Evidence in Richard...
 

Evidence in Richard T. Cole's Liber L. vel Bogus.  

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Shiva
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06/12/2019 8:20 pm  
Posted by: @frater_anubis

I'm aware of Cole's tactics in his contributions to Lashtal. My response is to continue to ask for the evidence.

I tried that ... over and over again. The only way to deal with Choronzon ("corona" = head; "zon = "zone; Choronzon = head zone = the mind) is Silence. So I withdrew from that Inauguration thread.

Posted by: @frater_anubis

He clearly has an incentive to subject anyone who is not swayed by his arguments to personal abuse - he wishes to sell more copies.

I think it was dom who listed "Marketing Strategies," and "Name Recognition," or "Getting lots of Press, Publicity, and Printed Publicity; good or bad." is one of them.

Posted by: @michael-staley

Perhaps you could repeat it here for the purpose of us dolts, please.

As one dolt to another, thank you for asking for the 93rd time.

Posted by: @therealrtc

Would someone in the vicinity please give them a nudge, just to reassure all that the entity didn’t expire some years ago.

There was, fairly recently, a whole thread on (c)OTO and its position on members actually posting or commenting (re: OTO affairs) on "social media." I do not consider LAShTAL to be "social media," but "they" do.

There was, fairly recently, a whole thread on (c)OTO and its position in relation to The Black Lodge. Anything that you or I say or write is considered hearsay or heresy. The "official custodian" concept is correct, in the eyes of the court and themselves, but the real, independent Thelemites know better. Do not expect help or hindrance from that custodial quarter.

Yes, you are right. You indeed did write that said Appendix would be included in the second book in the future from now. I even remember reading it, but we dolts probably dismissed that directive due to its displacement in the space-time continuum.

 


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Michael Staley
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07/12/2019 6:05 pm  
Posted by: @shiva

You indeed did write that said Appendix would be included in the second book in the future from now.

Billy Bunter's postal order.


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Shiva
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07/12/2019 9:00 pm  
Posted by: @michael-staley

Billy Bunter's postal order.

Good marketers usually allow one to sign up now for automatic delivery ... forever. It's called "Auto-Shit," no, pardon me Auto-Ship. In the present case, now under intense scrutiny, Auto-Ship would save so much time and the devourment of mental Chi.

Now, I am a great fan of the concept, It's All a Game, and the contemporary complex is certainly some sort of game, but then it's presented in some illogical, mind-bending puzzle format, all reserved for the future. I am not a fan of puzzles or riddles, especially when presented in such a flamboyant manner accompanied by personal insults and an adolescent, toilet-like demeanor.

 


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frater_anubis
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10/12/2019 7:43 pm  

@michael-staley

Tnx - I'm not holding my breath - though being of a scientific turn of mind and having studied Crowley and particularly Liber Al for half a lifetime, I'm of the view that extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, which Richard Cole has produced none and I doubt if he ever will.


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RTC
 RTC
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10/12/2019 8:32 pm  

@frater_anubisTnx - I'm not holding my breath - though being of a scientific turn of mind and having studied Crowley and particularly Liber Al for half a lifetime, I'm of the view that extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, which Richard Cole has produced none and I doubt if he ever will. – May I ask what, if any, extraordinary evidence of Crowley’s extraordinary claims (i.e. the ‘million times more important than the wheel, physics and maths’ stuff) has half a lifetime of personal study revealed?

I am also trying to validate Crowley’s extraordinary claims, in a form applicable to all.  Why do you have such a hard time with this?


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frater_anubis
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10/12/2019 9:20 pm  
Posted by: @therealrtc

May I ask what, if any, extraordinary evidence of Crowley’s extraordinary claims (i.e. the ‘million times more important than the wheel, physics and maths’ stuff) has half a lifetime of personal study revealed?

You can ask, but i'm not going to tell you

Posted by: @therealrtc

I am also trying to validate Crowley’s extraordinary claims, in a form applicable to all.  Why do you have such a hard time with this?

You are not trying to validate Crowley's "claims" at all. You appear to have had some sort of revelation - that he faked the Reception story - and then searched through a lot of material, looking for "proof". Liber Bogus documents your journey and is an interesting read for that reason, but it contains no proof, merely a lot of "reading between the lines" on your part.

However, you have claimed that hard proof exists in the form of watermarks on the paper with which Crowley recorded the text, but apparently are currently unable or unwilling to present it in print or here on Lashtal. Of more interest to me is the suggestion that other evidence may be extant from Rose Kelly - because I've always wondered if she left her own record

 

 

 


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RTC
 RTC
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10/12/2019 10:36 pm  

@frater_anubis“You can ask, but i'm not going to tell you” – Then, please don’t feel in a position to comment further on my schedule.

Contrary to your insistence, I am attempting to validate Crowley’s claims.  Indeed, I believe that I have done so.  To arrive at my conclusions it was first necessary to explore Crowley’s own narration of events.  It became increasingly clear that the Cairo literature was his ‘best guess’ at describing an experience wholly beyond his capacity to assimilate, and the onset of a New Aeon that will (and is) changing every aspect of life on this planet.  Given this, I consider the practicalities of a New Aeon (with reference to Crowley’s core statements on the subject) as are applicable to every person on this planet, of infinitely more import than hammering another nail into a dysfunctional fable.  Hence “The Governing Dynamics...” will appear after both “666...” and “The Paranormal Decided.

As for the manuscript pages themselves... What does your scientifically turning mind suggest as a reason why Crowley (and the current guardians of his legacy) were/are so reluctant display the manuscript, or even reproduce good quality scans?  Why did Crowley take considerable trouble to re-back the leaves?  You could also ask why Crowley (‘when sourcing materials for his forthcoming revelation,’ as suggested on a thread) chose bog standard typing paper for the big day?  Why not hand-made Egyptian paper?  You could also ask... Where, in Cairo, would Crowley have purchased a ream of Scottish typing paper?      


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ignant666
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10/12/2019 11:15 pm  
Posted by: @therealrtc

You could also ask... Where, in Cairo, would Crowley have purchased a ream of Scottish typing paper?      

I am thinking in a stationery store (assuming he did not, as a writer, bring it with him in his luggage).

Egypt was a de facto British colony in 1904; stores catering to traveling foreigners would be well-stocked with imported goods.


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dom
 dom
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10/12/2019 11:16 pm  

Yeah I take my own writing pads with me when I go abroad.   


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frater_anubis
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11/12/2019 1:04 pm  

@ignant666

Posted by: @ignant666

Egypt was a de facto British colony in 1904; stores catering to traveling foreigners would be well-stocked with imported goods

That is not strictly true. In 1904 Egypt was not a colony; it was technicaly a "Khedivate" and nominally part of the Ottoman Empire. The British, unsure of the ever changing politics in Egypt, in 1882 wished to secure the Suez canal and sea communications with India. As was their wont, they despatched a fleet to Eygpt and bombarded Alexandria to impress the fellahin - however this had the opposite effect, causing a popular uprising led by Salaafist religious fanatics, who began slaughtering Christians and who burned 50 coptic churches in three days, desecrating cemeteries and violating Christian women and children.

This outrage led to the landing of a large British expeditionary force at both ends of the Suez canal in August 1882,  the British succeeded in defeating the Salaafist army at Tel El Kebir in September and took control of the country - putting a puppet Khedive back in control. The Salaafist leaders were hanged, captured prisoners were flogged and sold into slavery, and the country pacified. This was considered enlightened when compared to the Belgian treatment of natives in the Congo; or the first German genocide of the Herera tribes in Namibia; or indeed the American genocide of the Lakota Sioux in the 1870's

By 1904 British imperialists had commandeered about 90% of the fertile land adjacent to the Nile and started growing cotton as feedstock for Lancashire and Yorkshire mills to produce cloth destined for India sari's. They built railways to ship the raw cotton out, roads for internal communication and controlled the revenue from the Suez canal. The Egyptian Khedivate was saddled with the costs of the British expeditionary force - some £9m - and periodically the British would hang a few nationalist leaders to impress the fellahin with their authority.

In 1904 Eygpt was still considered very "wild west" - Crowley took Rose there on his honeymoon as a bit of an adventure, the rest as they say, is history

 


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dom
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11/12/2019 1:20 pm  

An interesting history lesson but the point is do writers take their own paper with them when they travel abroad or do they wait to buy it over there? I take my own.


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ignant666
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11/12/2019 1:35 pm  
Posted by: @frater_anubis

That is not strictly true.

"De facto" means "in fact, but not in law". You describe a country where "about 90% of the fertile land" is controlled by the metropolitan power- that sounds like a colony to me.

It is indeed correct that Egypt was de jure ("in law", which is what i think you mean by "strictly") not a British colony until 1914.

As to Cairo as "the wild west", certainly honeymooning there was more exotic than say the Riviera, but it was a city full of luxurious hotels catering to British travelers, and presumably shopping for them and the large permanent British community.

The idea that it would be unlikely for AC in Cairo to have typing paper manufactured in the UK is silly- if he did not bring it with him, he would have been able to buy it in Cairo.


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ignant666
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11/12/2019 3:45 pm  

Incidentally, for those who like to mix a bit of actual facts into their errant speculations, the 1902 Baedeker's for Egypt lists eight shops under "Booksellers and Stationers", including one likely to appeal to our pal AC, the British and Foreign Bible Society, listed as offering "Stationery, visiting cards, etc." (p. 28 at https://archive.org/details/01384290.5458.emory.edu/page/n239). Note that "Arabian Booksellers" are listed separately- this is a listing of booksellers and stationers catering to the expatriate community and tourists.

The guide says on the next page, under the listing "European Wares", that "All the ordinary wants of the traveller may now be supplied at Cairo".

By the 1908 edition, there were nine shops listed ( https://archive.org/details/00491772.5459.emory.edu/page/n237)

The wild west? Not so much.


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