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  • #116145

    Shiva
    Participant

    bel: “… for yours is the kingdom</sem>, and the power, and the glory, for ever and ever, amen.”

    For you have Malkuth, et Geburah, et Chesed, for all of temporal time-space. Amoun.

    bel: I don’t think he was faking it

    I don’t either. Everybody knows that the Lord and his Agents speak in Olde King James English. Crowley could write a book or an Equinox in contemporary English, but holy books were usually in Thee, Thou, and Thine.

    This, of course, brings up an important principle or concept: Whether or not an Agent of the Lord is an independent entity, or a piece of our sub/unconscious, when it/he/she speaks, and we “channel” its/his/her monologue or dialogue, it/he/she can only use the words and concepts that are already “in place” in our mind(s).

    Yes, some folks are reported to have hit their head, and suddenly are speaking Chinese. And some people get into a snit, no, trance, and spout either gibberish, tongues, or foreign lingo. But that hasnt undergone full testing yet. If a Nordic alien offers you a ride in his craft, he doesn’t say, “Get thee into my chariot, Satan.” But if it was ArchAgent Gabriel, or Moroni [what a name for an Agent], he very likely would use Bible-speak .

    Ig: My atheist academic parents always made clear that no one but an idiot believed that stuff, but that one had to go and observe the forms. They would typically join the priest for drinks after services. The priest’s elder son taught me to “loid” a lock by pushing the bolt back with a thin plastic card (or, originally, celluloid card, thus the name) so that we could break into the church and work mischief while our parents were drinking.

    This account is so bizarre that you must either be making it up as you go, or it needs to be written as a screenplay, or at least a play-play.

    Ig: But Crowley’s Bible-y tone never fails to grate on me as a phony attempt to sound “holy”. Aiwass, for some reason, has the same disease.

    Me, too. Grate. Sounds like Quackers speaking. Or is it those Shakers … or the Mennonites? Of course Aiwass is sympathetic (“same disease”). The Lord and his Agents learned English circa the late 1500s (16th century).

    Also, note the tendency for A.’.A.’. graders to assume Latin Mottos (not Mottas). And the A.’.A.’. imprimatur has all those Collegiums.

    Different languages for different upbringings. Probably imprinted or embedded in early childhood.

    Is there a kirk? I’m Ag’in it! “Fully two-thirds of eveil on this planet is caused directly by religion.”
    -Sinnett, channeling (auto written) Master Morya (my paraphrasery)

    #116147

    ignant666
    Participant

    This account is so bizarre that you must either be making it up as you go, or it needs to be written as a screenplay, or at least a play-play.

    This is absolutely true. His name was Paulie S., his little brother’s name i forget. Paulie and i were best friends ages 7-10.

    We regularly broke into the church, and drank communion wine because we were not allowed to have it (not more than a couple swills, since we were little kids), and ran around generally being silly, and trying to think of bad things to do.

    The adults were busy drinking cocktails, and discussing whatever grown-ups talked about back then (hippies, Viet-Nam, civil rights, stupid grown-up books? who knew?), and we kids were bored. It is said that “Idle hands do the Devil’s work”, and probably children should not be left unsupervised after traumatic shit like an Xian Sunday school.

    On Palm Sunday 1968 or 1969, we stole all the leftover palm-crosses, and burned them upside down on our “Satanic altar” (we called it this) in Paulie’s back-yard in the corner of a gothic buttress of the church, while torturing bugs on the altar by putting pins in their heads and touching the antennas of our “G.I. Joe Walkie-Talkies” to the pins, causing them to jump and jerk. Yes, i was a pre-teen Satanist.

    Another thing about my religious upbringing that makes modern folks go ‘Huh?” is that my main Sunday School teacher could roll a cigarette one-handed, while holding his Protestant Children’s Terrifying Bible Stories of God’s EVIL Nature, And How He Tortures Folks book in his left hand.

    Because of course he chain-smoked (in a suit and tie, to be fair to him) throughout teaching us our Sunday School lessons about Total Depravity, and Jesus, and reading us children’s Bible stories like the Prophet Simon and the children and the bears, and whatnot.

    Jesus always scared the living fuck out of me, and i was thus a sucker for Crowley when i found out about him age 12-13.

    And the part about Great-Grandma Hattie and my born-again hippie uncle and aunt is absolutely true also. They are the nicest Xians you could ever hope to meet (gun-totin’, Bible readin’, left-votin’ style) and all my cousins are super-nice woods-hippies, with Bible names but they make no never-mind over that stuff.

    #116151

    Shiva
    Participant

    Ig: This is absolutely true.

    Okay … in a metaphorical sense. The real question, upon which your lineage rests, is:
    Do you have a written document, with official seal(s), issued to you by someone, who was touched by someone who was touched by Crowley, Germer, Motta, or the Devil?

    We are only able to affiliate with one Devil … all the rest being fakirs.

    #116152

    ignant666
    Participant

    No , i do not, and it is entirely possible i have imagined/made up my entire childhood and family history.

    As my greatest mentor in the law, the late horrifying music biz dinosaur known to man as Harold Rosenblum, Esq. used to like to ask;

    H: “These people, who claim to be your parents, how do you know?”

    Me:”Well, Harold, my aunts and uncles say so.”

    H: “Paid actors!”

    Me: “There are birth certificates, and other documents.”

    H: “Forgeries!”

    me:”There are war records and stuff at the government going back generations!”

    H: “Are there no depths, no treachery, to which these people will not sink, in their desire to deceive a nice young man like yourself?”

    [Harold certainly had no such opinion of me, “the laziest and stupidest person [he] had ever tried to teach some law”.]

    Me: “Fine, Harold, i have no idea if my parents are actually my parents.” [He did not do this routine more than a couple times a day, after all.]

    H: “It is a wise child, [Ignant], who knows his own mother. Now would be an excellent time to bring my delicious lunch, i am thinking.”

    [BACK AT THE OFFICE. WE HAVE BEEN SUED BY MORE OF THE DOZENS OF ARTISTS WE ARE NOT PAYING SONG-WRITING ROYALTIES THEY ARE DUE.]

    Very Gay Co-Senior Counsel: “OH- MY-GOD, Har-old, not MORE paternity suits!” [this line used every day after lunch, by which time we had been served with all the papers from all the artists who had sued us that day.

    Perhaps i should explain that Harold was very fat and not perhaps as attractive to women as he might have wished.

    He once commanded: “Sha-Ron, cover your ears!” [addressing the gorgeous black attorney who did most of the actual work].

    H: “[Ignant], do you know my greatest wish?”

    Me: “No, Harold, what is your greatest wish, that Sha-Ron cannot hear?”

    H: “[Ignant], i would like, just once, to see my penis again, without looking in the mirror.”

    Me: “So Harold, do you think your problem is that you are too fat, or that your penis is too small?”

    H: “I am shocked that you would even ask me these questions, which only show the limitations of your sad and vulgar mind.”

    • This reply was modified 2 months, 1 week ago by  ignant666.
    #116153

    Shiva
    Participant

    Ig: No , i do not … (followed by excuses).

    No Certificate of Verified Evocation? Too bad. You will have to join Germer, McMurtry, Seckler, Eshelman, Motta, Starr, Solar Lodge, and myself in the Losers classification.

    #116155

    ignant666
    Participant

    Yup, busted.

    All i can do, your Honor [“your Honour” in Foreign Parts Where They Drive On The Wrong Side) is plead the little-known “Ain’t Braggin’ If’n It’s So” rule.

    #116156

    Tiger
    Participant

    Child
    wonder;
    who made the earth
    shake and quake;
    make the sea
    foam;
    perhaps a millennia ago
    with no verification .

    #116157

    ignant666
    Participant

    I will admit that the Sunday School book title Protestant Children’s Terrifying Bible Stories of God’s EVIL Nature, And How He Tortures Folks is from memory. and may not be entirely correct, but the substance of what it contained is very accurate.

    #116158

    Tiger
    Participant

    “The cut-throat debates about transubstantiation (in the Eucharist), the hypostases of the Trinity, or the divine/human nature of Christ, could not even be followed without a thorough training in current Greek philosophical discourse. By the end of the 5th century, the audience in the philosophical classrooms in Alexandria was predominantly Christian, and Neoplatonism continued to be taught in some form or other in Athens, Alexandria, Constantinople, Baghdad, Mistra, and other pockets of learning until its triumphant revival in Renaissance Italy.

    Neoplatonists would most vehemently protest against the latter-day Christian dogma that human salvation has already been accomplished vicariously through the life and death of a man revered as the son of god.

    Egyptian-born Plotinus (204/5–270) is commonly regarded as the founder of Neoplatonism

    The Neoplatonists used the words “procession and return” (prohodos and epistrophê),

    The term “Neoplatonism” refers to a philosophical school of thought that first emerged and flourished in the Greco-Roman world of late antiquity, roughly from the time of the Roman Imperial Crisis to the Arab conquest, i.e., the middle of the 3rd to the middle of the 7th century. In consequence of the

    demise of ancient materialist or corporealist thought

    They held Plato’s views, which they understood as a positive system of philosophical doctrine, in higher esteem than the tenets of the pre-Socratics, Aristotle, or any other subsequent thinker.

    grand synthesis of an intellectual heritage that was by then exceedingly rich and profound. In effect, they absorbed, appropriated, and creatively harmonized almost the entire Hellenic tradition of philosophy, religion, and even literature

    The result of this effort was a grandiose and powerfully persuasive system of thought that reflected upon a millennium of intellectual culture and brought the scientific and moral theories of Plato, Aristotle, and the ethics of the Stoics into fruitful dialogue with literature, myth, and religious practice.

    meta-discourse and reflection on the sum-total of ideas produced over centuries of sustained inquiry into the human condition.

    developed their characteristically speculative brand of philosophical enquiry in which empirical facts tended to serve as illustrations rather than heuristic starting points or test cases.

    Assumption
    mindful consciousness (nous, often translated as thought, intelligence, or intellect) is in an important sense ontologically prior to the physical realm typically taken for ultimate reality (Mind over Matter). There existed a dispute between Plato and Aristotle over whether or not the objects of mindful consciousness (abstract concepts, Platonic or otherwise, numbers, geometrical properties, and so forth) are also ontologically prior, but the Neoplatonists regarded this fact as a matter of inconsequential detail. And so, following a venerable and abiding tradition of Mind over Matter, Neoplatonism inevitably turned out to be an idealist type of philosophy.

    reality, in all its cognitive and physical manifestations, depended on a highest principle which is unitary and singular. Neoplatonic philosophy is a strict form of principle-monism that strives to understand everything on the basis of a single cause that they considered divine, and indiscriminately referred to as “the First”, “the One”, or “the Good”.

    Since it is reasonable to assume, as the Neoplatonists did, that any efficient cause is ontologically prior to, and hence more real, than its effect, then, in the hierarchy of being, the first principle, whatever it is, cannot be less “real” than the phenomena it is supposed to explain.

    How are we to understand and describe the emergence of the universe, with all its diverse phenomena, as the effect of a singular principle of consciousness?

    how is it possible to understand the emergence of the physical, material universe from a singularity that is in every sense unlike this universe? Their answer to this question was entirely new, and went far beyond any prior cosmic aetiology, including that of Plato’s Timaeus, in elegance

    Neoplatonists were not creationists. That is to say, whatever account they were giving about the universe’s origin, this narrative was not to be misunderstood as recounting a creation in time or at the very beginning of time. Instead, they speculated that the process of the emergence of the universe from the divine principle, as they conceived of it (described below), has gone on forever, just as it continues at this very moment and will continue to do so, sustaining a world without end.

    unlike the ancient theologians of Israel and Egypt, the Neoplatonists did not think that the universe could spring from the deity directly and in a way that surpasses all understanding, for example by being thought and spoken into existence. Their more refined view was that reality emerged from “the First” in coherent stages, in such a way that one stage functions as creative principle of the next.

    the very first principle of reality, conceived of as an entity that is beyond Being, transcending all physical reality, very little can actually be said, except that it is absolute Unity.

    According to Neoplatonic theory, Consciousness would not be some kind of emergent property of material constituents arranged in a certain way, but rather be the first effect of the activity of the One, the most supreme form of reality (since the One was posited to be beyond Being), a kind of pre-embodied power of cognition as such. Neoplatonists referred to Consciousness as the second “Hypostasis”

    What, then, is the inner activity of Consciousness? The inherent task of consciousness is to understand, and understanding entails the cognition of causes. In trying to understand itself, Consciousness can only turn towards its origin and thus posit or behold the First as the transcendent principle of its own reality.

    Soul is the very process of expressing the intelligible world in the derivative form of sensible natural living beings and the lives they live.

    human existence is a striking representation of the cosmos as a whole, a microcosm in which all levels of being (Unity, Consciousness, Soul, Nature, Matter) are combined into one organic individual.
    The entire cosmic edifice, “came from above”. A human being is therefore in the first instance not a social or political being, but a divine being, and life’s purpose was seen not so much in the exercise and rehearsal of the traditional virtues that give meaning and quality to our interaction with others, but in seeking “to bring back the god in us to the divine in the All

    the principal doctrines of the Neoplatonists proved exceedingly influential throughout the entire history of western philosophy. Through Augustine (354–430) in the West and the 4th-century Cappadocian Fathers (Basil, Gregory of Nyssa, Gregory of Nazianzus) in the East as well as the pseudo-epigraphic writings of Dionysius the Areopagite (early 6th century), Neoplatonism profoundly influenced the emergence of mainstream and not so mainstream Christian theology (John Scotus Eriugena, Thomas Aquinas, Duns Scotus, Meister Eckhart). In addition, by way of a pseudo-epigraphical treatise entitled Theology of Aristotle, Neoplatonic thought facilitated the integration of ancient philosophy and science into both Islam (especially through Al-Kindi, Al-Farabi and Avicenna [Ibn Sina]) and Judaism (Maimonides).

    Neoplatonic ideas have continued to influence Western thinkers of the idealist persuasion, such as the Cambridge Platonists (who were really Neoplatonists), Leibniz, Hegel, Schelling, Fichte, Bergson and Teilhard de Chardin, to name but a few.”
    https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/neoplatonism/

    #116159

    ignant666
    Participant

    Yes, Neo-Gnosticism/Illuminism/Theosophy/Crowleyanity is mostly a form of Neo-Platonism.

    A spiritual/illuminated/gnosis-based “Here is this ‘real reality’, of which we illuminates have direct knowledge, that transcends or precedes the physical/intellectual ‘forms’, including that fake ‘reality’ you normies know.” And there are many systems of Neo-Platonic pigeonholes, and a master-pigeonhole-correlation book (777), and other stuff. It is good to study and understand this stuff.

    There are, however, 3 stages:

    1) “When the mountain is the mountain, and the lake is the lake”;

    2) “When the mountain is not the mountain, and the lake is not the lake.”;

    3) “When the mountain is the mountain, and the lake is the lake”.
    ______________________
    put another way:

    Disciple: “What is the ‘Buddha Nature’?

    Master: “Buddha is a dried shit stick!” [begins striking disciple about head, and whatever is easily reachable]

    • This reply was modified 2 months, 1 week ago by  ignant666.
    #116161

    ignant666
    Participant

    WARNING: THERE IS A TALKING MONKEY HOLDING YOU HOSTAGE INSIDE YOUR BRAIN.

    THE MONKEY WILL BE HAPPY TO TALK ABOUT NEO-PLATONISM, ZEN, OR ANY TOPIC FOR DECADES. TALKING IS THE MONKEY’S JOB.

    THERE IS ONE SOLUTION: TAKE OFF YOUR CLOTHES AND GO INTO THE WILDERNESS ALONE AFTER [REDACTED TO AVOID ‘BEEF’ WITH ‘THE MAN’].

    [i mean, if anyone knows something else that works, do let us know, but i never heard of another way of making that monkey shut up that sounded half-way convincing, and i tried most of ’em despite that. Above method works; no lineages, sempiternal orders, or revelations required]

    • This reply was modified 2 months, 1 week ago by  ignant666.
    #116163

    Shiva
    Participant

    T: … the emergence of the universe from the divine principle, as they conceived of it, … has gone on forever, just as it continues at this very moment and will continue to do so, sustaining a world without end.

    “Whenever seven sit in unity is the beginning of the age. This meeting goes on forever at Shamballa.”
    The Book of Life and Death

    Ig: i mean, if anyone knows something else that works, do let us know, but i never heard of another way

    It is said that 20 years of Raja Yoga will do it. But it’s still a temporary thing. There is no known way to stop the internal dialog permanently. Some folks seem to have done it, but they cannot pass along a technique or practice that will do it. Selective brain surgery may work, but we’d be placing a lot of trust in docs that don’t know what they’re doing.

    #116164

    Tiger
    Participant

    primal cosmic substance
    conscious
    monkey
    on the level of seeming,
    partless moments of inner, outer apprehenders
    free from reference points,
    a different chatter.
    than the naked man in the woods.
    zen master
    chopping,
    again, there, cycle.

    pull roll scramble progressively
    chatter chatter blah blah blah

    shut up

    #116175

    Anonymous

    the inner three is
    shiva the destroyer (sun) tiger the creator and iggy the father my opposite in the north that binds all together with me ..

    Whenever seven sit in unity is the beginning of the age. This meeting goes on forever at Shamballa.”
    – The Book of Life and Death

    ok seven

    Iggy
    shiva
    tiger
    dom the devils advocate
    belmurru
    chris
    michael
    jamie

    I need to know I have 8 real people not ghosts please

    .. how is that for a choice that was chosen for me that’s 8 and Paul as the ghost who walks any other suggestions?

    from above typhonian is represented by Michael uranus ..i still call it herschel
    so who else represents what from my diagram

    then there the outer circles like the circle of twelve

    Lashtal – is the chosen lineage of the king and record keepers of the scribe and the guardians of the royal line

    Lashtal as the society of Aleister, or someone
    will buy my farm (it is for sale) as holy ground of the rainbow serpent kingly queen to allow me to dwell in peace by my river and work on the universal opening and continuance the energy is here .. my birds are here and cows and kangaroos and fish in my river otherwise I have to fight and leave and im tired of fighting.. my will is to work HERE…and not have to leave here to often because i seem to get injured when i do… and I dont need the stress

    #116181

    Anonymous

    well in a perfect world that would be it..

    the way i see it is that all lineages like the AA is corrupted at the top to stop truth emerging..

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