Having spent the last couple of decades buying and selling occult books, I have seen my share of books about, and by Aleister Crowley.
For purposes of introducing context, please note that I started this infernal book idiocy in 1963. Do the math. Put things in perspective (for the next respose, blow) ...
not written by Crowley that are worth a darn [including] The Confessions of Aleister Crowley
What? Confessions was writ by AC, originally titled The Sprit of Solitude. Symonds and Grant merely edited it - this means they took out a big bunch of stuff and published it as The Confessions, a title AC never used.
All the other books are recycled, regurgitated garbage.
Such a statement assigns you to a level of Purgatory equal to that of a condescender. I hesitate to point out that a Librarian who cannot distinguish between an Author and an Editor might not be able to offer valid opinions on "All the other books."
then read HIS books.
Agreed. After one finishes all his books, then one might turn to Alice Bailey (only two of her twenty tomes are recommended - all the rest are garbled dur to scribe interference with content). She fills in alll the yin places that yang AC left out.
Well, then, from the three written not by Crowley, one is written by him
This witness bears witness to the Truth, and is thus considered "proof."
the Conefessions end at Cefalu.
Yes, it is described as He dictated the text under the influence of heroin. Cocaine was also mentioned - it shows up in certain highly illuminated sections of the text.
And then the book ends (at Cefalu) with complaints about how much more work there is to do, with a final adnonition that we're all a pack of cards and he don't care no more ... [setting the stage for the next unmentionable grade].
i could go on
and on
Judging from a perusal of the length of your post, this is exactly what you do.
to fully regain the word you must work the two sephiroth of chesed4 and geburah
I would agree with this. Where do I sign the petition?
man is the guardian of life and woman but a temporary expedient
I'm sure this will go over well at the Thelemic Ladies Aid Society.
in the prince of jerusalem degree, the temple is utterly destroyed, and the ritual ends with these words- nothing now remains. there is no formal closing; all has been destroyed
Now we're getting down to the real (final) action.
You note that Symonds, Grant, Regardie, and even Crowley got things wrong.
This is correct. A (really) great percentage of the threads, and their detailed content, pertain directly to where AC, et al, got things wrong.
What? Confessions was writ by AC, originally titled The Sprit of Solitude. Symonds and Grant merely edited it - this means they took out a big bunch of stuff and published it as The Confessions, a title AC never used.
You are right, BUT I did say that is worth reading. But you are correct, editorship is NOT authorship. I stand before the Tribunal and confess my heresy.
Such a statement assigns you to a level of Purgatory equal to that of a condescender. I hesitate to point out that a Librarian who cannot distinguish between an Author and an Editor might not be able to offer valid opinions on "All the other books."
Again, I confess my error. My sweeping condemnation is something Crowley would take great issue with.
And then the book ends (at Cefalu) with complaints about how much more work there is to do, with a final adnonition that we're all a pack of cards and he don't care no more ... [setting the stage for the next unmentionable grade].
Touche! I bow to the Master.
This is not meant to be denigrating whatsoever. And I felt the way you did or wrote, for a longtime, when I was in my twenties especially.
But now that I am turning forty this year I don't really feel the way that you feel at all. Mostly.
Yes 'all acts (can be) are magickal acts' but I actually put that in a different way in my head these days.
My mundane life is my mundane life.
Yes I feel qi and think and breathe and look around. I think we all do?
But I don't randomly post sigils on post its around my house or dance around anywhere.
I think most of the magick is in my head.
I'm sure this will go over well at the Thelemic Ladies Aid Society.
There are some Crowley quotes along those lines I'm not very fond of.
to fully regain the word you must work the two sephiroth of chesed4 and geburah
Which are connected by a certain Path and its corresponding Atu
This is not meant to be denigrating whatsoever. And I felt the way you did or wrote, for a longtime, when I was in my twenties especially.
I'm not out of that age category yet. 😀
I seek to attain, and to harness as much of my life as I can towards that.
But I also acknowledge that I'm somewhat atypical in some ways. My path is what works for me, at this point in my life.
Seen !
I like to play.
Most think they choose the cat but it is they that play;
what the cat willed.
It judges, presides, inspires everything in its empire;
If you are drawn like a magnet to its spirit;
The guardian protector of the sacred place
will confer its benediction
and allow Cunning Folk with eyes to see,
the privilege of entering an agreement,
and a pact.
Calling you back,
from your subordinate position of money morality
and the meager reality of the state corral;
to a thing and place of a different nature.
Such is the spellbinding ardent enchantment
that transforms you
to the place
of love.
The cat willed it.
Anyone here know anything about Wilfred Talbot Smith? I looked on the Lashtal search, but I came up with nothing. Any archival material I may be missing? Thanks to all. All in One
I looked on the Lashtal search, but I came up with nothing.
Your librarian skills may be dated. Try "w.t. smith site:lashtal.com" in any search engine for plentiful hits.
I found it, Wilfred T. Smith- God, or a cruel Joke? By einDoppleganger . My humble thanks.
Anyone here know anything about Wilfred Talbot Smith?
Everyone here has read The Unknown God - Wilfred Talbot Smith and the Thelemites, which is Smith's biography, writ by Martin P. Starr.
It's now Out-of-Print-and-Ink, but it is a most revealing text. It is enough to cause one to revise their thoughts about Crowley and Agape Lodge.
@shiva Unfortunately, I haven't. I looked on ABEBooks, it costs from $500-$700. A bit more than I am willing to pay. Also, there were only two PDF sites available, both at cost. I will have to think it over. Your tantalizing summary makes me curious. Thanks again for the info.
Thanks for they lyric, a poem worthy of a read or two
No I have not read The Unknown God - Wilfred Talbot Smith and the Thelemites, except for excerpts found on line....
I am sure that J. Edward Cornelius, Jerry, has some comments about Mr. Smith in one of his books...and where one of the ironic things, if I remember reading somewhere was that A.C.'s consternation was that the OTO was being used for Smith's sexual prowling....
Grant's Magical Revival discusses Smith, and demonstrates Crowley's great ability to gaslight, with Smith the target of quite a prank...apparently aimed a Smith's vanity if I recall...though perhaps the incident might speak to AC's projections to some extent as well...
Regarding projecting and gaslighting, I had to relook that term up, I think you are correct.
But if you aren't a deranged politicised nut, you have to agree we all project and gaslight to some degree.
I was lucky enough to hitch my star to the Crowley bandwagon in the early 2000's, let's say...2005 ish.
Back then you could get super lucky with book hunting.
My , how time flies!
The book is a great read. Mine is actually signed by Martin Starr.
Please don't call a hex onto me and my library.
I am trying to feel less for physical goods
@christibrany I think it's great you have the book. No hexes from me, I support bibliophiles. You are right back in the 80s, 90s, and 2000s Crowley books were not so exorbitantly priced. In some cases, it's justifiable given the editions and conditions of the books. Even facsimile reproductions are pretty pricey. But, if it is worth it for you to have it, go for it.
I have not read The Unknown God -
I was given a copy by Mr Starr. Then I mailed it to Frater Taurus. His comment about Smith was that he was a True Believer. I asked him what that meant. He said Smith was into it 100%, and he could not be shaken.
The text illustrates Crowley trying to shake him by dumping truckloads of outrageous crap on Smith. Corowley is shown at his worst, by quotation, not by anyone's subjective bias twist spin.
Taurus mailed the book back and I mailed it to FraterLightBlazer, who then died, and the book is probably on sale at Abe's.
I remember reading somewhere was that A.C.'s consternation was that the OTO was being used for Smith's sexual prowling.
Agape Lodge did not have prowlers. It was a wide-open free-for-all with no restrictions. The inmates had a game of musical beds going, whereby the ladies moved nightly from one man's room to the next.
They got busted for this. Pasadena P.D. I don't know who filed the complaint. Combined with Parsons\ explosion, these two acts caused Germer to pull the plug.
I support bibliophiles.
Are these folks who dress up like figures from the Bible?
I would never be down with a bedswapping scene. I am in love with my wife and that's not possessiveness or control. It's to recognise two stars in their orbit.
I have yet to read anything about random wanton wife swapping in Crowley.
Does anyone else have anything to say about this topic re Mr Crowley and also RE Thelema?
He sure willed it.
Speaking of sex , male cats love to lie on female humans and female cats love male laps.
It's fascinating.
Then he gives me the look
I have yet to read anything about random wanton wife swapping in Crowley.
You do not quite understand. Agape did not practice wife swapping. The practiced free love. Most of them were not married.
Crowley had a few womwn around. He practiced free love. He usually had no wife to swap, but he got around [to everybody]. What would you do at Cefalu when asked to mate the mage?
Does anyone else have anything to say about this topic re Mr Crowley and also RE Thelema?
The Topic is AC's Sexual Secrets (a book by JC). What went on at Agape is directly linked to Sex and AC, but Thelema is not part of this thread heading.
Who else ... Hates ... Cucumber ... Burps ... And why is that
Ugh
This appears to be off-topic, off-site, and offer my head.
What in the world is wrong with you?
Then he gives me the look
Three post in a row can make a serial killer. How much beer have you had this evening.
All good points, as always.
If asked to mate the mage I would say no. It's not my thing.
I struggle to find the Zen and Core in screwing random people.
I struggle to find the Zen and Core in screwing random people.
Oh, that [Zen, Core] is the god part. Sowing one's seed as wide as possible is the beast part. The two get together, and then the fight begins. Once it starts, it lasts for a lifetime.
Some people, like Captain Frater Taurus, retired, deceased, have a built-in, irresistible drive to do this sowing, widely. If they do not, they become neurotic. It is a genetic thing. I believe our hero, Aleister, was endowed with this genetic variation.
We must understand that these people exist, and that such a drive is considered normal ... by those who feel they need variety.
At the other end of the spectrum, we find the one-woman man. He will become neurotic if he is involved [eros] with more than one partner. Platonic [Agape] relationships do not cause neurosis, so it's the beast thing, all right. Jerry was right to select penii as a major subject. They are the direct, visible, pointed, yang sources of endless neuroses - depending on one's genetic and behavioral properties.
Genetic props vary. So do the results.
I think.
That's your problem. I know this to be true because I suffer from the same disorder
That will teach you a lesson. NEVER, EVER loan your books out. There 99.9% chance you will never get the book back.Taurus mailed the book back and I mailed it to FraterLightBlazer, who then died, and the book is probably on sale at Abe's.
Cucumber
No doubt this a reference to the cucumber being symbolic of redemption through the resurrection of Christ. You are indeed wise oh brother Thelemite!
Cucumbers are also phallic, thus my post, while seeming flippant, was actually quite (St) germain.
As to how phalli can make one burp, I am unsure.
Cucumbers are also phallic, thus my post, while seeming flippant, was actually quite (St) germain.
Way to obvious. What you do with cucumbers is your business. I'll point you to: Crevell's cucumbers, Christ, and Catarr/ Alberti's window. So, you are a Theosophist? (Count Saint Germain)
That will teach you a lesson. NEVER, EVER loan your books out.
No lesson learned. I had read the book. I do not love to dress up in biblical attire, so who cares?
@shiva Whatever floats your boat. Be it on the Nile, The Styx, or the muddy Mississippi. People who borrow books, and don't return them deserve the agonies of Tartarus.
Whatever floats your boat.
I do not have a boat. That is old aeon Ark mytho Water Deluge stuff (like is going on in Caliph right now). The world is presently being destroyed by Fire. I have a Dodge Durango, a RAM suspension mated (on-topic with this thread) to a Dodge Power Wagon. This is a serious Earth element Juggernaut. It comes with a 500 page User Manual, which I will gladly send to you for interpretation, which I can't do. This has been a demonstration on how to go off topic. Let us Re-turn.
People who borrow books, and don't return them deserve the agonies
Your Librarian (#7 in the 9-cycle) is showing. If you were a retired cop, you'd be complaining about People who Steal Books. It's all relative to our former professions.
I have former professions in Race Car Driving, Ranching, Dentistry, Grand Secretary Generalism, Garden Maintenance, Medicine, Classroom Teaching, College Admin, and Sensei. I am retired from all these, However, I have re-instituted a daily regimen, not too strenuous, of Budo (The Tao of War) so that I don't die prematurely.
I will consider each of these fragments of my sordid past and present in respect to Books, their Uses and When to Burn Them. But i will not dress up as a Bible character ... unless you let me be Pharaoh or The Widow's Son.
Point of Order: Returning to JC and The Book of AC's Secrets, it seems as though no secrets are revealed. From the few "reviews" that have been posted, I sense (is that like thinking ?) that JC is doing his best to present the consciousness "proper to" the VIII*.
Nobody has said, "Oh, wow - Look at This!"
Point of Order: Returning to JC and The Book of AC's Secrets, it seems as though no secrets are revealed. From the few "reviews" that have been posted, I sense (is that like thinking ?) that JC is doing his best to present the consciousness "proper to" the VIII*.
What is the VIII*?
I have some other replies brewing on a different computer but as far as I know the VIII degree is solo sexual magick ie masturbation. Anyone can correct me, of course.
Edit to say, I believe AOS truly pioneered it with using sigils.
I have used it in the past with great success.
But we already have a thread about spooging while wishing things and the general consensus was it's flaky. It worked for me, or maybe I am a semi functioning individual.
I have some other replies brewing on a different computer but as far as I know the VIII degree is solo sexual magick ie masturbation. Anyone can correct me, of course.
8= solo, 9= partnered or hetero, depending on who you ask, 10 does not have a sexual practice associated with it, 11= homosexual or, according to some, transgressive against one's own boundaries, ie personally antimonian sex.
Point of Order: Returning to JC and The Book of AC's Secrets, it seems as though no secrets are revealed.
As the person who started this thread and the only person (it seems) to have read the entire book, I certainly did not mean to insinuate that NO secrets are revealed. I stated unequivocally that it is a very dense text. There are, no doubt, more than a few secrets (relative to who is reading the book) revealed.
It is not, as you said, that NO secrets were revealed and this fact "marked the end of the thread, and the congregation departed." It's that the congregation hasn't read the material upon which the sermon is devoted. They got distracted by a few people in the reception hall waving their arms and speaking in tongues and decided to focus more on the hocus pocus, the casserole and cake.
It is not, as you said, that NO secrets were revealed
I am waiting for the revelation of any secrets. I have not read the text as I am feeble and must rely on the reports of others who are agile. Tiger rolled out a really long list of quotes. Other folks gave general "reviews." Nope. No secrets revealed. Book Cover Hype.
8= solo, 9= partnered or hetero, depending on who you ask
If you ask me, a legitimate holder of VII VIII & IX, VIII is duo and described in Energized enthusiasm. It can be used solo as a substitute.
One of the oldest tricks in the book for cult leaders, make your devotees violate every social norm, even against their own moral compass. Tear them down, and re-build them in your own image (Assuming you are an aspiring cult leader)I
8= solo, 9= partnered or hetero, depending on who you ask, 10 does not have a sexual practice associated with it, 11= homosexual or, according to some, transgressive against one's own boundaries, ie personally antimonian sex.
I am waiting for the revelation of any secrets. I have not read the text as I am feeble and must rely on the reports of others who are agile. Tiger rolled out a really long list of quotes. Other folks gave general "reviews." Nope. No secrets revealed. Book Cover H
Every book that I have ever encountered that has "The Secret(s) of...." in the title (unless it's a Hardy Boys Detective book,) is full of stuff already well established, and well know. (At least by the enthusiasts.)
I have some other replies brewing on a different computer but as far as I know the VIII degree is solo sexual magick ie masturbation. Anyone can correct me, of course.
Christibrany, Thank you for your witty and direct answer to my question. I had no idea Onanism could be so powerful.
One of the oldest tricks in the book for cult leaders, make your devotees violate every social norm, even against their own moral compass. Tear them down, and re-build them in your own image (Assuming you are an aspiring cult leader)
This blurb has no relation to my quote you are quoting upon.
Every book that I have ever encountered that has "The Secret(s) of...." in the title ... is full of stuff already well established ...
Oh, you noticed. Perhaps you also noticed that titles with Aleister Crowley inserted, somewhere, are "coat-tail productions."
and to catch the buyer's look
I will put either Sex, Secrets, or Crowley
in the title, you see?
is an example of all three
I had no idea Onanism could be so powerful.
It is a substitute for the intended purpose. The general gestalt of the VII & VIII is missing some critical point of understanding. This is to be expected as the subject is either secret, occult, or purposely blinded or concealed. No big deal, because we have no Oath of Secrecy hanging over our heads.
I was under that obligation, but H.B. nullified all that - in retrospect. He essentially clandestinized the whole Solar Lodge deal, and org that was the only direct-lineage link to Agape lodge, and the only org operating under The Constitution of the OTO [now revised] on the planet.
So I will point a finger at Energized Enthusiasm, and you will have access to all the data you need to know The Final Secret of The Illuminati [period]
If you combine Energized with Perdurabo's first encounter with Reuss, the story is well-known, where he took AC down to HQ to get "properly obligated under oath," you will grasp the entire picture.
And there's always a Butt. But these descriptions of majestic temples with graceful regal officers and sparkling mescaline were just in AC's mind. There is no evidence that he, or anyone else, ever actually put on this VIII* pageant. Probably somebody, somewhere, tried it - but it never got into print.
No, the overwhelming bestowal of the various higher degrees was accomplished by handing over a "secret paper." Agape Lodge held regular mass, but I never caught even a hint that they did the VIII version of the mass.
Leave a reply
Title
Mr. Cornelius does say that Francis King's Secret Rituals of the OTO held actual "secrets" i.e. the rituals printed herein, and where Grady used the book as a guidebook!
This blurb has no relation to my quote you are quoting upon.
I was responding to Katrice's post.
So I will point a finger at Energized Enthusiasm, and you will have access to all the data you need to know The Final Secret of The Illuminati [period]
It was the semen of Osirus that brought order to the world. It was Seth who masturbated Horus and had dominance over him. Isis cut off Horus's hands (Chester Beatty Papyrus 1)
Mr. Cornelius does say that Francis King's Secret Rituals of the OTO held actual "secrets" i.e. the rituals printed herein, and where Grady used the book as a guidebook!
This is true ... if one considers artificial secrets to be practical secrets.
Grady had no papers, but he had the IX direct from Baphomet (aka Phoenix) with verbal instruction. So Grady grabbed King's book and started from there. King's book is spot on accurate, except for the followin ,,,
1. He omits the "Lost Word" of the III*, a key to the whole first 3 degrees, because there are different Words drifting around ... and he didn't know which was true. How typical of the Lost Word. I have that Word, and it adds to 93, but is not the usual 93 words.
2. King states that there are no rituals for the VII, VIII, or IX, and he slips in the "official" papers for those degrees. He is mistaken. There are rites, and those papers reveal not much, if anything at all ... except Emblems, which is not "official." It was just Baphomet explaining things in plain-speak, with added Bible quotes (as usual), to a IX* who was puzzling.
Then Emblems got into profane hands, which spread the text like a plague.
End of the secrets. No more carrot on a stick. As was mentioned up-thread, the Prince of Jerusalem degree (IV*), also known as Perfect Initiate, is the End of the Road - "Abaddon! The Opening of the Eye!" Annihilation.
It should be noted that the IV* has 3 levels, and is a composite of about 20 different Masonic rites. It is a catch-all for miscellaneous degrees that OTO had in its possession, with nowhere else (on the Tree of Life) to dump them. So AC tidied up the major degrees, re-wrote the first 3 degrees in Templar terms (Saladin's tent), and swept everything else into the IV*. So what? The meaning is clear: End of the Road ... in the first merry go-round.
This marks the end of the Outer Order (or Lesser Mysteries). The V, VI, and VII are simply the RC, Templar, and 33* of antiquity.
Originally, the members of the IX elected one of themselves to be Master of the Temple. Funny how that got transposed to 8=3. Crowley changed that. He made the X* a King for god's sake, and invented an OHO who decided or banished all ideas and governed from the top down. He appointed various X* Kings. Elections? Forget that. This is is full-blown dictatorship.
Thank the leakages that they have no "sexual magic secrets" to hold out front but keep hidden behind nine veils (all of which cost money and get really expensive the higher you go). A IX has taken the Oath of Poverty. That is, he/she has given all to The Grand Treasurer General, who then (is supposed to) support the IX in his/her original state. A IX is a part-owner of the Order. He/she lives in any profess house he/she wants. All houses of IX's are automatically "profess houses."
Yeah, that's the way it was set up (on paper). Parsons threw his mansion into the deal, and the system was "go." They got busted for sex-crimes. Solar lodge gathered up the remains, hauled them out to a single location in the middle of nowhere, all in one security cabinet thank you ... and a child touches off the pyre of the phoenix.
I am an ordained minister, as well as a licensed physician. I pronounce the org dead. Phoenixes rising? Sure. Look closely and you will see tht with each necromantic resurrection, the manifestation becomes denser, more mundane. It's like von wrote (An Account of A'.A.'.) ... The Inner Society departed from the Outer Order.
I should have writ a book titled Secret Sexual Structure of a Failed Attempt to Control the World through Penisism ... maybe I just have, in just a few posts.
I was responding to Katrice's post.
I see. Pardon me. There are bugs in the software right now. One needs to watch where the "/quote" thingy is. Extra lines are being inserted.
It was the semen of Osirus that brought order to the world. It was Seth who masturbated Horus and had dominance over him. Isis cut off Horus's hands
Ancient Papyral Graffiti.
One of the oldest tricks in the book for cult leaders, make your devotees violate every social norm, even against their own moral compass. Tear them down, and re-build them in your own image (Assuming you are an aspiring cult leader)
Well, I'm not an aspiring cult leader, and I do agree that those are tactics used by cult leaders, but they can also be powerful methods for people inclined to use them. I've posted a few times before about Indulgence and Transgression in magick. There are even a couple of groups I know of who focus primarily on those things as core practices. I've personally used all of them to good effect in my own practice as did Crowley himself.
"One of the oldest tricks in the book for cult leaders, make your devotees violate every social norm, even against their own moral compass. Tear them down, and re-build them in your own image (Assuming you are an aspiring cult leader)" quote from @toadstoolwe
Exactly the methodology of the corrupt the youth, 'sex, drugs, and rock n roll' pseudo counter-culture seeded and steered by Tavistock and Langley for the central banks and corporations, and now nothing but bland mainstream schlock muzak of anti free speech tyrants pushing mass genocide, get the shot, and world war III...a mass initiation into literal hell...but a racially integrated hell so that is all that matters as depicted in this view of Philadelphia near the Badlands....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bi1Kf-1qd6Y