11  

  RSS

 Anonymous
Joined: 50 years ago
Posts: 0
25/12/2009 3:39 am  

I know most of you have a more expansive knowledge of magick than me. This is a song of TOOL's I've been interested in. Eleven seems to be depicted in an obsessive manner. All I know about 11 is that its a key number in the function of magick. It also occurs alot in my life. Such as the number of letters in a girl friends name, the number of the month I broke up with her in. Key events happening at 11:00 oclock as well as purchasing my first crowley book totalled 11.11. My first magickal creation which was the circle in the triangle of Solomon's goetic summoning system was exactly 11 inches around. It is also the length of my, okay thats an exageration but you get the point. I'm not looking for any deffinite answers, this number just seems to want to make a statemant to me.

What was it like to see,
The face of your own stability,
Suddenly look away,
Leaving you with the dead and hopeless?

Eleven and she was gone.
Eleven is when we waved good-bye.
Eleven is standing still,
Waiting for me to free him,
By coming home.

Moving me with a sound.
Opening me within a gesture.
Drawing me down and in,
Showing me where it all began,
Eleven.

You're too scar'd to realize this,
You are the voice that's been calling me back home.

Under a dead Ohio sky,
Eleven has been and will be waiting,
Defending his light and wondering,
Where the hell have I been?
Sleeping lost and numb I.
So glad that I have found you.
I am wide awake and heading,
Home.

I wish that I could see you,
Turn and run to play.
Dreams are fading,
Carry my ancient soul.

Carry me into the light.
Aim your body heavenly,
Enduring a memory.
I’ll come to your light,
Hold your light.
Hold your light where I can see it,

Hold it,
High.

Hold your light,
Eleven, Lead me through each gentle step,
By step,
By inch by loaded memory,
I'll move,
To heal,
As soon as pain allows so we can,
Reunite,
And both move on together.

Hold,
Your light,
Eleven lead me through each gentle step,
By step,
By inch by loaded memory 'till,
One,
And one are one,
Eleven.
So glow,
Child,
Glow.
I'm heading back home


Quote
 Anonymous
Joined: 50 years ago
Posts: 0
25/12/2009 3:43 am  

if you dont believe me check out the 2 degrees added together in the thelemic time.


ReplyQuote
Los
 Los
(@los)
Noble Member
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 2208
25/12/2009 4:55 am  

What you're talking about here are coincidences involving numbers. You think 11 is special, so you notice it everywhere and notice numbers that add up to it everywhere. If you thought 15 was special, you would notice 15 everywhere and numbers that add up to it everywhere.

But your attribution of significance to these coincidences isn't completely useless to you: it gives you an example of how your mind works at making connections between things. In other words, by observing the pattern of your mind's connections, you get better at detecting the way your mind constructs patterns (so that, hopefully, you won't get misled by them).

For example, from the song lyrics you posted and from the relationship details you offered, it sounds like your mind is constructing a pattern around this relationship. That's just a guess on my part, of course, but if that is the case, then there are two ways you can go: either you go off the deep end and start thinking things like the universe is sending you messages about this oh-so-special relationship, or you wise up and realize that your mind is creating a fantasy.

And there's the usefulness: when you realize what it is that your mind is doing, it becomes easier to detect that it's your mind that's forming a fantasy. If you didn't have these recognizable numerological coincidences for your mind to latch onto, then it might be harder to detect the motion of your mind.

Now as for what 11 symbolizes, the simplest answer is that it signifies the union of the microcosm and the macrocosm (5+6) and is thus a symbol of the Great Work. So, as far as numbers go, if you're going to see one of them everywhere, it might as well be 11 since *every* act can be conceived as a union between the microcosm and macrocosm ("But always unto me").

But all this "the number is making a statement to me" stuff isn't going to help you. It's the idea behind the number, not the number itself, that counts.


ReplyQuote
 Anonymous
Joined: 50 years ago
Posts: 0
25/12/2009 7:16 am  

There is another point of view about 11; that in the same ways that numbers stand for certain higher archetypal ideas, they are also gates of consciousness that can take you to another vibration.

About 25 years ago, Lee Carol started channeling an entity called Kryon of the Magnetic Service (www.kryon.com). If my memory helps me well, Kryon talked a lot about the potential of 11:11 as a gate of consciousness that would change the gloom and doom prophecies about Armagedon. Actually, I think it was another channeler, Solara (www.nvisible.com), who first mentioned it as a gate which would serve to change humanity's consciousness.
According to Kryon of the Magnetic Service 11 carries the idea of "appropriate action" -and now that I come to think about it, yes, of course it can be related to the Great Work.

Many believe that, by now, the gate has been already passed by a critical mass of people so the end of Mayans' calendar will not be the first step to a global disaster but merely be the beginning of a new era of enlightened human beings.

Generally, synchronicity has much to do with the frequent occurrence of certain numbers, especially when they’re double (11:11 etc) and one could use them to read one’s energy and realize what is the vibration he is in at that moment.

Regards
Hecate


ReplyQuote
Los
 Los
(@los)
Noble Member
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 2208
25/12/2009 8:11 am  
"93rdLibra" wrote:
You're right. I realize you can deduce any number, out of pretty much any other number.It's not hard to believe that we may sometimes be , counting the hits and ignoring the misses, when it comes to this number.

Yes. Crowley makes a joke out of this in 777 when he notes the objection that with the methods of gematria, one can make something out of nothing. A Qabalist, he says, would respond, "With these methods, One did make everything out of nothing."

Har, har.

But its unintelligent thing to say, we need to "wise up" about pondering these sort of things. For if that were a wise course of action, then if by some chance we had lived during Crowley's life time. We would have had to tell him to "wise up" about attributing any kind significance to any number.

Well, again, the point I'm making is not that you should never attribute symbolic significance to numbers, but rather that it's what the number symbolizes that's important (and not the fact that you'll inevitably notice the number a lot if you decide that it's important).

Crowley himself has an interesting letter on coincidence in Magick Without Tears: http://www.hermetic.com/crowley/mwt/mwt_40.htm l"> http://www.hermetic.com/crowley/mwt/mwt_40.html This letter is particularly interesting in the context of number coincidences, as Crowley recounts seeing the number 4 cropping up all the time while working on Book 4.

Now obviously, things aren't true just because Crowley says so, but I think the points he makes towards the end of this letter are both correct and relevant: "The Universe is therefore nothing but Coincidence!"

The very idea of one outcome being more of a "coincidence" than another is entirely the product of our minds, as Crowley's roulette example demonstrates.

As to the number 11, you may want to study the word abrahadabra, as it contains 11 letters (5 A's and 6 consonants), embodying the formula of joining the microcosm to the macrocosm. The entire word totals 418. Let the number crunching begin!

There is also, of course, the mystery of the Rose and the Cross, of which it would be improper to comment further in this place.


ReplyQuote
 Anonymous
Joined: 50 years ago
Posts: 0
25/12/2009 2:32 pm  

About my views on numerological Jungian synchronicity I could say the number 93 usually pops up more than usually when I am going through some hard period but which is in correspondence with my will. Also numbers 5 (the pentagram) and 6 (The macrocosm,the holy hexagram,the universe) seem to be shown together a lot, and which I see as a sign of just to go on and remember that universe will help me and that the situation is not so desperate as it might seem when looking surfacially. I also noticed that the 156, the number of Babalon, seemed to come up a lot when I was really inspired by the babalonian current. I am conscious that I might see those `cause I am only seeking for certain numbers, and possibly Robert Anton Wilsons concept of a man creating a reality tunnel would be appropriate - anyway, my experience doesn`t totally relate into it. Remember the chaos magick principles? "Nothing is true,everything is permitted", therefore the truth does not need to be proved, but everyone may choose their own truths. I am not seeking any objective truth for everyone to accept in my numerological dabblings, but only subjective is enough. It also reminds in my head what Lon Milo duQuette said about if one is willing to relate different ideas in each others through numerology, it does not matter at all, how one is doing it, but most important is that one only does it to get the mind exploded. But that`s a bit different aspect of numerology than this one of seeing relations and poppings in ordinary life so I`m not going further on that in this...

93,
Azoneris


ReplyQuote
 Anonymous
Joined: 50 years ago
Posts: 0
25/12/2009 4:27 pm  

... also must add: This year 2009 e.v. is, or was, the year of 11 cause 2 plus 0 plus 0 plus 9 = 11. To me it brought a lot change and the connection seems meaningfull. Of course one can continue it as 1 plus 1 = 2, but to each his/her own. To me it was and will be the year of 11. >:--D

This sentence also came up on my eyes yesterday when looking at "Art in america", that I had as an christmas present: "What does it matter whether anyone is right? If he does right, it will last."

(sorry for not using the edit-button to connect my two posts ín a row, but the timeperiod of 20 min. was not enough this time)


ReplyQuote
 Anonymous
Joined: 50 years ago
Posts: 0
25/12/2009 7:23 pm  
"Los" wrote:
What you're talking about here are coincidences involving numbers. You think 11 is special, so you notice it everywhere and notice numbers that add up to it everywhere. If you thought 15 was special, you would notice 15 everywhere and numbers that add up to it everywhere.

But your attribution of significance to these coincidences isn't completely useless .

I arrive at a somewhat different conclusion than Los on this point. If we plug out the word "coincidences" and insert "Syncronicities", it changes the rhetorical force of the first sentence into one that is more optimistic.

I do accept the proposition that whatever we focus on will "stick out" from the background around us. What ever we focus on, we invoke into our sphere of conciouseness. But the conclusion that I draw from this phenomena does not exclude the possiblity that numbers may be more than conventions for linking disparate ideas.


ReplyQuote
Los
 Los
(@los)
Noble Member
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 2208
25/12/2009 7:37 pm  
"Azoneris" wrote:
Remember the chaos magick principles? "Nothing is true,everything is permitted", therefore the truth does not need to be proved, but everyone may choose their own truths.

Yikes. Try skydiving with the attitude that "everyone may choose their own truths" and see what happens if you "choose" to ignore your instructor and do your own thing on the way down....

The word "truth" means a correspondence between one's thoughts and the reality outside of one's thoughts. Figuring out what is actually true (as opposed to "true for you") can only be helpful to you in any given situation.

It also reminds in my head what Lon Milo duQuette said about if one is willing to relate different ideas in each others through numerology, it does not matter at all, how one is doing it, but most important is that one only does it to get the mind exploded.

You're talking about the idea that if one uses the Qabalah to connect each idea to every other idea, eventually one "overloads" the mind and becomes capable of seeing past the mind. It's similar to the idea of using Zen koans to distract the mind, and it's also similar to the idea of observing patterns the mind makes with the goal of not being distracted by those patterns.

You're more than capable of doing these things while being aware that your mind isn't "sending out vibrations" to the world and making some numbers appear more often than others. In fact, realizing that it's just your mind working will make it *easier* to see past the mind; if you take your imaginings as reality, it will be much harder to see past them.


ReplyQuote
 Anonymous
Joined: 50 years ago
Posts: 0
25/12/2009 8:42 pm  

Yikes. Try skydiving with the attitude that "everyone may choose their own truths" and see what happens if you "choose" to ignore your instructor and do your own thing on the way down....

The death of a physical body is much more easier to consider false or true than the phenomenal numerological synchronisity, especially if one is creating meaningfull and successfull wholes by using it. One can create theories which more or less mirror the truth, but the truth seems to me seems to be beyond words. I was not talking about hitting a head to to a wall or "fake it until you make it"-kinda things.

The word "truth" means a correspondence between one's thoughts and the reality outside of one's thoughts. Figuring out what is actually true (as opposed to "true for you") can only be helpful to you in any given situation.

Sometimes thoughts (visualisation, stimulations etc or what ever one wants to call it) affect the reality outside by first causing inner change, but of course not in every case and it`s not that simple.

You're talking about the idea that if one uses the Qabalah to connect each idea to every other idea, eventually one "overloads" the mind and becomes capable of seeing past the mind. It's similar to the idea of using Zen koans to distract the mind, and it's also similar to the idea of observing patterns the mind makes with the goal of not being distracted by those patterns.

You're more than capable of doing these things while being aware that your mind isn't "sending out vibrations" to the world and making some numbers appear more often than others. In fact, realizing that it's just your mind working will make it *easier* to see past the mind; if you take your imaginings as reality, it will be much harder to see past them.

Yes, you are right, and maybe it was an error to bring that into this conversation, as you can see from my earlier posts ending. These "Signs" could be seen as much reality as one sees dreams, which many times seem to mirror very meaningfully the imbalanced parts of the psyche. True? Reality? Only personal reality? Minds work? Who cares, if it works. Or is it so?
"Success is thy proof: argue not; convert not; talk not over much!" (AL 3:42)

93,
Azoneris


ReplyQuote
 Anonymous
Joined: 50 years ago
Posts: 0
25/12/2009 11:12 pm  

Thank you for all the insite, will read through a few times. I don't mean to insist, 93rd libra has been their with me. I don't mean to recognize it, it started after hearing that song. I added the letters in my ex's name who I had trouble letting go. Eleven, her name translates symbolically into 1 + -1. Her name means raven and her last is white, while the raven is known as the bird of death. We all know what white symbolizes. Meeting her in eleventh month as well is a bit of a coinky. My best friends funeral was in the eleventh month of that same year. I'm a musically oriented person, my favorite song is 11.11 seconds long not because I like the number. My favorite live track is also 11.11 seconds long. So trust me when I say I don't just try and diduce my life to 11. I have my own personal dance with this beast. Why doesn't my favorite song end at 11:10 or 4:22 theirs a million possabilities really. The things that interest me usually involve 11 staring me in the face. The eleventh trump in the tarot is Lust featuring a woman riding upon a lion, I know this card has a lot to do with the leo in relation to libra. I'm a libra and the girl I lusted after was a leo. Again bringing it back into perspective. It can be all a bunch of phony shit I made up in my head. But christ why am I sitting in the eleventh seat at a tool concert. In which my favorite song of theirs is eleven minutes eleven seconds long. Seriously look up the song rosetta stoned and tell me that bitch isn't eleven minutes eleven seconds long.


ReplyQuote
 Anonymous
Joined: 50 years ago
Posts: 0
26/12/2009 7:14 pm  

If you get seriously involved in the praxis of this work, sooner or later, probably sooner, synchronicities will occur that are so dramatic that any explanation for them would rule out randomity or the mind's selective perception. For instance, the first time I invoked Horus, immediately afterwards, I turned on the television and there was a documentary on the Egyptian God Horus. I was working overseas, had no idea what tv stations there were, and didn't change the channel at all. Just turned on the television and there was Horus.

The same kind of thing can happen with numbers. As Los implies, a healthy dose of skepticism is advised because we all know how easily it is deceive ourselves. Robert Anton Wilson's Cosmic Trigger vol. I has good material on numerological and other synchronicities, and also shows how he used gematria as an aid to navigate through life's labyrinth.


ReplyQuote
 Anonymous
Joined: 50 years ago
Posts: 0
27/12/2009 6:47 am  

I will mirror what everyone else said about finding number anywhere. Also, you've got to remember that with Tool, it's most likely deliberate. Maynard is into sacred geometry and especially Danny who has one of the best personalThelema/Crowley libraries in the world


ReplyQuote
Share: