January 31, 2017 at 2:51 pm #98727
— My quotes from download Timothy Moss: Squaring The Circle:
Page 4: Regardless of wheter one believes the Book of the Law is what Crowley claims it is, there can be little doubt that his perception of the book chaged over the years.
Page 5: Most of the content in the Book of the Law can be traced to to contemporary sources that Crowley would have been exposed to while reading popular or academic literature, […] except some of the Egyptian elements, and it is within those we find a glimmer of truth as to the autorship of the text. […]
Page 5: “… he [Crowley] would need to have known what the three primary images on the stele represents, since each chapter [of Crowley’s the Book of the Law] correaltes to a specific image on it. […]
Page 5: At the time there were no published descriptions of the imagery of the stele […] There were also no published photos of the front of the stele, thus requiring a visit be made to the Cairo Museum by Crowley in order to see the stele imagery, facts that put to rest the accusation that Aleister and Rose Crowley never visited the Museum.
Page 6: Although most of the god names in the Book of the Law are taken from Maspero’s writings [Gaston Maspero, resident Egyptology expert, and the person in charge of Egyptian antiquities in 1904 in Cairo], a few others consist of odd spellings found nowhere else.
Page 7: […] the voice Crowley perceived as that of Aiwass was nothing more than internal dialogue formed from his own knowledge and thougts. [Not the position of Timothy Moss, but a position mentioned by Timothy Moss.]
Page 7: Ra-Hoor-Khuit as as a stand-alone spelling is nowhere to be found in Maspero’s works; the name was apparently constructed from parts of other names, an indication the author of the Book of the Law read and understood Egyptological writings to the point of being able to accurately construct god names.
Page 7: There are two god names that were used in the ritual to invoke Horus that are of particular interest: Heru-pa-kraat and Hoor, The first name is significant in that it contains the word kraat, a word that utilizes the letter a twice in a row, a characteristic not seen elsewhere except in some of the god names of the Book of the Law, and a fact that suggests whoever conceived the spelling Heru-pa-kraat is also the author of the book.
Page 9: Crowley, […] rejected the [ancient] Egyptian religion as a source of meaning for the Book of the Law.
Page 10: Summary and Conclusion […] Although there are elements of the [ancient] Egyptian religion in the Book of the Law that could serve as a basis for its revival in some form, Crowley rejected the idea, concluding instead that the god names are mere literary conveniences, and not to be treated as Egyptian gods.
— My comment to download Timothy Moss: Squaring The Circle:
Before writing the Book of the Law, Crowley went to Ceylon in Sri Lanka, to visit an English friend, Alan Bennett, who was also involved in esotericism and had studied Hinduism and Buddhism. And before writing the Book of the Law Crowley also traveled through India staying at ashrams and studying with Hindu gurus. And also before writing the Book of the Law, Crowley’s honeymoon with his first wife, took them to Paris, Naples, Cairo, India, and then back to Cairo in the spring of 1904.
Within Hinduism as a religion, deities can be understood both as theological personages, and as terms for natural forces and principles, like for example the cosmic functions of creation, maintenance, and destruction, being personified as a triad of deities, typically Brahma the creator, Vishnu the preserver, and Shiva the destroyer/transformer. Something resembling how Crowley used the three ‘deities’ supposedly expressing themselves respectively, in the three chapters of “the threefold book of Law.” (Chapter 1:35), as terms for natural forces and principles.
And within Hinduism as a religion, the deities Shiva and Shakti can be understood both as theological personages, and as terms for the interplay between two forces, which if you experience a perfect unity of them, supposedly can lead to the aim of Tantra and Yoga, through supposedly leading to the dissolution of duality (Swami Nischalananda Saraswati, “Shiva & Shakti—The Twin Realities”). Something resembling how the ‘deity’ in the last and third chapter of The Book of the Law (used as a term for your “silent self” or “Holy Guardian Angel” in Crowley’s New Commentaries to that book), according to Crowley can be understood as a child of the interplay between two ‘deities’, supposedly expressing themselves respectively, in the first and and the second chapter of the said book. And how the ‘deity’ in the said last and third chapter, can lead us to the aim of the so called the Great Work, according to how Crowley in his New Commentaries to The Book of the Law III:1 “Abrahadabra; the reward of Ra Hoor Khut.”, describes this ‘deity’ as the rewarder of “Abrahadabra […] the formula of the Aeon, by which man may accomplish the Great Work.”June 14, 2017 at 2:22 am #99781
As for Crowley’s four visits to Egypt, the first happened after him returning from a (cirka one year) long visit to India and Ceylon (= Sri Lanka), the second happened before him returning to India, the third happened after him returing from India, and the fourth lasting a week, happende befor him returning to India again, for a (cirka half a year) long visit.
During his two long visits to India, Crowley traveled to the Himalayas.
The Hindu twin gods Nara-Narayana (twin-brother avatar of the God Vishnu on earth), were famous enough to have the opening verse of the Mahabharata dedicated to them. And they were reborn as two central characters in the Mahabharata, Arjuna and Krishna. (Symbolically, Nara-Narayana can represent the relationship between man and God, or God in every human being.) In the Swaminarayan sect (a subsect of Vaishnava Hinduism, whose founder Swaminarayan, also known as Sahajanand Swami (1781-1830), held that Vishnu and Shiva are different aspects of the same God), the twin gods Nara and Narayana, are called Nara-Narayana Deva. They are believed to reside in a main holy shrine in the Himalayas, the Badrinath temple (hot springs just below the temple with a year-round temperature of 55 °C (131 °F), are considered to be medicinal), and to be the prime controllers of the destiny of all beings, depending on their karma.
In Aleister Crowley’s 1938-preface to The Book of the Law, Aiwass, “the minister of Hoor-Paar-Kraat” (BOTL I:3), is described as “a messenger from the forces ruling this earth at present, as will be explained later on.”, and later on Heru-Ra-Ha (BOTL 3:35) is explained as “… a combination of twin gods, Ra-Hoor-Khuit and Hoor-Paar-Kraat (BOTL 3:35).”
The following youtube video depicts the Hindu twin gods Nara-Narayana, that according to the Swaminarayan sect, are the prime controllers of the destiny of all beings, depending on their karma: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9IqncKZAtg
June 14, 2017 at 9:24 am #99783
- This reply was modified 1 year, 8 months ago by wellreadwellbred.
The twin-brother avatar of the God Vishnu on earth, Nara-Narayana, is working for the preservation of dharma or righteousness, and in the concept of Nara-Narayana, the human soul Nara is the eternal companion of the Divine Narayana. In the Hindu epic Mahabharata, the warrior Arjuna and the God Krishna (an avatar of Vishnu), are identified with respectively Nara and Narayana (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nara-Narayana).
In the Mahabarata, a major hindu epic focusing on the power of the gods, the God Krishna is a warrior(/philosopher) serving as the charioteer for the warrior Arjuna, the chief hero of the Mahabarata.
In third and last chapter of The Book of the Law, Ra-Hoor-Khuit is described as “a god of War and of Vengeance (BOTL III:3).”, and as one “… half of the word of Heru-ra-ha, called Hoor-pa-kraat and Ra-Hoor-Khut (BOTL III:35).” The said chapter does also contain the following verse referring to twin warriors: “Hail! ye twin warriors about the pillars of the world! for your time is nigh at hand (BOTL III:71).”June 14, 2017 at 3:53 pm #99784
You are serial posting. Please knock it off. Get a Blog, please.June 14, 2017 at 9:41 pm #99790June 15, 2017 at 11:43 pm #99795
“That’s told yer!”
The strange thing is, there is already a thread created on this same “Thelema” board by herupakraath involving his ‘mundane’ personality of Timothy Moss, entitled “Squaring The Circle”, and to which wellread has himself contributed not more than five months ago & which has now just entered its fourth page.
Although occasaionally wandering off topic (as would appear to be fairly inevitable up to a point), was there really a need to create a totally new thread here which ostensibly on the face of it is covering exactly the same ground? If there was, I for one would very much like to read what it is. Oh, and I’d also be very interested to read some more posts by people who’re convinced they’re Aleister Crowley reincarnated again… That’s always good value, and — along with those deigning to give the rest of us mere mortals the benefits of their perspective from above & beyond the Abyss — invariably far more entertaining.
Save our bandwidth?”
June 16, 2017 at 1:01 pm #99797
- This reply was modified 1 year, 8 months ago by Jamie J Barter.
Jamie J Barter: “The strange thing is, there is already a thread created on this same “Thelema” board by herupakraath involving his ‘mundane’ personality of Timothy Moss, entitled “Squaring The Circle”, and to which wellread has himself contributed not more than five months ago & which has now just entered its fourth page. Although occasaionally wandering off topic (as would appear to be fairly inevitable up to a point), was there really a need to create a totally new thread here which ostensibly on the face of it is covering exactly the same ground?”
Timothy Moss/herupakraath started the other thread by presenting the following objective: “The objective in creating the document is to provide readers with tangible evidence that an intelligence with abilities and insights that exceed those of any human being is responsible for the authorship of the Book of the Law.”
My objective with this thread was presenting quotes from and comments to Moss/herupakraath’s “Squaring The Circle”. I don’t know how relevant the said quotes and comments are at present time, because Moss/herupakraath has since revised “Squaring The Circle” (source: https://www.lashtal.com/forums/topic/squaring-the-circle/page/3/#post-98466).
But the Summary and Conclusion of “Case of the Cairo Working”, another document by Moss/herupakraath avaiable in the downloadsection of this site, does also reflect the objective of providing “… readers with tangible evidence that an intelligence with abilities and insights that exceed those of any human being is responsible for the authorship of the Book of the Law.””: “the evidence suggests Crowey […] failed to recognize what are clearly adapted elements of the Egyptin religion contained within it, leaving little choice but to conclude that someone other than Crowley authored the text.”
My point is that Crowley did not fail to recognize “what are clearly adapted elements of the Egyptian religion contained within” The Book of the Law, because the said elements were not his main inspiration during the process of creating The Book of the Law, but they were necessary because he needed to ‘superimpose’ the said book upon an ancient Egyptian artefact which happened to have ‘superimposed’ upon it a number he strongly identified himself with (that is, Crowley nedded to make it appear that the said ancient artefact, was somehow linked to his new ‘unmatched’ currently applicable holy book for the whole world).
A more likely main source of inspiration during the process of creating The Book of the Law, are Crowley’s travels through India staying at ashrams and studying with Hindu gurus, during his visits to Sri Lanka and India from 1901 to 1905. A practical approach to liberation within Hinduism, is Karma yoga, which upholds the necessity of action. However, this action is to be undertaken without any attachment to the work or desire for results (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bhagavad_Gita). And this approach to liberation has resemblance with the following from Crowley’s The Book of the Law: “42. Let it be that state of manyhood bound and loathing. So with thy all; thou hast no right but to do thy will. 43. Do that, and no other shall say nay. 44. For pure will, unassuaged of purpose, delivered from the lust of result, is every way perfect (BOTL I:42-44.).”
More convincing evidence for the ancient Egyptian religion being the direct inspiration for Crowley during the process of creating The Book of the Law, would be if the core beliefs expressed in ancient Egyptian religious texts, could be demonstrated to have resemblance with the core beliefs expressed within the The Book of the Law.June 16, 2017 at 2:20 pm #99798
Anyone else not read “wellreadwelldred”‘s posts….June 16, 2017 at 5:24 pm #99799
@ptoner – It’s the curse of being the webmaster here, that I’m required to read all posts to ensure compliance with the Guidelines. Not always as simple a job as it sounds!June 16, 2017 at 11:09 pm #99800
“That’s told yer, twice!”
I get the feeling that you’re not likely to give up easily, even if this particular gateway manages to get “locked”… However, being so well, indefatigable (for which I have a sneaking admiration, in a little way) well, and before we all move on, can you possibly answer the following question (& here I challenge you to limit yourself to one sentence, without quoting anything?!), based on your previous contention:
“the evidence suggests Crowley […] failed to recognize what are clearly adapted elements of the Egyptian religion contained within it, leaving little choice but to conclude that someone other than Crowley authored the text.” My point is that Crowley did not fail to recognize “what are clearly adapted elements of the Egyptian religion contained within” The Book of the Law, because the said elements were not his main inspiration during the process of creating The Book of the Law, but they were necessary because he needed to […]
More convincing evidence for the ancient Egyptian religion being the direct inspiration for Crowley during the process of creating The Book of the Law […]
My question here is: whether or not you believe The Book of the Law to be a bogus albeit ‘inspired’ entity, i.e. a concoction deliberately and pre-meditatedly constructed by A.C. with the purpose of pulling off an unprecedented and unparalleled confidence trick, and that nobody else but he “authored the text”.
For the record, like — just so’s I can know where you sit, in relation to the fence
June 17, 2017 at 1:23 am #99802
- This reply was modified 1 year, 8 months ago by Jamie J Barter.
ptoner: Anyone else not read “wellreadwelldred”‘s posts….
I came upon a midnight clear … no, that’s not right … I came upon WRWB’s lengthy, rambling posts, seeing a serial rant reminiscent of an itinerant standing on a soap-box near a busy intersection.
I cried, “Foul!” but failed to actually read the posts.
WRWB displays in-depth intelligence at times, but has also been called (on one of these very threads) “The greatest troll of all time.” Perhaps it’s a case of refusing medication or over-indulgence in “strange drugs.”
Thanks to the Moderator and Sir Barter for getting into the depths of the monologue.June 17, 2017 at 10:49 am #99804
My answer to your question is yes, JJB.
As for core beliefs expressed in ancient Egyptian religious texts, resembling the core beliefs expressed within the The Book of the Law, this book was according to Crowley supposedly dictated to him by Aiwass, and written by hand on its ‘original manuscript’ which still exists. And to this ‘original text’ has been added (supposedly on the instruction of Aiwass), text from Crowley’s poetic rendering of the text on an ancient Egyptian artefact, an artefact which he appropriated and repurposed for his own purposes, the so called ‘The Stele of Revealing’ (actually the Stele of one Ankh-af-na-khonsu).
“For example, chapter 1, page 2, line 9 was written as “V.1. of Spell called the Song” and was replaced with: Above, the gemmèd azure is The naked splendour of Nuit; She bends in ecstasy to kiss The secret ardours of Hadit. The wingèd globe, the starry blue, Are mine, O Ankh-af-na-khonsu!” (source: https://www.revolvy.com/main/index.php?s=Liber%20AL%20vel%20Legis&item_type=topic)
“Chapter 3 […] includes large chunks inserted from Crowley’s paraphrase of The Stele of Revealing.” (source: https://www.revolvy.com/main/index.php?s=Liber%20AL%20vel%20Legis&item_type=topic)
As for the original text of The Book of the Law, that was supposedly dictated to Crowly by Aiwass, it expresses a core belief in reincarnation in the sense of your soul leaving the body and then returning in a different body: “36. My scribe Ankh-af-na-khonsu, the priest of the princes, shall not in one letter change this book; but lest there be folly, he shall comment thereupon by the wisdom of Ra-Hoor-Khuit (BOTL I:36).” This was an unknown belief in ancient Egyptian religious texts, from the time that the so called ‘The Stele of Revealing’ was made, because the core belief about life after death at that time was that a dead person could remain connected to the living world by an image of the person while alive, or a mummified body. But the expressed belief in reincarnation within The Book of the Law, was in line with Crowley’s need to make it appear that the Stele of Ankh-af-na-khonsu was somehow linked to him and the said book.
Also, Crowley during January 1904 in Colombo, Ceylon (Sri Lanka), wrote “Arm! Arm, and out; for the young warrior of a new religion is upon thee; and his number is the number of a man.” (Crowley identified himself with the “mark of the beast”, mentioned in the Book of Revelation in the Christian Bible (King James Bible: Revelation 13:18: “Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.”)), in his play title Why Jesus Wept. That is, there is a documented indication that Crowley already well before he visited Egypt in 1904, was relating the concept of “a new religion”, to the Stele of Ankh-af-na-khonsu (which already well before Crowley’s first visit to Egypt in 1902, happened to have the number 666 attached to it).June 19, 2017 at 12:46 am #99805
Thank you for your unequivocal and relatively concise answer there, well. Following on from it, I was just wondering whether you’d always held this bellef, as I seem to recall some of your older posts were a little more ambiguous wth respect to this position. Has your pespective therefore ever changed with regard to this? And, if so, how much influence is due to the central thesis put forward in Richard T Cole’s Liber Bogus, which initially seems to be very similar to your own stance?
As for the original text of The Book of the Law, that was supposedly dictated to Crowley by Aiwass, it expresses a core belief in reincarnation in the sense of your soul leaving the body and then returning in a different body. […] This was an unknown belief in ancient Egyptian religious texts, from the time that the so called ‘The Stele of Revealing’ was made,
Assuming that you’ve got your ‘Egyptological’ facts about it right (I don’t know enough about the subject & will leave it to someone else to possibly point out any error), how can you say such a belief was “unknown” when it may simply be that we (you?) don’t have that knowledge about it yet, in the sense that it might yet have to be discovered/ uncovered/ revealed?
because the core belief about life after death at that time was that a dead person could remain connected to the living world by an image of the person while alive
So are you saying that such an image would include that on the obverse of the (so called) Stele of Revealing Itself (the image where Ankh-af-na-khonsu is seen making an offering to Ra-Herakhuty)?
However your contention about the peculiar ‘prophecy’ of the Why Jesus Wept extract is not new, and has been made in several other places before. It’s also in Richard’s book.
N JoyJune 19, 2017 at 2:44 pm #99808
What is all this talk about “belief?”
“Let him credit NOTHING but that which lies in the realm of his own experience.”June 20, 2017 at 1:52 am #99809
“As a matter of fact, the stela symbolised the door leading to the private apartments of the dead, a door closed and sealed to the living. It was inscribed on door-posts and lintels, and its inscription was no mere epitaph for the information of future generations; all the details which it gave as to the name, rank, functions, and family of the deceased were intended to secure the continuity of his individuality and civil status in the life beyond death.”
Source: “Chapter III, section 1. Mastabas:”, “The Double and his Needs”, in Manual of Egyptian Archaeology: A Guide to the Studies of Antiquities in Egypt. For the use of students and travellers. By Gaston Maspero [1846-1916], Sir G. K.C.B., D.C.L. Oxon. Member of the Institute of France; Professor at the College De France; ex-Director general of Egyptin Museums. Translated by Amelia B. Edwards. New Edition, revised and enlarged by the author. With Three Hundred and Nine Illustrations. 1895. (https://archive.org/stream/manualofegyptian14400gut/14400.txt)
That the main or ultimate purpose of a stele, like for example the Stele of Ankh-ef-en-Khonsu, with “… all the details which it gave as to the name, rank, functions, and family of the deceased were intended to secure the continuity of his individuality and civil status in the life beyond death.”, was basic information easily available in Manual of Egyptian Archaeology: A Guide to the Studies of Antiquities in Egypt. For the use of students and travellers, authored by the French Egyptologist Sir Gaston Camille Charles Maspero (1846 – 1916), published in various editions, in English translation, well before Crowley’s four visits to Egypt from 1902 to 1905.
The just mentioned basic information about the main or ultimate purpose of a stele like the Stele of Ankh-ef-en-Khonsu, would also have been provided to Crowley during a discussion he had about it with the Egyptologist Émile Charles Albert Brugsch bey (1842 – 1930), according to the following description: “Brugsch Bey of the Boulak Museum dined with us once to discuss the Stele in his charge, and to arrange for its “abstruction (The Equinox of the Gods).””
My apparently more ambiguous older posts, reflects me being uncertain about if Crowley in The Book of the Law claims to be the reincarnation of Ankh-af-na-khonsu (BOTL I:36), just because he didn’t know better, being ignorant about the main purpose of a stele from the Ancient Egypt, due to him lacking access to relevant information.
The central thesis put forward in Richard T Cole’s Liber Bogus, has had little direct influence on my position expressed in this thread, but a larger indirect influence as an example of demonstrating inconsitensies in Crowley’s “The Equinox of the Gods-version” of the Cairo Working.
The main or ultimate purpose of a stele was to secure the continuity of the deceased’s individuality and civil status in the life beyond death, and this is different from believing in
reincarnation in the sense of your soul leaving the body and then returning in a different body. The two just mentioned beliefsystems would be two different beliefsystems, even if they existed at the same time.
“36. My scribe Ankh-af-na-khonsu, the priest of the princes, shall not in one letter change this book; but lest there be folly, he shall comment thereupon by the wisdom of Ra-Hoor-Khuit (BOTL I:36).” “10. Get the stele of revealing itself; set it in thy secret temple — and that temple is already aright disposed — & it shall be your Kiblah for ever. It shall not fade, but miraculous colour shall come back to it day after day. Close it in locked glass for a proof to the world (BOTL III:10).” “… The self-slain Ankh-af-na-khonsu Whose words are truth. I invoke, I greet … (BOTL III:37).” The core belief in Ancient Egypt about a Stele and life after death, was that all the details which it gave as to the name, rank, functions, and family of the deceased were intended to secure the continuity of his [or her] individuality and civil status in the life beyond death. And this was the ultimate purpose of the Stele of Ankh-af-na-khonsu.
That this ultimate purpose was profaned or desecrated by Crowley’s The Book of the Law (BOTL I:36), where Ankh-af-na-khonsu is appropriated and repurposed as an earlier life from which Crowley has reincarnated (an unknown concept in the Ancient Egypt where Ankh-af-na-khonsu lived), could actually be used as a main plot element in the next movie in Tom Cruise’s The Mummy franchise reboot released this year 2017 (remember that Ankh-ef-en-Khonsu was a priest of Montu, a falcon-god of war in Ancient Egyptian religion, that is, a god that it could be unwise to anger). In that case, Tom Cruise being a member of The Church of Scientology founded by L. Ron Hubbard who “… asserted that, due to his efforts, the headquarters [of Crowley’s OTO in the USA] was torn down, a girl rescued from the group, and the group ultimately destroyed (http://signaturebooks.com/excerpt-the-church-of-scientology/).”, Tom might expect some advise from his church concerning what to not include about Aleister Crowley and L. Ron Hubbard.)
In this thread I am actually mostly providing quotes from and comments to “Case of the Cairo Working”, another document by Timothy Moss/herupakraath available in the downloadsection of this site, and not from the document mentioned in the title of this thread, “My quotes from, & comment to, download Timothy Moss: Squaring The Circle”.
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