Home Forums Thelema Thelema “Trees of eternity” or “trees” of eternity?

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  • #109038

    dom
    Participant

    1:59. My incense is of resinous woods & gums; and there is no blood therein: because of my hair the trees of Eternity.

    “Trees of eternity” or “trees” of eternity i.e. the implication is that all trees are inherently of eternity (Her hair) or that what is being referred to is just a specific minority of trees “of resinous woods & gums” and it is only they that are of eternity?

    Over to you elitemachinery.

    Whilst we’re on the subject it looks like the physical earth is being referenced here and not some all encompassing “world” as in ‘universe’. If these trees are hair then they must protrude from the skin of The Queen of Space which must therefore be the layers of the Earth?

    The same heavenly body (the Earth) is also said to be Her “heart” 1:53 (that pumps cardiovascular sap (not blood))?

    • This topic was modified 3 months ago by  dom. Reason: grammar
    • This topic was modified 3 months ago by  dom.
    #109062

    Jamie J Barter
    Participant

    @dom :

    “Trees of eternity” or “trees” of eternity i.e. the implication is that all trees are inherently of eternity (Her hair) or that what is being referred to is just a specific minority of trees “of resinous woods & gums” and it is only they that are of eternity?
    I’m sure I’m not the only one not clear on what it is you’re asking here or in the title dom – care to rephrase?

    Over to you elitemachinery.
    Is there any reason why this should be turned over to elitemachinery, who has not appeared in this thread so far? Are you implying that he might somehow have some “inside track” information on this, in view of his putative claim (not so far rescinded, to my knowledge) to be a reincarnation of Aleister Crowley?

    Whilst we’re on the subject it looks like the physical earth is being referenced here and not some all encompassing “world” as in ‘universe’. If these trees are hair then they must protrude from the skin of The Queen of Space which must therefore be the layers of the Earth?
    Why do you think it refers to “the physical Earth”? If a metaphorical meaning is involved, the suggestion is of “Trees of Life” in the 4 Worlds extending into degrees of manifestation ad infinitum, or some conception such as Yggdrasil. What is the main characteristic, the USP about trees? – That they grow and proliferate, from the smallest point (bindu or acorn kernel).
    In addition, by your closing reference to the “heavenly body (the Earth)” and by your use of “skin” (where really you’re presumably referring to her “scalp”) if you’re actually adopting a literal reading here, consider how many planets there must be in the universe (probably far more than stars) and then why should Earth, out of all of those, be regarded as having been singled out to be the scalp of Nuit in particular? Is the implication that the planet is unique (or alone) in the universe?

    This must be one of the most curious & obscure verses in The Book of the Law, not least ‘because’ of its use of the word because to impart information, which is elsewhere (Chapter 2) decried as being “accursed” and condemned as a pit to perish in: it also seems like two separate verses conjoined together, where, if not, it’s difficult to see how & why the second part should then give rise to bloodless incense, of all things.

    Norma N Joy Conquest

    • This reply was modified 2 months, 4 weeks ago by  Jamie J Barter.
    • This reply was modified 2 months, 4 weeks ago by  Jamie J Barter. Reason: refine meaning; correct typos
    #109072

    dom
    Participant

    I’m sure I’m not the only one not clear on what it is you’re asking here or in the title dom – care to rephrase?

    Is Nuit saying that all trees are eternal by dint of them being trees or is there just a minority of special eternal trees unlike the rest of the trees?

    #109073

    pegasus
    Participant

    Gaia lives ….. you don’t need my commentary about every blade of grass is alive but saying that, for all the transmutations I have undergone, all I have learned has taught me one thing… I don’t know anything so instead of waffle may I please ask for help…

    #109095

    dom
    Participant

    Biological definitions of life, what it is and how it came about. Mineral and vegetable.

    #109099

    Jamie J Barter
    Participant

    “Trees of eternity” or “trees” of eternity i.e. the implication is that all trees are inherently of eternity (Her hair) or that what is being referred to is just a specific minority of trees “of resinous woods & gums” and it is only they that are of eternity?

    At present I’m inclined towards the second. though please don’t quote me.

    There is an alternative rendering/reading of “My incense is of resinous woods & gums; and there is no blood therein: because of my hair the trees of Eternity

    1) the trees of Eternity come about as a result of my hair or
    2) there is no blood as a result of my hair which consists of the trees of Eternity

    There is also a possibility that the Eternal proliferation of “trees” could refer to alternate timelines & alternative histories etc, within the space-time continuum (Nuit’s hairnet of indra as it were)

    Z Joy

    #109122

    dom
    Participant

    There is also a possibility that the Eternal proliferation of “trees” could refer to alternate timelines & alternative histories etc, within the space-time continuum (Nuit’s hairnet of indra as it were)

    …do you know of any other relevant references to flowers and fauna found anywhere else in AL?

    #109158

    Jamie J Barter
    Participant

    …do you know of any other relevant references to flowers and fauna found anywhere else in AL?

    “… and her soft feet not hurting the little flowers…” (I:26)

    David/ Dom could you now please adequately explain (i.e. without the need for further enquiry) why you think that “the physical Earth” is being referenced here in this verse in particular — as was asked in the earlier posts — as opposed to & excluding any other planet in the Universe?

    N Joy

    #109175

    dom
    Participant

    David/ Dom could you now please adequately explain (i.e. without the need for further enquiry) why you think that “the physical Earth” is being referenced here in this verse in particular — as was asked in the earlier posts — as opposed to & excluding any other planet in the Universe?

    Sorry Jamie I must’ve got side tracked. Is our Earth being referenced to in AL or was it for Klingons also? Well yeah the races of the Earth are specifically discussed; Jews, Mongols, Mohammedans. Can that specific passage about “not hurting the little flowers” refer to anywhere in the cosmos where there is fauna? Yeah I guess.

    #109179

    Jamie J Barter
    Participant

    Yes — yes… All very well, but not strictly relevant. Now concentrate please, david/dom: this is just you skating around the elephant on the thin ice… What I was asking, and what I’m trying to ask you, is why — in this case (I:59), you stated in the OP (Paragraph 3) that

    Whilst we’re on the subject it looks like the physical earth is being referenced here and not some all encompassing “world” as in ‘universe’. If these trees are hair then they must protrude from the skin of The Queen of Space which must therefore be the layers of the Earth?

    My specific point of enquiry was/is that in bold below:

    [B]y your closing reference to the “heavenly body (the Earth)” and by your use of “skin” (where really you’re presumably referring to her “scalp”) if you’re actually adopting a literal reading here, consider how many planets there must be in the universe (probably far more than stars) and then why should Earth, out of all of those, be regarded as having been singled out to be the scalp of Nuit in particular? Is the implication that the planet is unique (or alone) in the universe?

    The reason I’m asking is that there doesn’t seem to be anything in this particular verse (I:59) to suggest this at all – that Nuit’s scalp would be earth-bound, rather than wherever planet it is the Klingons come from. Why/ how would her hair be limited to growing out of one planet (Earth)?

    (Perhaps you can also see why now I was imploring for an adequate explanation previously – i.e., one not entailing the need for further enquiry),
    N Joy

    #109185

    dom
    Participant

    The implication was that the layers of any planets that support(ed) fauna are ‘scalps’ of Nuit yes. However you seem to be scalp-centric. There is body hair also.

    By the way Jamie thanks for turning the thread into a Pythonesque sketch lol

    • This reply was modified 2 months, 2 weeks ago by  dom.
    • This reply was modified 2 months, 2 weeks ago by  dom.
    • This reply was modified 2 months, 2 weeks ago by  dom.
    #109198

    wellreadwellbred
    Participant

    dom: “1:59. My incense is of resinous woods & gums; and there is no blood therein: because of my hair the trees of Eternity.

    “Trees of eternity” or “trees” of eternity i.e. the implication is that all trees are inherently of eternity (Her hair) or that what is being referred to is just a specific minority of trees “of resinous woods & gums” and it is only they that are of eternity? …”

    “… the clouds, which whirl as a development of her hair: “my hair the trees of Eternity”. (AL. I, 59).” (Source: Aleister Crowley explaining XVII. THE STAR in his Liber 78, The Book of Thoth – – – https://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/crowley/libro_thoth05.htm)

    #109199

    dom
    Participant

    the clouds, which whirl as a development of her hair:

    Thanks but that seems to take everything off on a tangent.

    #109206

    Jamie J Barter
    Participant

    @dom :

    By the way Jamie thanks for turning the thread into a Pythonesque sketch lol
    Strange as it might seem, my primary purpose in engaging with this thread was not Pythonesque ribaldry at all – it was intended pretty much as a straight enquiry! But since you appear to have shifted the grounds from the physical Earth being some sort of a unique planet in the cosmos to that of any planet capable of supporting the fauna required – including the home of those righteous Klingons – I have rather lost interest with it, nor do I believe it to make much sense put like that or be substantiated anywhere else.

    However you seem to be scalp-centric. There is body hair also.
    Scalp-centric — who, moi? Where else do you think masses of her hair are flaming well gonna come from then — or are you making a case out for the trees depending from either Nuit’s underarm hair or her pubes?

    Curiously yours
    N Joy

    #109217

    dom
    Participant

    But since you appear to have shifted the grounds from the physical Earth being some sort of a unique planet in the cosmos to that of any planet capable of supporting the fauna required – including the home of those righteous Klingons – I have rather lost interest with it, nor do I believe it to make much sense put like that or be substantiated anywhere else.

    That’s the beauty of a goddess isn’t it? She can be everywhere at once on all planets.

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