won't reveal the publisher or name yet but I have managed to convince Shoultz that i can use one of his works on the cover - which made me very happy since his work resonates very well with mine. You can check his work out here:

http://www.fecalface.com/SF/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=416&Itemid=99999999

http://www.jonathanlevinegallery.com/?method=Artist.ArtistDetail&ArtistID=AD8DD87D-115B-5562-AA33161352CA9683&GalleryID=82C33C59-3048-28EB-92DB386C8C733405

If there's interest i can post the details of my book in due time. It will be available from April 2008.

Is it in English?

No, its a dutch book - so I guess the use to post it here is limited. Maybe there are some die-hard collectors who want to possess anything even remotely connected to thelema. I'm thinking to translate it to english and turkish later on, but that's sort of a hell of a job already.

MM

Thanks for helping bring over 500 unique views to the Journal of Thelemic Studies (and several print orders as well!) Hopefully we may continue this endeavor far into the future.

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According to UPS Tracking, my printed version is to arrive tomorrow. I'll post my thoughts after I've spent some time with it.

It was interesting enough to post numerous responses.
If you don't like, move on - no one is making you read anything.

I think he has... no reason bringing it back up. 😉

Whatd you think of it?

Mirrorman is no longer a registered member of LAShTAL.COM.

By popular demand, The Journal of Thelemic Studies Vol.1 No.1 is now available in Black & White format for only $6.76:

B&W version of Journal of Thelemic Studies (1-1)

Enjoy.

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Impressive, keep up the good work.

Thanks. Will do.

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93,

Sorry to those who messaged me about the site being down to order the books.

Once again you may order color ($23.50) or black & white ($6.76) editions of the Journal of Thelemic Studies, Vol.1 No.1.

Thanks to those who helped me fix the hosting problem & brought it to my attention.

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Ok, Aum418 - that's probably enough of the shameless plugging!

😉

Yea, the announcement was for the fact that the site somehow got bandwidthed out, and I thought I would mention its available again... its available for free too of course - Id rather people read it for free than didn't pay for it and not read it.

Besides... the announcement in the lashtal news got buried quite quickly, wouldnt you say? 😉

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